The Yankees, baseball and money

[cjclong]

I see post after post about the Yankees "buying" the World Series. In regards to this several things.
First, baseball doesn't set a salary cap. The Yankees are allowed to spend. So there is no cheating involved which is sometimes sort of implied.
Second, there is no question being able to spend is an advantage, but not an insurmountable one and not a guarantee of winning. The Yankees had not won a world series since 2000 and missed the playoffs last year. They paid out a lot of money for pitchers and other players who were busts. The Texas Rangers had a payroll similar to the Yankees a few years ago with ARod and Chan Ho Park and went nowhere. In the fact the Rangers where the first team to pay a player over $20 million a year.
Third, people imply the Yankee have always out spent other teams. In fact, most of the Yankee Championships came in the 1920's, 30's, 40's,50's until 1965. There were no free agents then and clubs signed players cheaply and tired to keep salaries down. Joe DiMaggio was offered a cut in salary after his 56 game hitting streak. The Yankees won because they scouted and signed players like DiMaggio, Berra, Mantle, Ford, etc. Other teams could have had these players but didn't. The first Yankee Championship in 96 did not come with high salaried players. And the "core 4" of this years team, Jeter, Rivera, Posoda, and Pettite were not expensive free agents but came from good scouting.
If Baseball wants a salary cap they can have one. Until then the Yankees are playing within the rules. I don't hear Dodger fans whining about how much Ramirez is paid or Boston fans gripping about their payroll. If either of those teams had won the World Series this year you would not have heard how they "bought" the series.
The Yankees were a successful team before expensive free agents and they would still be successful if there was a salary cap. Face it, while some players do not want to live in New York there are a lot more more that would go there rather than Kansas City, Pittsburgh, etc.
Again, while there is some truth that money gives the Yankees an advantage the Yankee haters use it as an excuse to down grade the accomplishment of winning.

[suave1477]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

cjclong well said!!!

[ironmanfan]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

what gets me is that the Yankees payroll is $80 million dollars HIGHER than the next team in line (Red Sox I think).

[BULBUS]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

what gets me is that the Yankees payroll is $80 million dollars HIGHER than the next team in line (Red Sox I think).

Their payroll in 2009 was 50M more than the Mets, 65M more than the Cubs, 80M more than the Red Sox, and about 85M more than the Phillies, Tigers, and Angels.

Just proves that money doesn't always buy Championships.

[ironmanfan]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

You are right, it doesn't guarantee anything, but there is just something wrong the system that allows that to happen.........

[kingjammy24]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

i don't think there is anything 'unfair' about the yankees having the revenue that they have. ultimately it's come from the fans so the yankees have earned it. however, there are a few fallacies here.

"The Texas Rangers had a payroll similar to the Yankees a few years ago with ARod and Chan Ho Park.. "

during the years that arod and park played together, the closest the rangers ever came to the yankees payroll was 2003. yankees - $169mm, rangers - $103mm. a $66mm difference is hardly "similar".

"Third, people imply the Yankee have always out spent other teams. In fact, most of the Yankee Championships came in the 1920's, 30's, 40's,50's until 1965. There were no free agents then and clubs signed players cheaply and tired to keep salaries down"

in 1913, the highest paid player was the yankees' frank chance.
in 1927, the highest paid player was babe ruth.
in 1929, the yankees payroll was $365k and the highest in the majors. the closest team was the cubs at $310k.
in 1933, the yankees again had the highest payroll at $294. the closest team was again the cubs at $266k.
in 1939, the yankees again had the highest payroll at $361k. the closest team was the tigers at $297.
in 1943, the yankees again had the highest payroll at $301k. the closest team were the dodgers at $271k.
in 1949, the highest paid player was dimaggio at $100k.
in 1950, the yankees again had the highest payroll at $651k.
in 1951, the highest paid player is joe dimaggio at $90k.
in 1956, the highest payroll in the majors was the yankees again at $492k.
in 1961, mickey mantle became the highest paid player at $75k.

you think ruth, dimaggio and mantle came "cheaply"? maybe in their rookie year.

winning a WS with an all-star team and the highest payroll in baseball doesn't strike me as a testament to accomplishment. the fact that the yankees didn't do it since 2000 strikes me as an testament to mismanagement and failure. only cashman could blow over $200mm on 4 players (pavano, igawa, giambi, brown) and still have a job and enough money leftover to buy even more superstars. to win a WS other teams have to overachieve. the yankees simply have to not screw up; to get out of their own way.



rudy.

[sox83cubs84]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

I admit, if you're a Royals fan or a Pirates booster, it must be frustrating seeing the Yankees spend more on one superstar contract than your team does on it's entire everyday lineup. To me, though, IMHO, a lot of the anti-spending fervor is based upon whether or not the complaining fan's team is a big spender or not. Face it...most fans decry the Yankees almost unlimited pockets, but, would they be so quick to criticize the spending if it was their team? Probably not. And, as some have pointed out, big spending helps, but isn't a guarantee...witness perennial contenders such as the Twins in the 2000s, the A's a few years ago, or the 2007 Rockies. They all had success (not a World Championship, but strong showings, nonetheless) on limited budgets. Whatever the case, if the rules that exist aren't being broken, it's annoying perhaps, but it's also something most fans would have no problem with if it was their team that had the money trees.

Dave M.
Chicago area

[kingjammy24]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

dave, i agree. i think the yankees have earned their revenue and i think they should be spending it on the best players available. that's what every team would and should do. i don't think there's anything 'wrong' with any of that. if i were the yankees i'd be pursuing the best players i could buy as well.

all of that said, i'm just personally not impressed when the yankees win because of the huge disparity in payrolls. everyone agrees that a large payroll isn't a guarantee of anything, which is true. the reason it isn't is because even with all the money in the world, you can still be stupid enough to blow it all, which is what the yankees did for most the last 8 yrs. other teams didn't beat the yankees. the yankees beat themselves. cashman had a bottomless wallet at his disposal and still couldn't deliver. i'd like to see how many WS appearances a real GM like sandy alderson or pat gillick would've managed with those yankee payrolls. cashman's savvy M.O. seems to be entirely relegated to picking up the biggest superstars and then praying it all works out. where are the smart trades? the sleepers who surprised everyone? the sharp eye for underrated players and rookies? cashman just waits to see who the biggest free agent is and snaps him up. i have a lot of respect for the A's who've done a hell of a job for decades with small-market budgets. they've been forced to rely on skill because they didn't have much money. cashman doesn't need skill. he just asks george to open up the wallet every time a $20mm/yr player comes on the market.

rudy.

[5kRunner]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

Funny thing about that Simpsons pic. Only Ozzie, Griffey, and Scioscia(?) are the only Non-Yankees. The others all played for the Yankees at one time. LOL.

[gingi79]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

I think people feel the Yankees won the World Series because unlike other teams, they don't have to make it work with their own home grown players. The Braves won all their East titles with the Minor League System and continue to do so. However, no team can be competitive that way now and I think people blame the Yankees (unfairly) for it.

When the Yanks have the need to, they have the opportunity to upgrade a position. Lets take 1st base for example, they had Mattingly for 11 years and when he retired in 1995, they went out and paid money for the best free agent. Tino Martinez was picked up from the Mariners after he killed the Yanks in the early 90's. Ditto Giambi. Teixeira was the best Free Agent 1st baseman, is young a extremely talented and now they don't need to look for a 1st baseman for like the next 7 years. Everyone needs pitching and the best Free agent pitchers just seem to pick the Yanks the Sox or the money (Mets for example).

However, they may get panged for buying players but they should then get credit for the other side as well. Getting Paul O'Neil was just great scouting. Derek Jeter, Mariano Rivera, Robby Cano, Andy Petite, Jorge Posada were all groomed through the Yanks Minors. It just seems that the majority of Yankees players proved themselves elsewhere and came to NY for the Money. And lets not forget Goose and Reggie were the innovators of that in the 70's. They ran to the biggest paycheck rather than staying with their homegrown teams like players had done for the 80 years before.

My last comment is on the Dynasty years of the Yanks, i.e. the 20's to the 70's. The Yankees were a vicious circle ever since Murders Row. The best players wanted to play for the best team which made them the best team because the best players chose to play for them. It wasn't about money, it was about wanting to play for the Yankees because it seemed that all the best players played for them. There was no draft, no free agency. If you were really talented, you could just sign with whoever you want. Why play in Kansas City for the struggling A's and a bunch of nobody's when you could bat after Mantle, Maris, DiMaggio, RUTH, Gehrig etc? Essentially, the Draft, Free Agency, ideas for revenue sharing and evening out the talent pool just seems to be all due to the actions of the New York Yankees.

However, I'm just a bitter Braves fan who feels cheated by the Yankees and Mets (specifically the 2000 season) so while my opinions are valid I'd admit I realize I am somewhat biased.

[joelsabi]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

My last comment is on the Dynasty years of the Yanks, i.e. the 20's to the 70's. The Yankees were a vicious circle ever since Murders Row. The best players wanted to play for the best team which made them the best team because the best players chose to play for them. It wasn't about money, it was about wanting to play for the Yankees because it seemed that all the best players played for them. There was no draft, no free agency. If you were really talented, you could just sign with whoever you want. Why play in Kansas City for the struggling A's and a bunch of nobody's when you could bat after Mantle, Maris, DiMaggio, RUTH, Gehrig etc? Essentially, the Draft, Free Agency, ideas for revenue sharing and evening out the talent pool just seems to be all due to the actions of the New York Yankees.

However, I'm just a bitter Braves fan who feels cheated by the Yankees and Mets (specifically the 2000 season) so while my opinions are valid I'd admit I realize I am somewhat biased.

Great Post. If I didnt know any better I would think you were a Yankee fan.

[bigtime59]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

It's ALWAYS been about money with the Yankee$, going back to the days of Rupert and Huston. They've always had more than anyone else and they've been quite ruthless about using it to their advantage.
The advantages of that imbalance were a lot less obvious when signing a major league contract wasn't a whole lot different than being taken prisoner. And the failings and flailings of the CBS-era and early George $teingrabber "you too can be a MLB general manager...just watch me" period showed that even if the stupid kid does have more money than some countries he won't jeapordize the others too much. But the simple fact of the matter is the Yankee$ have missed the playoffs one time since 1995 and the revenue discrepancies between them and the rest of the league just continue to grow and grow and grow and grow...
If MLB wants to be truly competitive--rather than sham competitive--it is going to have to abandon its fine-for-1869 system of (not) sharing local revenues...or it's going to have to get rid of the unbalanced schedule, divisions and interleague play...hell, maybe it needs to do all those things to truly level the playing field. Until then--as long as the Yankee$ can pay their infield more than half the other teams in the league pay their entire active rosters--the game isn't fair and the field isn't level; especially if you're a fan of the Orioles, Jays or Rays.
(Here comes the oooh, yeah! The Rays won the East in 2008! MLB has parity! contingent...where did the Rays finish in 2009? Exactly where I predicted: third, behind the Yankee$ and Red $ox. Shocking...utterly shocking.)

[yanks12025]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

It's ALWAYS been about money with the Yankee$, going back to the days of Rupert and Huston. They've always had more than anyone else and they've been quite ruthless about using it to their advantage.
The advantages of that imbalance were a lot less obvious when signing a major league contract wasn't a whole lot different than being taken prisoner. And the failings and flailings of the CBS-era and early George $teingrabber "you too can be a MLB general manager...just watch me" period showed that even if the stupid kid does have more money than some countries he won't jeapordize the others too much. But the simple fact of the matter is the Yankee$ have missed the playoffs one time since 1995 and the revenue discrepancies between them and the rest of the league just continue to grow and grow and grow and grow...
If MLB wants to be truly competitive--rather than sham competitive--it is going to have to abandon its fine-for-1869 system of (not) sharing local revenues...or it's going to have to get rid of the unbalanced schedule, divisions and interleague play...hell, maybe it needs to do all those things to truly level the playing field. Until then--as long as the Yankee$ can pay their infield more than half the other teams in the league pay their entire active rosters--the game isn't fair and the field isn't level; especially if you're a fan of the Orioles, Jays or Rays.
(Here comes the oooh, yeah! The Rays won the East in 2008! MLB has parity! contingent...where did the Rays finish in 2009? Exactly where I predicted: third, behind the Yankee$ and Red $ox. Shocking...utterly shocking.)

Why don't you cry us a river like you do all the time. Like i have said many times if your team spent the same type of money you would love it.

[suave1477]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

Why don't you cry us a river like you do all the time. Like i have said many times if your team spent the same type of money you would love it.

Agreed.

As I have said time and time again to you bigtime don not be mad at the Yankees for spending the money be mad at your team for not.

[mariner_gamers]

Re: The Yankees, baseball and money

In my opinion the strongest marketing tool MLB has are the New York Yankees. People love a winner, people hate a winner. The Yankees play the heavy and they do it better than any team in US professional sports.

MLB fans are more inclined to follow individual players rather than a team. The NFL has no guaranteed money, short careers and was made for TV. This is condusive to folks following a team rather than a player and why my strictly football friends can not stand baseball. MLB is smart because they know they cannot compare to the NFL on TV. What they can do is play up the individual and play up the heavy. Sure follow your favorite player until his team is eliminated and then what?? Well if the Yankees are playing you watch and root against them.

The most popular team in baseball are people who hate the Yankees. If the Yanks won it every year fans would leave baseball in droves but they don't. They win just enough to piss people off and keep the hope alive that next year they will get creamed. Being a Yankees fan I can tell you the amount of email I get when the Yanks lose in the playoffs is a testament to their ability to draw and drive MLB.

Without big hits and big t!ts from 23 different angles after each down baseball has gone back to Vaudeville in order to keep folks coming back. Build a heavy, build some hero's and let the audience have fun.