Modern Backlash?

[Eric]

It's interesting to me to see some of the prices in last night's Grey Flannel auction. Many modern items ended with fairly low numbers.

Is the market flooded? Perhaps. Is it too hard to authenticate newer things? Are we seeing a shift? What do you think?

Check it out:

Circa 1997 Mike Piazza LA Dodgers Game-Used Catchers Mitt
Lot # 127 $644

1999 Ken Griffey, Jr. Seattle Mariners Game-Used & Autographed Alternate Jersey (JSA)
Lot # 383 $806

2000 Rickey Henderson Seattle Mariners Game-Used Alternate Jersey
Lot # 384 $625

2002 Jim Thome Cleveland Indians Game-Used Alternate Jersey (Team Letter)
Lot # 392 $660

2005 Miguel Tejada Baltimore Orioles Game-Used Home Jersey
Lot # 400 $550

Circa 2003 Carlos Beltran Kansas City Royals Game-Used Road Jersey
Lot # 408 $250

2003 Justin Morneau Minnesota Twins Game-Used Road Rookie Season Jersey
Lot # 416 $325

2004 Joe Crede Chicago White Sox Game-Used Home Jersey (Team Bought)
Lot # 421 $590

2005 Jose Contreras Chicago White Sox Game-Used Home Jersey (Championship Season) (Team Bought)
Lot # 423 $444

2005 Curt Schilling Boston Red Sox Game-Used Road Jersey
Lot # 432 $750

2004 John Smoltz Atlanta Braves Game-Used Road Jersey
Lot # 443 $530

2004 Chipper Jones Atlanta Braves Game-Used Home Jersey
Lot # 446 $550

2001 Josh Beckett Florida Marlins Game-Used Home Rookie Season Jersey (Post 9/11)
Lot # 468 $460

2003 Dontrelle Willis Florida Marlins Game-Used Home Rookie Season Jersey
Lot # 470 $600

Early 2000s Mike Piazza New York Mets Game-Used Turn-Back-The-Clock Home Jersey
Lot # 477 $726

2005 Carlos Beltran New York Mets Game-Used Alternate Jersey
Lot # 479 $644

2000 Tony Gwynn San Diego Padres Game-Used Home Jersey
Lot # 483 $536

Circa 2004 Todd Helton Colorado Rockies Game-Used Alternate Jersey
Lot # 489 $570

2000 Ken Griffey Jr. Cincinnati Reds Game-Used Home Jersey
Lot # 492 $785

1996 Mike Piazza Los Angeles Dodgers Game-Used Home Jersey
Lot # 499 $887

Circa 2000 Michael Vick Virginia Tech Game-Used Burgundy Jersey
Lot # 565 $750

2003 Brian Urlacher Chicago Bears Game-Used & Autographed White Jersey (JSA)
Lot # 571 $733

2004 John Lynch Denver Broncos Game-Used Blue Jersey
Lot # 576 $443

2000 Zach Thomas Miami Dolphins Game-Used White Jersey
Lot # 593 $620

2005 Alex Smith San Francisco 49ers Game-Used White Jersey (Rookie Season)
Lot # 600 $591

2001 Amani Toomer New York Giants Game-Used Blue Jersey
Lot # 603 $333

2005 Michael Strahan New York Giants Game-Used White Mesh Jersey
Lot # 607 $649

2004 Reggie Williams Jacksonville Jaguars Game-Used Black Jersey (Rookie Year)
Lot # 608 $300

2002 Chad Pennington New York Jets Game-Used White Jersey
Lot # 614 $555

2002 Vinny Testaverde New York Jets Game-Used Green Jersey
Lot # 615 $366

2004 David Carr Houston Texans Game-Used Blue Jersey
Lot # 640 $439

2004 Steve McNair Tennessee Titans Game-Used Blue Jersey
Lot # 641 $500

2004-05 Paul Pierce Boston Celtics Game-Used Home Jersey
Lot # 736 $671

1998-99 Shaquille O'Neal Los Angeles Lakers Game-Used Road Jersey & Shorts (2)
Lot # 758 $977

2003-04 Karl Malone Los Angeles Lakers Game-Used Alternate Jersey
Lot # 759 $500

1993-94 Shaquille O'Neal Orlando Magic Game-Used Home Jersey & Shorts (2)
Lot # 763 $605

[suave1477]

Re: Modern Backlash?

No shift at all thats pretty normal prices for Grey Flannel, I noticed from past auctions of Grey Flannel it seems that more of a Vintage Collector or Super Star collector following so those people are going for the Premium Items instead of the more common players of Today.

I was surprised you added to your list Mike Piazza Catchers Mitt - I was surprised it went that high!!!

[Eric]

Re: Modern Backlash?

Piazza is considered by many to be the best hitting catcher of all time.

That's why he made the list.
Eric

[skipcareyisfat]

Re: Modern Backlash?

Can anyone legitimately claim that any of that stuff litsted is rare or one-of-a-kind? I'd say no. Even if I wanted any of it but somehow missed out on the auction, I don't think I'd have much trouble finding similar pieces elsewhere that are available right now. Seriously, when was the last time you DIDN'T see a Chipper, Andruw, Maddux, Glavine or Smoltz Braves jersey for sale?

-Jason

[suave1477]

Re: Modern Backlash?

I dont know his Stats off hand but if you say that is true Ill beleive you, but at the same time I don't know many truly big Piazza fans. Just my opinion!!!

Piazza was a favorite of the Dodgers and Mets fans for a while until rumor got out that some times he swings his bat the other way lmao lmao

[byergo]

Re: Modern Backlash?

Game used items of current players are the "1988 Topps" of the game used marketplace. Common as hell, and more items produced on literally a daily basis. Todays players may use cleats, bat, hat, jersey, batting gloves for only one game or even one at bat. Supply and demand must force prices down big time, as there is a limited number of collectors and vastly too many gamers created for us to absorb.

If you fancy yourself as an "investor" in these items stick with truly rare vintage items (same as baseball cards--don't buy the 1988 Topps!). Also stick to sure bets for the Hall of Fame, no commons; and items used with the team most people associate with that player (see the low price realized on the Hank Aaron Brewers jersey late in his career when he was washed up and it's the "wrong" team).

[suave1477]

Re: Modern Backlash?

Byergo whats the wrong team? Thats the team he was with!!

As far as your statement before that I agree to Disagree with you. What your saying is correct but the items would normally still sell for higher then it did on Grey Flannel. Some of those items would have sold for a lot more on ebay. You have to realize ebay you have millions of watchers and Grey Flannel might have a thousand. Plus the thousand you have watching Grey Flannel have a particular interest which as I said most are looking for Vintage items and Premium Stars.

[skipcareyisfat]

Re: Modern Backlash?

Also stick to sure bets for the Hall of Fame, no commons; and items used with the team most people associate with that player (see the low price realized on the Hank Aaron Brewers jersey late in his career when he was washed up and it's the "wrong" team).

What defines a sure bet HOFer these days? You could argue that despite big numbers, Palmeiro, McGwire, Sosa, Pudge Rodriquez, etc. are no longer locks. Then you have some guys who completely break down after years and years of putting up huge numbers - look at Chipper Jones, Juan Gonzalez, Bagwell and Frank Thomas. Good luck getting top dollar for those guys. Kudos to anyone who's been collecting Biggio stuff. Who would've thought he'd end up with 3,000 hits?

As Brewers Aaron jerseys, they really don't seem that rare to me either. Could be part of it.

[suave1477]

Re: Modern Backlash?

Skipcarey, just to add to your list I don't know his stats off hand but they were saying on TV last night that Mike Mussina has hall of Fame numbers and would be a likely candidate.

[suave1477]

Re: Modern Backlash?

Also Mariano Rivera hes a sure thing to get into the hall is only just about the best closer this era if not history. And his items go for Top Dollar.

[Birdbats]

Re: Modern Backlash?

Eric,

Personally, I won't bid on most new stuff (well, jerseys) just because I assume it's probably fake. I know that's cynical, but it's just too easy for some people to doctor these things. I've seen too many bad jerseys of current players, stars especially.

I'm also much less trusting of the auctioneers and authentication services. The more I learn about bats and jerseys, the less they seem to know. Stuff that I once would have purchased in good faith now gets ignored because I see things that just don't look right.

There was a time when I might have looked at a 2004 Pujols world series jersey and decided I was going to have it at any cost. Now I look at it and ask, "If they only played two home games, and the Cardinals are extremely stingy releasing Pujols items, and Pujols keeps many items for himself to auction through his foundation, and there is no letter from the Cardinals or the PFF, and Pujols switched to size 50 (not 48) in late 2005 -- what are the odds of this being legit?"

I'm sure supply and demand has something to do with it. The whole issue of cheating (steroids) also affects values of some players in particular. But for me, I'm overly cautious when it comes to current stars because dishonest people have ruined it for me.

On the other hand, I have no problem paying good prices for items that come directly from the team.

Jeff

http://www.birdbats.com

[mr.miracle]

Re: Modern Backlash?

Mussina just won his 230th career game last night. He has however never won a Cy Young, and never won 20 games in a season. If he is to make the HOF he will need 300 wins period. See Bert Blyleven, Jack Morris, and a whole host of other guys with 250-290 wins that just are not getting an HOF snif. Mussina is 37 so he would need to average about 17 wins a season over the next 4 to get in. Can he do it? If Jamie Moyer can get people out at age 43 Mussina should be able to.