Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

[weimerskirch]

I noticed on Vintage Authentics new auction that they have Lou Lampson authenticating their jerseys. They also provide Lou's LOA on each jersey. Lou uses a 10-point scoring system in four different categories. The LOA is very simplistic and is no where near the professional level of MEARS authentification service. Quite a few of his baseball jerseys fall into the 5 and 6 range. Is this Lou's new LOA or has this version been around for some time? I am not impressed with this LOA. Please give me your candid thoughts on his LOA.

Also I do not want to demean Lou or Vintage Authentics. I have dealt with Vintage Authentics on numerous occasions and they have been very professional and answer my questions within 1 business day. They also ship winning lots very quickly. On the other hand I have not been impressed with what I have seen from Lou over the years.

Thanks,

Mark Weimerskirch
Maumee, Ohio

[hblakewolf]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

Mark-
I had quite a lengthy conversation with owner Steve Jenson at Vintage about this change. Vintage was employing the services of MEARS, and as such, a great deal of confidence was put behind the LOA's and items associated with the auction. The LOA's were available on their site, and allowed one to learn about the various items in great detail before bidding. I'm not about to mince my words about Lampson's LOA-they are a complete joke, and as noted in an earlier post here on the Forum, make some collectors actually NOT BID because of his past. Likewise, I have seen quite a few Phillies jerseys and jackets with Lampson's LOA's that were completely fake, yet he signed off on them as 100% legit. Likewise, many posts have made reference to the Ripken green St. Patrick's jersey that Lampson wrote a LOA for, however, the Orioles never wore a green St. Pat's jersey! Forum reader Dan Derluth is still trying to contact Lampson after a year, however, there is no contact information available for him on his own LOA's or through the auction houses that pay him (how do the auction houses contact Lampson to let him know when to come write their LOA's or send him payment for his services? Smoke signals?)


As I told Steve at Vintage, in my opinion he is better off having no LOA rather than a Lampson LOA. Vintage's reputation has been excellent to this point. Likewise, I can only imagine how many posts will be dedicated to "questionable" items in this upcoming Vintage auction, based on Lou's LOA's. Personally, I had tremendous confidence bidding on items in Vintage's auction, based upon the fact that MEARS provided a LOA, a LOA that offered a full money back guarantee. Lampson's LOA-no such guarantee, however, it does make for a great bird cage liner.

I'm aware that Steve at Vintage reads this board, and I'll leave him to post the reason for the change.



Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

[flaco1801]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

maybe lou lampson is a phamtom. anybody good at anagrams???

[Nathan]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

I agree with flaco; I've been wondering the same thing myself for close to two years. I have a tough time believing that someone who's supposed to be the world's premier authenticator of everything is living as a complete recluse in a Unabomber-style shack.

[beantown]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

I can't say that my experience with Lou Lampson / Vintage Authentics was a good one....I tried to consign a jersey with them last year and all I heard back was "Lou gave the jersey a thumbs down". What? Can you or Lou speak to me directly as to why it's thought to be bad??? No response from either. I knew the jersey was good when I purchased it and didn't need a COA, but to appease any prospective buyers, I contacted the person I bought it from, who wrote a detailed letter on how he obtained the jersey directly from the University had it notarized as such. I then forwarded this to MEARS who worked tirelessly with me on this jersey and it was graded an A9. Now recently Vintage Authentics has reached out to me as asked me to re-consign this jersey...I asked to make some special arrangements for that consignment, just to show that they would like to make amends for last year and the unprofessional service I received. Vintage Authentics never responsed..

[allstarsplus]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

I tried to consign a jersey with them last year and all I heard back was "Lou gave the jersey a thumbs down". What? Can you or Lou speak to me directly as to why it's thought to be bad??? No response from either. I knew the jersey was good when I purchased it and didn't need a COA, but to appease any prospective buyers, I contacted the person I bought it from, who wrote a detailed letter on how he obtained the jersey directly from the University had it notarized as such. I then forwarded this to MEARS who worked tirelessly with me on this jersey and it was graded an A9. Now recently Vintage Authentics has reached out to me as asked me to re-consign this jersey...I asked to make some special arrangements for that consignment, just to show that they would like to make amends for last year and the unprofessional service I received. Vintage Authentics never responsed..

That is amazing. Lou actually turned something down----and then you get an A9 from MEARS. I have heard of the opposite result---but never this.

[CollectGU]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

Here goes Howard again bashing Lou, who I think is better than Bushing on jerseys. I respect both their work. We are each entitled to our opinion. Again, there have been numerous posts questioning the authenticity of numerous jerseys in Vintage's auctions when MEARS was authenticating so stop trying to skew the facts. You say St. Pat's jersey, I say Dimaggio glove...ad nauseum...

Since we are on the subject of MEARS, I would like to know how they were able to in good conscience, authenticate the Yogi Berra catcher's mask in Robert Edwards auction knowing that these same masks could be purchased from a catalogue . What distinguished it as Berra's mask? Were there any markings that linked it to Berra? How could he know it was his, then? Then look at who owned the mask (Dave Bushing) and ask how much they paid to aquire a letter from Yogi Berra for the item (approximately $1,500), Wow, that's a ton of money for a letter, don't you think?

[Steve Jensen]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

Just wanted to take a few minutes to address our authentication policy. We use Lou Lampson as well as MEARS for game used jerseys and PSA/DNA as well as MEARS for game used bats. We do not use MEARS exclusively, that was a business decision on our part. Lou's grading system is brand new and has been the works for quite awhile. The auctions descriptions were taken directly from the notes that Lou took while authenticating the item. Our writer organizes the notes into readable form into the catalog & onto LOA's. We apply matching square tamper proof and numbered holograms to the LOA and the inside of each jersey and record each item into our database for future reference to make sure each LOA matches the corresponding item. The jerseys are graded on a 10 point scale using the following 4 criteria:

Jersey Charcateristics/Identifiers (4 points)
A grade of 0-4 will be given based on level of originality and the jersey possessing proper jersey body material characteristics and attributes as well as proper size, tagging, and numeral/letter font appropriate for the individual player/team.

Aesthetic Appearance/Customizations (2 points)
A grade of 0-2 will be given based on the aesthetic appeal of the jersey as well as consideration given for both customizations (if any) and/or unique differentiators appropriate for the player/team.

Range of Wear (2 points)
A grade of 0-2 will be given based on the amount of use appropriate for the position, player, sport and event or time of season.

Provenance/Rarity (2 points)
A grade of 0-2 will be given within this category. Principal consideration will be given to rarity/scarcity of the jersey based on era and availability. Provenance will also be addressed where there is the inclusion of player, team, 3rd party provenance, direct photographic evidence of game use or differentiating photographic support, particularly with more modern representations where the photographic documentation is far more prevalent and available.

Ultimately, the responsibility lies with us as an auction house to provide quality and authentic merchandise and we are 100% committed to doing so. After having witnessed both Lou and MEARS authenticate for our auction many items I will say that both take great pride in what they do and are assets to the hobby.

Best Regards,
Steve Jensen
www.vintageauthentics.com
866-304-3090

[beantown]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

Just wanted to take a few minutes to address our authentication policy. We use Lou Lampson as well as MEARS for game used jerseys and PSA/DNA as well as MEARS for game used bats. We do not use MEARS exclusively, that was a business decision on our part. Lou's grading system is brand new and has been the works for quite awhile. The auctions descriptions were taken directly from the notes that Lou took while authenticating the item. Our writer organizes the notes into readable form into the catalog & onto LOA's. We apply matching square tamper proof and numbered holograms to the LOA and the inside of each jersey and record each item into our database for future reference to make sure each LOA matches the corresponding item. The jerseys are graded on a 10 point scale using the following 4 criteria:

Jersey Charcateristics/Identifiers (4 points)
A grade of 0-4 will be given based on level of originality and the jersey possessing proper jersey body material characteristics and attributes as well as proper size, tagging, and numeral/letter font appropriate for the individual player/team.


Aesthetic Appearance/Customizations (2 points)

A grade of 0-2 will be given based on the aesthetic appeal of the jersey as well as consideration given for both customizations (if any) and/or unique differentiators appropriate for the player/team.

Range of Wear (2 points)
A grade of 0-2 will be given based on the amount of use appropriate for the position, player, sport and event or time of season.

Provenance/Rarity (2 points)

A grade of 0-2 will be given within this category. Principal consideration will be given to rarity/scarcity of the jersey based on era and availability. Provenance will also be addressed where there is the inclusion of player, team, 3rd party provenance, direct photographic evidence of game use or differentiating photographic support, particularly with more modern representations where the photographic documentation is far more prevalent and available.

Ultimately, the responsibility lies with us as an auction house to provide quality and authentic merchandise and we are 100% committed to doing so. After having witnessed both Lou and MEARS authenticate for our auction many items I will say that both take great pride in what they do and are assets to the hobby.

Best Regards,
Steve Jensen
www.vintageauthentics.com
866-304-3090

Steve, can you explain why Vintage or Lou never followed up with me when Lou stated my jersey was bad? Where was his notes when he gave the jersey a thumbs down? Why wouldn't he explain his rationale? I asked for an explanation and I never received one??? Moreover, Vintage contacted me again this year and asked me to consign the jersey after the jersey received an A9 from MEARS...I was hesitant and asked for some special consessions to be made stemming from last years negative experience...no follow up from Vintage..can you explain this poor customer service?

[mr.miracle]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

I have to agree with Howard on this post. While every authenticator has made their fair share of goof ups, It is simply inexcusable that someone who I am sure is paid very handsomely for their supposed expertise in authenticating game worn jersey's would make such a major error in their opinion on the green Ripken St. Pats jersey and then refuse to address the issue or answer Dan Derleth in any way on the matter.

Howard is right, where is Lampson at? How do you contact the guy? If I were to contact J&T Sports I can get in touch with John Taube, likewise with Dave Bushings and Troy Kinunen at MEARS. Lampson appears to be completely inexcessible to the outside world.

Obviously the green jersey issue has been debated to death on this forum, however how the supposed world's premier authenticator of game worn jersey's could give the green thumbs up on this remains a great mystery. The jersey's could only have been worn one day each year over a ten or so year period. Simple research and homework would have clearly proven the authenticity or in this case lack thereof. I believe that forum members calling Lampson's LOA's and work in general into question are clearly justified given that he made such a ridiculous error that it calls into question the research he is doing on anything he authenticates. The fact that he was provided evidence by Dan Derleth that showed that these jersey's were never used yet never responded in any way to Dan cast a very bad light on Mr. Lampson.

While it is possible for any authenticator to make a mistake, this was just plain stupidity and clearly some type of restitution should have been offered yet never was. So yes, Howard and others who call Lou Lampson's LOA's into question are in fact justified. Lampson's own silence to these claims validate this very fact.

[hblakewolf]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

As my great grandfather used to say to me, "Howard, he's as dumb as a fox". In this case, what does Lampson have to gain by coming on this Forum, listing his contact info. on his LOA's or having a listed phone number in Basking Ridge, New Jersey? I dare any Forum reader to post his address or phone number here-it is simply not to be found.

What's equally as disturbing is that Dan Derlith has simply allowed himself to be taken for over $4,000 on the Ripken St. Pat's and never sought the assistance of a legal help on this!

Say what you want, however, Lampson has the last laugh all the way to the bank.

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

[mr.miracle]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

I don't think at this point that the NSA, FBI, CIA etc. can locate Lampson. You would think that the IRS would have his phone number unless he decided to keep all the green that he got from the LOA for the green Ripken jersey and decided to be a naughty boy and not report that on his income tax. Maybe an IRS agent can break into their files and provide his contact info. Anybody game for that?

Brett Herman

[mr.miracle]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

Of course, given the cost of legal expertise in this type of matter. It would probably cost Dan more to recover the money spent on this jersey than what he actually paid for it in the first place.

Brett Herman


By the way, Howard is right, were Lampson to come on here, he undoubtably would be so inundated with emails and posts regarding questionable items that he authenticated that he would have to hire a personal customer service response team to handle all the inquiries.

[CollectGU]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

Here we go again - Lou Lampson does not perform an authenticating service, like MEARS. MEARS is a retailer/wholesaler offering services to both the general publicand those that sell to the public - auction houses. LOU DOES NOT DO THIS. He is like a distributor offering his services to auction houses, and just like a distributor, he answers to the auction houses who employ his services. The responsibiity of contacting Lou when something is wrong falls on the auction house. And it is the reponsibility of the buyer to contact the auction house, not Lou, to discuss mistakes made...It is his choice not offer his servcies as a retailer and therefore only needs to answer to those who emply his services, i.e auction houses. SO if you have a problem with a Lampson item contact the auction house selling it for answers...

[hblakewolf]

Re: Vintage Authentics & Lou Lampson

Dave CollectGu-

As you once again try to defend Lampson, you have failed to understand one major issue. You note, "The responsibility of contacting Lou when something is wrong falls on the auction house". Take Bricol Auctions for example. When they ship you an item from one of their auctions, you receive a LOA from Lampson. As is the case on a regular basis, this item may be sold at a later date to another collector or dealer, and the Lampson LOA is included. If the item in question is discovered to have a problem or is fake, how does this new buyer at a later date (two years?) after the auction try to resolve this? There is no Bricol receipt with the item, and the only LOA is from Lampson, void of ANY contact info on it-no address or phone number? Likewise, how would one trace this item back to Bricol, as there is no receipt or shred of info that it originally came from them years earlier after it has been resold a few times?

Say what you want about MEARS, but at least their LOA's have their contact info and they also provide a web site that allows one to send a question or seek additional info from them.

Here’s another example that you may understand. When you purchase a diamond, it has a graded certificate with it that includes contact info. If the diamond is proven to have a problem or does not grade as noted, you have the choice of getting the jeweler involved, or if the jeweler is out of business, you can deal directly with the company who graded the diamond, as this info. is clearly noted on the certificate.

Again, if the auction house folds and one needs to resolve an authenticity issue with Lamspon, how might this be accomplished?

Dave, once again a well thought out response trying to defend Lampson. When you have a free minute from waving your white “Lampson” flag, maybe you can send an email to Dan Derluth and bring him under the tent on how he can easily work with his auction house on arranging a meeting with Lampson to get his $4,000 back from his bogus Ripken St. Pat's jersey with an even more worthless Lampson LOA.

Better yet, Dan, can you comment on how willing the auction house has been to correct this problem, and how willing they have been to get Lampson involved to refund your $4,000?

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

Here we go again - Lou Lampson does not perform an authenticating service, like MEARS. MEARS is a retailer/wholesaler offering services to both the general publicand those that sell to the public - auction houses. LOU DOES NOT DO THIS. He is like a distributor offering his services to auction houses, and just like a distributor, he answers to the auction houses who employ his services. The responsibiity of contacting Lou when something is wrong falls on the auction house. And it is the reponsibility of the buyer to contact the auction house, not Lou, to discuss mistakes made...It is his choice not offer his servcies as a retailer and therefore only needs to answer to those who emply his services, i.e auction houses. SO if you have a problem with a Lampson item contact the auction house selling it for answers...