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xpress34
02-17-2009, 10:14 AM
I was watching and won an auction last night for a GU (?) Pujols Cardinals Hat that was signed and inscribed ROY-01' and with his #5.

I'm not sure about the GU part, but I was bidding on the item more as a RARE Pujols inscription as I have an excelelnt exemplar to compare it with - my Pujols AU ball w/ ROY-01' inscription.

I got the ball signed in-person at the start of the 2002 season when I worked for Nike in downtown Denver. Pujols ROY inscriptions are VERY few and far between (I've been looking since 2002 and have seen maybe 5 surface - NONE on Balls, all on equipment)

Anyway, I get an eMail from eBay today that the auction has been CANCELLED and REMOVED (for NO specific Reasons) and that I am under no obligation to purchase the item.

I pull the seller's ID up and guess what - the Contact Seller link is 'invalid' so I can't even write the Seller to see what the hell is up.

I want the item I won and don't know if eBay will respond to my inquiries. Any thoughts???

Thanks -

Chris

GarkoCollector
02-17-2009, 10:19 AM
Ebay is known to make errors like this, but they seem to be rare. If the item was pulled, it was probably proven to not be legit.

I have a Pujols signed ball and I asked for him to sign it 2001 NL ROY. It was signed early in 02 at a game in Pittsburgh. When I asked, he initially hesitated, but he also saw me let a bunch of kids go ahead of me to get autographs and I waited until they were done. I think he did it because of that, and that only.

I'd let this one go. It was most likely not legit and it was reported.

xpress34
02-17-2009, 10:22 AM
Garko -

Thanks for your input.

I just find it odd though that this would happen AFTER the auction had closed.

- Chris

xpress34
02-17-2009, 10:27 AM
Tom -

I forgot to add... I'd love to see a pic of your Pujols Ball... just because I have yet to see another ball with the inscription... one Power Seller 'supposedly' had one on the 'bay about two years ago, but could not supply a picture? He had a pic for all of his other 3,000 + items for sale, but mysteriously could not produce a picture of the ball and the inscription...

I'll post a pic of mine when I get home later...

All the best -

Chris

gingi79
02-17-2009, 10:35 AM
I'm a huge fan of late NYC artist Keith Haring. I purchased on ebay an original signed pencil drawing of his and was beyond thrilled as I never thought I would be able to afford one. The seller had an eBay store with several pieces of similar artists and very high transaction numbers at 100% so I felt that it was most likely legit. A day later, I was getting ready to pay via Paypal and when I went to the auction, it was gone. I checked my email and received the same email xpress did.

I had spoken to the seller via email about the piece before bidding and when I asked him what the deal was, he told me he had been suspened by eBay for Shill bidding. I was the only bidder on my item and we almost completed the deal until he refused to take PayPal anymore. When you couple the absence of any recourse with the fact I "won" the item at 10x less it's value if real, I decided to pass.

I believe that most of the time, "If it's too good to be true, it probably isn't real"

b.heagy
02-17-2009, 10:41 AM
The seller may have "borrowed" an image from someone else who had the actual item and was reported. Just a thought........

xpress34
02-17-2009, 11:31 AM
Actually, I was able to send a response to the seller and he actually responded very quickly.

He says eBay pulled several of his auctions and he is currently trying to find out why.

He's not a power seller, but he does have almost 1,500 feedback (not private either) with 100% positive.

He seems to be on the up and up, so I will wait and see and let you all know.

I had a similar issue happen to me when I use to sell on the 'Bay and what I finally found out from eBay was that without consulting me, someone who was the 2nd highest bidder on an auction reported my auction as a fake without cause or proof. It wasn't a fake - it was a Bobby Estalella Rox GU jersey that Bobby gave me personally and signed and took photos and all when I was still with Nike... apparently (no proof) the 2nd highest bidder was mad because they got sniped and thought it was shill bidding or something.

I'll keep you all posted on where this goes.

- Chris

earlywynnfan
02-17-2009, 11:55 AM
I once had listed a couple dozen items on ebay, only to have them pulled -- some had just closed -- because I had put "always willing to trade for Negro League autos" on the bottom. Since ebay has a "no-trade" rule, I was stopped. The problem then becomes, when I posted them again, everyone was suspect.

Ken
earlywynnfan5@hotmail.com

trsent
02-17-2009, 01:06 PM
If someone pays to have a PSA/DNA Quick Opinion on an item, and PSA/DNA finds the autograph suspect or if someone reports the autograph suspect and eBay decides to make the seller have the item certified before listing it, they may pull the listing after it ended.

This is very common for them to do with an item such as an Albert Pujols autograph that has not been certified prior to listing.

xpress34
02-17-2009, 02:12 PM
If someone pays to have a PSA/DNA Quick Opinion on an item, and PSA/DNA finds the autograph suspect or if someone reports the autograph suspect and eBay decides to make the seller have the item certified before listing it, they may pull the listing after it ended.

This is very common for them to do with an item such as an Albert Pujols autograph that has not been certified prior to listing.

Joel -

Just home for lunch for a minute... rcvd another message from the seller, and that is what happened. Funny thing is, his auto matches mine that I got 1st hand - and I've sent mine to PSA/DNA before and because they had never seen a ROY inscribed Pujols auto, it came back as 'unable to determine'...

Like I said before, I'm not buying the hat based on it being GU or Not, I am interested in it due to the scarcity of Pujols ROY inscribed items period.

What's funny is I've had friends with other 'early' Pujols autos sent back from PSA/DNA as well NOT certified because it doesn't match their exemplars...and we all know how much they like to claim that sigs don't change... Pujols used a very pointed 'A' in Albert his 1st few years, unlike the rounded 'A' he uses now...

I will add pictures when I get how of my ROY ball and another GU ball he signed for me in 2006 and you can see the difference in his sig in just 5 years...

- Chris

David
02-17-2009, 02:46 PM
If eBay cancelled the action and removed the seller, you probably shouldn't try and purchase the item from the seller. There are a variety of reasons a lot is pulled and seller banned, including selling forgeries, stealing money, not paying bills, breaking important rules-- all reasons you should hesitate at sending money if he is a total stranger.

If there was a problem with one lot-- ala unlicensed product or forged autograph--, eBay would just pull the one lot and give a warning. If eBay bans the seller, there is a problem bigger than one lot.

stitzerfse
02-17-2009, 05:32 PM
Were you aware that Upper Deck is now selling Pujols balls with the ROY 01 inscription? Quite a few different inscriptions are actually available through them, now, though the prices are a bit steep.


Doug

xpress34
02-17-2009, 10:09 PM
Well, the seller contacted me again and is being very transparent on the deal. He is sending me the hat at his risk for me to examine and if I decide I don't want it, all I am out is postage and insurance to mail it back to him.

If I decide it is good and I want to buy it, I can pay him AFTER I have had a chance to examine it in person.

I will let you all know how it turns out and post pics once the hat comes in for your opinions.

- Chris

xpress34
02-17-2009, 11:56 PM
Alright, here's some pics...

1st two CERT Autos from 2002 - notice the Pointy 'A' s in Albert:

Absolute Playoff Memorabilia Signing Bonus:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsAutos1.jpg

2002 Fleer Sweet Sigs:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsAutos2.jpg

Now, here is my Pujols ROY Auto and Inscribed ball that I got In Person in 2002 while working for Nike:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsAutos4.jpg

And here is his sig from 2006 when he signed a GU ball (side panel) for me at the team hotel in Denver:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsAutos3.jpg

Notice how his ' A' became much rounder at the top... you'll see that alot in his current CERT AU issues in card sets as well.

And since the topic was brought up that he now signs ROY 01 for UDA, here is a pic of what that auto looks like...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/pujolsudaauto.jpg

Looks nothing like his actual 1st or 2nd year auto... just a 'modern' or 'current' auto with the ROY 01 inscription...

- Chris

gameused
02-18-2009, 01:39 AM
Chris,

I have a photo matched Albert Pujols 2002 Old Hickory ROY inscribed bat with the pointed A. His early auto's have the pointed A. The bat was signed on 1-31-03

Bobby

xpress34
02-18-2009, 01:54 AM
Chris,

I have a photo matched Albert Pujols 2002 Old Hickory ROY inscribed bat with the pointed A. His early auto's have the pointed A. The bat was signed on 1-31-03

Bobby

Bobby -

Thanks for the pics... I would like all of them I can get to compare with this hat when it comes along with those in my personal collection...

- Chris

xpress34
02-20-2009, 09:25 PM
The guy sent me the hat and it arrived today for me to inspect - I have a week to decide what I want to do...

I'll post pictures in a couple of hours when I get back home.

- Chris

xpress34
02-21-2009, 01:34 PM
Alright... here are pics of the Hat with my ROY Ball and Bobby's ROY Bat for comparison...

Thoughts???

My Ball:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/Memorabilia/Balls/PujolsAutos4.jpg

Bobby's Bat:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsBatAU.jpg

The hat:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsHat4.jpg

The Hat next to my Ball:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsHat2.jpghttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsHat3.jpg

Love to hear any thought or opinions... also would love to see any other EARLY Pujols Autos - especially if you were lucky enough to get a ROY inscription...

- Chris

cigarman44
02-21-2009, 02:13 PM
Alright... here are pics of the Hat with my ROY Ball and Bobby's ROY Bat for comparison...

Thoughts???

My Ball:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/Memorabilia/Balls/PujolsAutos4.jpg

Bobby's Bat:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsBatAU.jpg

The hat:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsHat4.jpg

The Hat next to my Ball:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsHat2.jpghttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v738/xpress34/PujolsHat3.jpg

Love to hear any thought or opinions... also would love to see any other EARLY Pujols Autos - especially if you were lucky enough to get a ROY inscription...

- Chris

Auto and script look pretty good to me

bigtruck260
02-21-2009, 03:32 PM
First - Bobby, DUDE! That bat is seriously sick. One of the best I have ever seen....and I am jealous.

I agree with Joe (Cigarman) that the sig and inscription looks good, even though it is one of my least favorite autographs scripts. I have had 3 just like it (1 was in-person) and all were rejected by PSA. As a matter of fact, of the 5 Pujols sigs I sent them, NONE came back good. Considering that one of them was purchased from the Cardinals wives for a charity day at the ballpark, I was miffed.

Big Al was in the habit of changing things around back in the 02-04 period. It was about that time he started using one of the ugliest ball-park sigs out there...even for little kids sometimes.

He's a great guy, but VERY tough when it comes to his memorabilia - and rightfully so...he's one of the most forged/faked athletes around. I was always more into the way Ripken did things - he signed for EVERYONE and because of it, you rarely see Ripken fakes (though eBay usually has a few a month)...and his sig still retains some value.

Anyway, back to the hat - I have seen this exact same sig on things before...and all I can tell you as a Cards guy is...go with your gut, and don't overspend. When looking for Pujols merch, I tend to take the high road - the road that leads to Upper Deck, Steiner, Tri-Star and Cardinals Care - and no-doubt JSA sigs (because even some of those I question)...but that's just me.

xpress34
02-21-2009, 07:47 PM
Dave and Joe -

Thanks for the input. As far as PSA, I had the same issue when I sent my ball to them. Came back as 'unable to authenticate' or some crap like that.

I got the auto personally outside the back door of Niketown Denver at the Denver Pavillions in 2002.

I thought the scripts matched pretty well too - I just wanted some other opinions...

A couple of things I do know are there aren't many early ROY Pujols autos out there, so the '-' between ROY and 01' was a good mark as well as the slight curve at the bottom of the 'y' in Roy. Also, most of the fakes I seen tend to not put the '.' betwwen A and Pujols...

The seller was told that it's a GU hat - I'm not buying it on that premise - I'm buying solely as an AUTO Hat... and I think it's a pretty good deal at right around $215 w/ shipping. What do you guys think?

- Chris

kwitzel
02-22-2009, 12:25 AM
I obtained this non gamed used bat a couple of years ago. It is one of my favorite items in my collection.

http://webpages.charter.net/karl.witzel/2001%20C271.jpg

Thank you,

Karl

bigtruck260
02-22-2009, 02:26 AM
Dave and Joe -

Thanks for the input. As far as PSA, I had the same issue when I sent my ball to them. Came back as 'unable to authenticate' or some crap like that.

I got the auto personally outside the back door of Niketown Denver at the Denver Pavillions in 2002.

I thought the scripts matched pretty well too - I just wanted some other opinions...

A couple of things I do know are there aren't many early ROY Pujols autos out there, so the '-' between ROY and 01' was a good mark as well as the slight curve at the bottom of the 'y' in Roy. Also, most of the fakes I seen tend to not put the '.' betwwen A and Pujols...

The seller was told that it's a GU hat - I'm not buying it on that premise - I'm buying solely as an AUTO Hat... and I think it's a pretty good deal at right around $215 w/ shipping. What do you guys think?

- Chris


I think $200-$250 is the correct price for a good Pujols sig on a ball, hat or 16x20. Bats are far more expensive because of the rarity - jerseys too.
You could expect to pay around $800 for an unused signed, and game-issued bat. UD has one for that price - though it is an older model SAM bat. UD sells a jersey for $1200, but dealers sell them on eBay cheaper.

The thing is, UD sigs that don't fade have almost always retained value if it's a high dollar item. Just look at the Mantle signed products that they sold in the 1990's. People see that UD hologram and know it's far and away the real deal.

I've seen JSA and PSA balls sell in the $150-$300 range (offical MLB balls). There have been several hats like yours (sans the inscription and GAME USED) that have been sold for $200-$500 in the past few years. Game used is certainly more desirable, so if yours has the correct characteristics - you might have a gem coming to you. Even if it's not a gamer, it's got some value...unless, of course the sizing is all wrong, and it has a little kid's name under the brim.

Hope it all works out for you. I think it will.

gameused
02-22-2009, 03:36 AM
First - Bobby, DUDE! That bat is seriously sick. One of the best I have ever seen....and I am jealous.

I agree with Joe (Cigarman) that the sig and inscription looks good, even though it is one of my least favorite autographs scripts. I have had 3 just like it (1 was in-person) and all were rejected by PSA. As a matter of fact, of the 5 Pujols sigs I sent them, NONE came back good. Considering that one of them was purchased from the Cardinals wives for a charity day at the ballpark, I was miffed.

Big Al was in the habit of changing things around back in the 02-04 period. It was about that time he started using one of the ugliest ball-park sigs out there...even for little kids sometimes.

He's a great guy, but VERY tough when it comes to his memorabilia - and rightfully so...he's one of the most forged/faked athletes around. I was always more into the way Ripken did things - he signed for EVERYONE and because of it, you rarely see Ripken fakes (though eBay usually has a few a month)...and his sig still retains some value.

Anyway, back to the hat - I have seen this exact same sig on things before...and all I can tell you as a Cards guy is...go with your gut, and don't overspend. When looking for Pujols merch, I tend to take the high road - the road that leads to Upper Deck, Steiner, Tri-Star and Cardinals Care - and no-doubt JSA sigs (because even some of those I question)...but that's just me.

Dave,

Thanks! It's a early Pujols bat and when I spoke to the owner of Old Hickory several years ago, he told me only two of these two tone color combo bats were sent to Pujols for him to try in 2002, I guess the handle was too thick so he shaved it down. Besides the card match, I have a getty image photo match of the top of the cupped barrel, with his number 5 written in silver.

Chris,

The auto on the hat looks good, nice pick up!

Bobby

Instanton
02-22-2009, 11:14 PM
xpress34: is it possible you can forward me an email at Josenemsn13579@msn.com? I have a few inquires on Rockies GU (of recent years (05-09). Thank you.

- Jose.

xpress34
02-22-2009, 11:33 PM
xpress34: is it possible you can forward me an email at Josenemsn13579@msn.com? I have a few inquires on Rockies GU (of recent years (05-09). Thank you.

- Jose.

Jose -

eMail sent.

- Chris