Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

**gameused fan** · 06-03-2010, 09:10 AM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

I'm certainly not saying Griffey did use steroids, but I've always wondered why everyone just assumes he didn't do them? Haven't we learned not to give anybody a free pass from that era? Perhaps Griffey was just smarter about doing them and didn't get caught?

When looking at his numbers, Griffey did achieve his best home run seasons right during the height of the steroid era. He had a career-high 49 homers in 1996, then topped it with 56 each of the next two years.

He also happened to play career-highs of 157, 161 and 160 games during those years. Perhaps steroids or some other substance helped him recover and play (like McGwire) before breaking him down with more injuries afterward?

Again, not saying he did do them. Just wondering why everyone just assumes he didn't while playing in an era where it seems so many did.

**cjclong** · 06-03-2010, 09:43 AM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

We "assume" he didn't because there is no damn evidence that he used steroids. Griffey was famous for not weight lifting, etc. I get tired of all these people that seem to hope "everyone" used steroids.

**gameused fan** · 06-03-2010, 10:05 AM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

I certainly don't "hope" he used them. I just get damn tired of people making matter of fact statements that somebody for sure didn't use a PED during a time when many of the top players (and some crappy ones, too) used them.

Especially when some of his stats certainly could at least make a case for it. For some reason, Frank Thomas and Griffey are for sure clean. And we know this why?

I don't know the true story. You don't either. You just assume you know. Which is why I'm not saying Griffey did or didn't. Because I don't know.

I'm simply making a comment about my surprise that there are people who state that he didn't use steroids as if it's a certain fact.

**cjclong** · 06-03-2010, 10:48 AM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

I wasn't the one who said he didn't use steroids. But I ASSUME he didn't for the same reason I assume you are not a wanted criminal, there is no evidence I have for it. And the fact that Griffey hit home runs in the 50's, so have a lot of people over the years. So what? Roger Maris never hit 40 home runs in a season except for the 61 he hit in '61, guess we better look at him. And maybe Ruth and Aaron were just ahead of there time in Steroid use. Do you "know" Ruth or Aaron didn't use steroids. I doubt if many people would argue if we said Maris didn't use steroids (they were around while he was playing). When there is NO evidence that a player used steroids and the only "evidence" that he did was that he hit more than 50 home runs in a year and ALL the other evidence is to the contrary, that he never lifted weights and was a natural althlete, I am willing to assume he didn't . So if someone here writes a post that says Hank Aaron was a steroid free home run hitter I won't feel compelled to write a post saying how do we "know" he didn't.

**justinwc80** · 06-03-2010, 12:04 PM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

When a star is as big as Griffey there is no way that someone didn't know if he used, the fact he has never been mentioned in any of the books or articles is about as much evidence as you can ask for. I think some people just hope everyone used so that whatever player they like doesn't look so bad. He didn't have injuries early on because he was young. He was blasting homeruns out of the park in 1988 right after the M's signed him. His body began to break down just like a body normally does and his numbers went down accordingly. His head is the same size its always been. I mean come on!

**Swoboda4** · 06-03-2010, 12:25 PM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

He certainly doesn't "look" like he used them at all. He most assuredly would have became bigger (ala Bonds) physically but he just maintained the same body type throughout his career. Much like Hank Aaron did.

**cjclong** · 06-03-2010, 01:22 PM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

I agree with you Justinwc80. When there is no evidence that a player used steroids and then people write in and say how do we know they didin't it sounds like they hope the player did. It is virtually impossible to prove a negative which is why in trials we require the prosecution to prove the person did something rather than for the defendant have to to prove he didn't do something. If I wrote that Griffey never murdered someone nobody would write in here to say how do we "know" he didn't. But with exactly the same lack of evidence as to using steroids as his murdering someone people will write in to say how do we "know" he didn't use steroids.

**gameused fan** · 06-03-2010, 02:12 PM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

Now you are stretching the situation when attempting to use an analogy of murder.

Griffey played in the steroid era. Griffey achieved career numbers during the height of the steroid era. That does not mean he took them. But because of the era he played in, he and everyone else has a cloud over them and always will.

Is it fair? No. But that's the way it is. That's the fault of many of his peers who put that dark cloud over the game.

And, remember, there was a time when there was no REAL evidence that guys like Sammy Sosa or Rafael Palmerio took them, either. And if people are being honest here, there might be a good number that would admit that when Palmerio took such a passionate stance in front of congress a few years ago, that you believed him, too.

**3arod13** · 06-03-2010, 02:41 PM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

Maybe he did...Maybe he didn't. We may never know for sure! I have to believe somewhere down the line, someone will open the door and we'll find out more of those players who used.

Regards, Tony

**cjclong** · 06-03-2010, 03:44 PM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

Being honest yes, I had hoped Palmeiro didn't use steroids, and I would suspect to this day his use was marginal. However, there was some evidence he had, before the testing and that came from Canseco. I challenge you to to give ANY evidence beyond your speculation that Griffey did steroids. You say that because some players used it puts all under suspicion. I say its people like you who raise the suspicions by raising the question " I wonder if he used" when there is no evidence he used. The majority of players did not use drugs. And yet you want to raise it about EVERYBODY who played then. Unless you follow a player around 24/7 for their entire sports career you are never going to "know" if they used. So why speculate ?Does it give you some kind of satisfaction? You say Griffey played in the steroid era. That is guilt by association. We live in a country that has a high murder rate and allows gun ownership. So I guess someone from another country would be right in wondering if each of us had ikilled somebody. That is exactly the same logic you are using. Let me ask you point blank, do yiou guestion whether Roger Maris used steroids. They were avaiable then. Do you really wonder if he.did? I'd like an answer because if you do question whether Maris did then I understand your questioning Griffey.

**gameused fan** · 06-03-2010, 05:41 PM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

First, again, I need to make clear that I'm not saying Griffey took steroids. My whole point was that I cringe when people make the statement that Griffey for sure had a clean career, that there is no chance he ever took a PED despite putting up the best numbers of his career during that era.

I don't want to look at the negative with baseball players, but I just think it's naive that we'd make such a matter of fact statement that any player was for sure clean during the steroid era and that there is NO way this guy or that guy would ever take a PED.

To answer your question, I don't believe Roger Maris took steroids during his career because I don't think it was prevalent then. But you sure as heck won't find me saying that Roger Maris FOR SURE didn't use amphetamines during that time.

It certainly is sad that when it comes to baseball players, specifically those in the steroid era, that people are considered guilty first. It's why some clean players are upset at those who did do them, because it did cast a cloud over everyone. Those are the breaks. That's what the game gets for being filled with steroid abusers and not doing enough to stop it in time.

I guess I'd ask this considering it's a game-used forum: If just one game-used jersey with an MLB authentication sticker was found to be fake, and a story came out in which MLB admitted that a few fake jersey's did get on the market somehow, would you just blindly assume that every jersey after that was for sure real? Or would you question, just a little bit, that maybe it wasn't?

**justinwc80** · 06-03-2010, 06:16 PM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

gameusedfan,
All of your examples are players that have been named by various people as guilty of using PEDs. This is a big difference between Griffey and them, its a hard secret to keep obviously, even with confidential testing names are leaked out, and not once has someone who had something to gain or want to bring someone down ever mentioned Griffey. I just don't see the argument here.

**gameused fan** · 06-03-2010, 06:49 PM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

I guess there isn't much left to say. Some on here are convinced that he for sure didn't use PEDs. I'm more on the side that he didn't, as well. But you won't find me willing to say that for certain, because I think it's foolish to just assume at this point with any of the players.

It's as simple as that.

**Mat2786@aol.com** · 06-03-2010, 10:58 PM

Re: Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

I'm with gameused fan...But I am more on the side he used steroids. I think he used them as much or more then anybody. His first 4 years in the majors he was a 20+ hr guy.... he avg. a hr per 24.88 at bats in his frst 4 years. The next 4 he avg. a hr per 12 at bats and the next 4 years he avg. a hr per 11.8 at bats. Those eight years were the height of steroid use. Also what does everyone say steroids do??? they break a player down...who broke down more then Griffey?? nobody....I'm with game used fan I am sick and tired of people sayin certain players are steroid free during the steriod era...u showed me his stats with the info above and didn't show me the player I would say he used...and i think he should as well as mcgwire sosa bonds clemens and palmeiro should all be in the hall...every player from that era should be in the hall of fame with an * next to there name...i don't blame a single player for using...i would have used...look at the money they got...they were all great players steriods or not...just my opinion....but don't say a player is steriod free during the steriod era....when u just don't no...i would just talk about how great he was and not bring up steriods at all

Matt

Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

Griffey Jr Retires: Steroid Free Star

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