2001 Craig Biggio Game used Jersey - NOT!

[Texstros]

All,

Came across a 2001 Craig Biggio pinstripe Jersey on eBay this week. This jersey shows tremendous use & lots of wear. Letters, numbers & even a ton of tar. Jersey looked like it had seen a few games. Seller had video on Youtube & talks about it in length - (it has since been removed). Boy did I get excited until he sent me a picture of the wash tag. This tag is crispy crisp new & its a 6200 wash code.

I went through every photo & video I have been able to find - no match. As a matter of fact, it looks like biggio wore 1 jersey primarly. I contacted the Astros organization as well & was told it was not used by Biggio. Its obvious with a crispy wash tag it wouldnt show as much use as this jersey has. The letter & number fraying was a nice touch!:eek:

I had to tell the seller he was sold a "Bad" jersey & boy was he upset. To be honest people that mislead or sell fake jerseys like this make me want to pull out of this hobby. This disgust me & it is not right..its a amazing people can sleep at night.

I have saved & posted pictures below so if this "jersey" makes it back in the open market it can be easly identified.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Craig-Biggio-Signed-2001-Astros-Game-Used-Jersey-/320653147431?pt=US_Baseball_Fan_Shop&hash=item4aa86abd27


http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb441/shawnsastros/01biggiofront.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb441/shawnsastros/01biggioastros.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb441/shawnsastros/01biggiodirt.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb441/shawnsastros/01biggioback.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb441/shawnsastros/01biggioflag.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb441/shawnsastros/01biggio7.jpg
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb441/shawnsastros/01biggiowashtag.jpg

[dcrules01]

I saw that jersey the seller sday he purchased it from Chris Boyd who is a big Biggio collector. The 6200 tag has been spotted on gamers. Would like to here what Chris has to say about the jersey. I love post 9-11 jerseys and was watching this. Thanks for the input.

[frikativ54]

I saw that jersey the seller sday he purchased it from Chris Boyd who is a big Biggio collector. The 6200 tag has been spotted on gamers. Would like to here what Chris has to say about the jersey. I love post 9-11 jerseys and was watching this. Thanks for the input.

I understand a 6200 jersey seeing use; it happens from time to time. What I don't undersand is how a jersey with this much use could show a crisp washtag.

[dcrules01]

How many jerseys are issued to an Astros player? Good point though about the crisp wash tag. Always the theory that the Astros were issued new jerseys post 9-11 or were the flag patches added to jerseys that were currently being used. There are a lot of scenerios. If someone altered the jersey how do they fray the numbers? The dirt on the jersey and pine tar can come from just 1 game that is always a possibility. Like I said curious to see what Chris says. Always a possibility he sold the jersey as an autographed authentic to another buyer and this collector bought it from someone that stated it came from Chris. Has anyone contacted him. You contacted the Astros that was a good idea who did you speak with? The bad thing is the seller had some nice jerseys do we question them also?

[frikativ54]

The seller did the honorable thing by ending the auction early. I would love to hear from the original owner of the jersey about some of the concerns raised by Texstros.

-Frik

[dcrules01]

I emailed Chris to let him know about the thread. Its ashame its a nice jersey.

[ziggy]

Did he even wear a 44 in 2001? If so, when did he start wearing a 46?

[ziggy]

I am answering my own question....Chris Boyd said in 2006 on the forum that all 2000 to current Biggio jerseys should be size 46. Here is the link:

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=4351

[eGameUsed]

Thanks Scott for emailing me. I don't frequent the forum much.

As for the jersey, I did in fact sell the jersey as is to the seller on eBay in 2002. This past weekend when I saw the jersey listed, I immediately emailed the seller and told him I was very eager to buy back. I always regretted selling this 2001 jersey, but decided to sell as I had another 2001 Road Biggio in my collection. Since 2002, one of my collection focused has been Biggio, so I am after and and all items. Knowing I sold him the jersey, I was interested in buying it back.

I purchased the jersey from a reputable contact and provider of many Astros items in the late 1990s and early 2000s. In fact, I purchased other post 9/11 items included a couple of helmets and jerseys.

In 2002, I myself and most people were unaware of the "0062" versus "6200" tagging. If I knew back then what I know now, I would have been more hesitant. I purchased and sold the jersey before I knew "6200" jerseys were considered retail.

I notified the eBay seller immediately after reading this thread and learning more about the jersey (which I regret I did not know in 2002). He noted that Shawn contacted him and how Shawn contacted the Astros Authentication Manager to get an opinion on the jersey. The seller noted that he ended the auction as "to not cause a fuss about it." The seller was not going to even contact me as he was not concerned, but replied to me promptly when I e-mailed him letting him know there were concerns about the tagging. I told the seller I intend to buy back the jersey and I was unaware of any tagging discrepencies 8 years ago at time of sell. As with any items, I honor 100% guarantee on any items.

I apologize for not knowing this information sooner but want to make things right. I do plan to contact the original seller that sold the jersey to me. I have received many items from this seller, including multiple photomatched items so I believe this to be either something that slipped past him, but I will certainly follow-up.

In regard to "6200" tagging, they do exist on Astros jerseys. I have a 2001 Astros Home Pinstripe of a "common" player with 6200 tag that I purchased direct from the team. I am also aware of other jerseys purchased from the Astros that have 6200 tagging or are missing inner tagging. Obviously, legit 6200 are a rare exception and should be carefully reviewed.

In regard to use, the use is consistent for one or more games, just in an unwashed state. Biggio was known for being very dirty with tar. I also sold this jersey prior to photomatching being popular task of game worn collectors. At the time, I believed the jersey to be consistent.

In regard to size, I have Biggio jerseys in the following sizes:

1990 - 40
1996 - 44
1999 - 46
2000 - 44
2002 - 46
2003 - 46
2006 - 46
2007 - 46

There seems to be some variation in the 1999-2002 era between 44 and 46. 46 was certainly his size of choice in 2002 to 2007.

Please e-mail me if anyone has any further questions.

Thanks,

[Texstros]

How many jerseys are issued to an Astros player? Good point though about the crisp wash tag. Always the theory that the Astros were issued new jerseys post 9-11 or were the flag patches added to jerseys that were currently being used. There are a lot of scenerios. If someone altered the jersey how do they fray the numbers? The dirt on the jersey and pine tar can come from just 1 game that is always a possibility. Like I said curious to see what Chris says. Always a possibility he sold the jersey as an autographed authentic to another buyer and this collector bought it from someone that stated it came from Chris. Has anyone contacted him. You contacted the Astros that was a good idea who did you speak with? The bad thing is the seller had some nice jerseys do we question them also?

Just to answer a few questions.

Biggio used 1 jersey post 9-11... Numbers can be frayed a number of ways, a hard brush ect... I spoke with astros authentication manager & other team reps.
I cant question his other items but this one. No way in hell did Biggio ever see or use this jersey!

[frikativ54]

When I originally read this thread, I was happy that the eBay seller was going to get a refund for the fake jersey from the original owner. However, two months have passed, and according to the seller, he hasn't gotten a dime of the money back.

It's one thing to sell a bad jersey. It's quite another to say that you stand behind your items, yet to never issue a refund to the aggrieved party.

Just disgusting IMO.

-Frik

[Danny899]

You are mistaken if you think that 6200's are only retail. There have been a lot of 6200 game worn jerseys. The Dodgers were one team that comes to mind. It's amazing how many good pieces you could pick up because other collectors live and die by the 6200/0062 theory and were afraid to bid. I learned this from Dave M. and other members right here. With this particular Biggio jersey, I would go by what Frik thinks. Her knowledge is tops with Astros jerseys. (at least I think so!)

[sox83cubs84]

"A lot" might be stretching it, but it does happen. Still, I'd be wary of any major star jersey with the 6200 code, as the chances are just too small of it being legit to take the chance. Plus, 44 is a retail size...46 is not.

Dave Miedema

[Danny899]

"A lot" might be stretching it, but it does happen. Still, I'd be wary of any major star jersey with the 6200 code, as the chances are just too small of it being legit to take the chance. Plus, 44 is a retail size...46 is not.

Dave Miedema

Ah, what do you know Dave?? Actually all kidding aside, you know how much I and others here value your insight. But please clarify what you mean that 44 is a retail size. Don't MLB players wear 44's? As always, I hope you're doing well. Thanks again for your help.
Dan

[BamaHater]

Ah, what do you know Dave?? Actually all kidding aside, you know how much I and others here value your insight. But please clarify what you mean that 44 is a retail size. Don't MLB players wear 44's? As always, I hope you're doing well. Thanks again for your help.
Dan
I think what he is saying is 44 is a size anyone can buy at retail therefore could try and turn into a fake gamer. Yes 44 is a size players do wear but it is easy to pick up a retail size 44 6200 slap Biggio on the jersey and fake some wear to make it look game used. We all know that few 6200 do make it into Gamer use but IMO I would never buy a star player game used 6200 unless I have absolute proof that it was worn by the player.

[Danny899]

I think what he is saying is 44 is a size anyone can buy at retail therefore could try and turn into a fake gamer. Yes 44 is a size players do wear but it is easy to pick up a retail size 44 6200 slap Biggio on the jersey and fake some wear to make it look game used. We all know that few 6200 do make it into Gamer use but IMO I would never buy a star player game used 6200 unless I have absolute proof that it was worn by the player.

Thanks, Bama. I appreciate the response. I'm trying to actually protect my own interests here!;) Lol! Years ago I purchased 2 Rickey Henderson jerseys that came directly from his company. One is a 6200 and the other is an 0062. I too was skeptical about the 6200, but knowing where they came from, the personal tailoring, the wear, and last and probably least, the autograph, I decided not to pass it up. Especially after I learned that it was not uncommon for these numbered jerseys to be actual gamers.
Dan

[sox83cubs84]

Ah, what do you know Dave?? Actually all kidding aside, you know how much I and others here value your insight. But please clarify what you mean that 44 is a retail size. Don't MLB players wear 44's? As always, I hope you're doing well. Thanks again for your help.
Dan

Dan:

All sizes arer available for players to wear. The authentic jerseys (normally 6200s) made for retail sale only make every OTHER size available. You can buy a 40, 44, 48 or 52 in a retail store. You can't buy a 42, 46 (which Biggio reportedly wore at the time) or a 50.

Again, exceptions can and do happen, but I would avoid any major name jersey with the 6200 interior tag...the chances of it truly being worn are far outweighed by the more obvious possibilities...try selling that jersey down the road with collectors tuned in on 0062 jerseys.

Dave Miedema

[Texstros]

You are mistaken if you think that 6200's are only retail. There have been a lot of 6200 game worn jerseys. The Dodgers were one team that comes to mind. It's amazing how many good pieces you could pick up because other collectors live and die by the 6200/0062 theory and were afraid to bid. I learned this from Dave M. and other members right here. With this particular Biggio jersey, I would go by what Frik thinks. Her knowledge is tops with Astros jerseys. (at least I think so!)

I think alot of people missed the point - here we have a 6200 jersey with a Fresh washtag with the use of jersey that has been used all yr. It is possible for a player to wear a 6200 but for biggio - no way.

Frik - are you really suprised that les has not received his money back on this jersey?? I'm not! Oh & ck out the "DK" Biggio hat on eBay, stay far far away. I don't want to be the guy with more bad news.. Email if anyone has any questions.

[frikativ54]

I think alot of people missed the point - here we have a 6200 jersey with a Fresh washtag with the use of jersey that has been used all yr. It is possible for a player to wear a 6200 but for biggio - no way.

Frik - are you really suprised that les has not received his money back on this jersey?? I'm not! Oh & ck out the "DK" Biggio hat on eBay, stay far far away. I don't want to be the guy with more bad news.. Email if anyone has any questions.

The seller's silence at this point speaks volumes. It's been over two months since he promised to refund Les for the bad jersey, yet Les has yet to see a dime of the money. Is this what a 100% lifetime guarantee of authenticity means? The seller hasn't even responded to this thread in ages, but now posts in the Collector to Collector Classifieds? If the Biggio jersey is fake, how can we trust that any of his other items are real? If it were me, I would stay far, far away!

[eGameUsed]

The seller has been issued a refund. I promised to issue a refund, which I did. I was working with the seller on the purchase of other itemsm, which have been completed. These were private dealings and none of your business.

As for my silence, I rarely come to this board anymore. I was unaware an update was needed by those people on this board that continue to try and bait people and cause problems. At no point was I contacted by anymore prior to this thread being started or continued, a direct violation of forum rules.

[frikativ54]

The seller has been issued a refund. I promised to issue a refund, which I did. I was working with the seller on the purchase of other itemsm, which have been completed. These were private dealings and none of your business.

As for my silence, I rarely come to this board anymore. I was unaware an update was needed by those people on this board that continue to try and bait people and cause problems. At no point was I contacted by anymore prior to this thread being started or continued, a direct violation of forum rules.

Chris has been contacted several times about this jersey, both in person and via email. However, it's a new excuse every time. As of last weekend, Les had still not received a refund. I have emailed Les to find out if he has indeed received his money back. I will keep the forum posted on the latest developments. It is everybody's business when fake jerseys are sold, even if there was no intent to mislead on the part of the seller.

[Bigcatbaseball]

Hey Astros collectors, buy from people you trust. There are several quality collectors and dealers who deal in Astros stuff so there is no reason to feel "forced" to deal with someone who you dont have 100% confidence in. By now, we all know who plays it straight and who does not, 100% return plocy should be standard.

[eGameUsed]

Leslie,

Since you feel obligated to make my dealings your cause. Yes, Les and I met and have had multiple discussions about items he had available. Les has never complained about my delay, as we were trying to meet again in person to exchange the refund and jersey. I guess you could call having a baby right after Les and I met the first time, having a 2 week trip to Singapore, a very hectic work schedule with travel, and a few weeks of vacation with my wife and newborn an excuse, but call it what you want. Les and I have been in contact every couple of weeks. Again, not entirely sure why I have to answer to you, but the refund had been completed. Again, Les and I have been in communication and he has never voiced complaint to me, but understand my hectic schedule. Please do verify this with Les. so you can report back to the forum and my promise was fulfilled.

Les was very appreciative that after 9 years, I honored my commitment as 100% authenticity. Not sure many people can give examples where they honored something like that 9 years after a transaction. But again, there is not one single instance where I have not honored that!

Thanks,

[frikativ54]

Les got the money back today. So I am glad this story had a happy ending.