"1981 Mookie Wilson jersey" on ebay - buyer beware

[TNTtoys]

All,

Last week, a 1981 Mookie Wilson game used Mets home jersey appeared on ebay. As any Mets collector would do, I opened the listing out of utmost curiosity...only to find that it's not what it is described to be.

For your reference:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Game-Used-Mookie-Wilson-Mets-Jersey-1981-/300528804824?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item45f8e9a3d8

I wrote to the seller, explaining that the jersey is not what it is purported to be, and even provided some detailed information as to why it isn't... but he ignored my message; I guess hoping that I would just go away. As his luck had it, I got busy last week...and the jersey sold.

Before the buyer had the chance to complete the transaction, he was made aware that the jersey was bad, and was able to cancel the transaction. Now the jersey is back up on ebay!

And here's what's wrong with it (I might not have touched on everything, but there is enough data here nevertheless):

1. This style jersey was worn by the Mets from 1978-1982. In only 1978, names on backs were not present. 1981 jerseys should have a name on the back sewn onto a nameplate.

2. In the absence of a nameplate & name (i.e. it had been stripped off in order for the team to recycle the jersey to the minor leagues), the number should be low enough on the back to fit one. This particular jersey has the number too high up to have ever had a nameplate.

3. The Rawlings tag in the neck is from 1987!!!

4. The Rawlings tag should be on the bottom of the jersey, not in the neckline. Neckline tagging on Mets jerseys of this era started in 1982-1983 (depending upon the style of jersey in question).

5. The strip tag on the lower front of the jersey is unlike any strip tag that has appeared on this era jersey.

6. The set tag has NEVER EVER appeared on a Mets uniform attached to a strip tag and on a different part of the jersey altogether than the Rawlings tag.

7. It might be bad photography, but I don't even think the shape of the jersey is correct (though this one I cannot be sure about due to the photos).


And as if this train wreck of a jersey wasn't enough, the seller also has a Scoreboard Gregg Jefferies for sale... at a hgiher price than a real game used Gregg Jefferies jersey!

http://cgi.ebay.com/Game-Used-Gregg-Jefferies-Mets-Jersey-1990-New-York-/300528829108?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item45f8ea02b4

[sox83cubs84]

Good call, Nick. Looks like somebody tried to turn a minor league jersey into a Mookie gamer, but didn't think it through sufficiently.

Dave Miedema

[ironmanfan]

same seller is listing an infamous 1990 "Scoreboard" jersey of Gregg Jeffries and somehow has a $200 bid on it...

[jhunt28]

Interesting to know that his baseball stuff is no good. Because I contacted him on his two Jets helmets that he has for sale, and was told he was at a conference and would get back to me to address my concerns the next day. I haven't heard back from him. His Jets helmets are nowhere close to being authentic...with the Vilma helmet still having a Schutt chinstrap, and the rear number decals being fakes. The Chrebet helmet that he has listed has two warning decals on the rear of the helmet, something that no Jets helmet has ever had. It's a retail helmet with some added decals...I just hope no one purchases these. Perhaps this person was sold a bill of goods, and actually believes that it's authentic? But his lack of response to other people's emails makes me think that he knows that what he is holding onto isn't legit.

[Dach0sen0ne]

Those photos have to be taken at the worst angles ever. He also adds photos of other stuff to kind of give it some added authenticity. Anyone have any comments on his Strawberry "game used" bat?

[TNTtoys]

same seller is listing an infamous 1990 "Scoreboard" jersey of Gregg Jeffries and somehow has a $200 bid on it...

This was covered by my original post.



Those photos have to be taken at the worst angles ever. He also adds photos of other stuff to kind of give it some added authenticity. Anyone have any comments on his Strawberry "game used" bat?

The Strawberry bat looks good. Price is right too. Guess he finally got something right!

[momen55]

i asked the seller about it and this is his answer:

Dear momen55,

Not the case but thanks for the input. I got it straight from Mookie and he told me he wore it in the pros so I'm going to go with the player's word. That being said yes, it does have similarities to minor league jerseys.


- dmkdc

[TNTtoys]

i asked the seller about it and this is his answer:

Dear momen55,

Not the case but thanks for the input. I got it straight from Mookie and he told me he wore it in the pros so I'm going to go with the player's word. That being said yes, it does have similarities to minor league jerseys.

- dmkdc

Let's forget all of the tagging abnormalities on this jersey for a second. Are we supposed to believe that Mookie wore a style jersey on field that differed to all of the other players?

I suppose he got the scoreboard jersey from Jefferies himself too?

And the New York Jets wore retail helmets too?

[ruhoos]

I purchased a jersey of Jefferies a year or so ago on eBay that looks a lot like the one the seller has offered. I purchased it from a seller who said he was given it from Jefferies following a game.

Anyways...how do I know if it's a game used jersey or this "scoreboard" jersey? And what is the deal with the scoreboard jerseys?

Thanks for the help!

[TNTtoys]

I purchased a jersey of Jefferies a year or so ago on eBay that looks a lot like the one the seller has offered. I purchased it from a seller who said he was given it from Jefferies following a game.

Anyways...how do I know if it's a game used jersey or this "scoreboard" jersey? And what is the deal with the scoreboard jerseys?

Thanks for the help!

Sure, no problem. Everything you need to know has already been said on the forum. In brief summary Scoreboard offered jerseys of star players of the time (circa 1988-1991) that were exact in every way to the jerseys made for those players on the field -- right down to the team tagging. Many of these are now re-surfacing on the market as "game used jerseys."

This thread shows actual articles as to how the Scoreboard jerseys were marketed and sold (though it doesn't contain articles that have the Jefferies jersey):

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?p=230374&posted=1#post230374

Here are some other threads that deal with Scoreboard Jefferies jerseys in particular:

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=15805&highlight=jefferies

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=8568&highlight=jefferies

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=8451&highlight=jefferies

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=6034&highlight=jefferies

Bottom line... There might be a couple of "real" 1990 Jefferies home jerseys; however, with the market having been diluted with so many Scoreboards (could be a 3-figure number), the odds are that you're probably not looking at one of them. I see these jerseys come and go often... no exaggeration, I have seen about 2-3 dozen of them in passing over the last decade. Rule of thumb if you want a Jefferies jersey... stay away from 1990 home. 1990 road is fine. A home or road of any other year is fine.

[ruhoos]

Sure, no problem. Everything you need to know has already been said on the forum. In brief summary Scoreboard offered jerseys of star players of the time (circa 1988-1991) that were exact in every way to the jerseys made for those players on the field -- right down to the team tagging. Many of these are now re-surfacing on the market as "game used jerseys."

This thread shows actual articles as to how the Scoreboard jerseys were marketed and sold (though it doesn't contain articles that have the Jefferies jersey):

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?p=230374&posted=1#post230374

Here are some other threads that deal with Scoreboard Jefferies jerseys in particular:

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=15805&highlight=jefferies

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=8568&highlight=jefferies

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=8451&highlight=jefferies

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=6034&highlight=jefferies

Bottom line... There might be a couple of "real" 1990 Jefferies home jerseys; however, with the market having been diluted with so many Scoreboards (could be a 3-figure number), the odds are that you're probably not looking at one of them. I see these jerseys come and go often... no exaggeration, I have seen about 2-3 dozen of them in passing over the last decade. Rule of thumb if you want a Jefferies jersey... stay away from 1990 home. 1990 road is fine. A home or road of any other year is fine.

Thanks TNT for the info. Wow, I feel like I got punched in the stomach. Wish I was on this forum before I had won the jersey. This site really is great for helping collectors. I definitely learned a lot from reading those threads.

[sox83cubs84]

Sure, no problem. Everything you need to know has already been said on the forum. In brief summary Scoreboard offered jerseys of star players of the time (circa 1988-1991) that were exact in every way to the jerseys made for those players on the field -- right down to the team tagging. Many of these are now re-surfacing on the market as "game used jerseys."

This thread shows actual articles as to how the Scoreboard jerseys were marketed and sold (though it doesn't contain articles that have the Jefferies jersey):

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?p=230374&posted=1#post230374

Here are some other threads that deal with Scoreboard Jefferies jerseys in particular:

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=15805&highlight=jefferies

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=8568&highlight=jefferies

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=8451&highlight=jefferies

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=6034&highlight=jefferies

Bottom line... There might be a couple of "real" 1990 Jefferies home jerseys; however, with the market having been diluted with so many Scoreboards (could be a 3-figure number), the odds are that you're probably not looking at one of them. I see these jerseys come and go often... no exaggeration, I have seen about 2-3 dozen of them in passing over the last decade. Rule of thumb if you want a Jefferies jersey... stay away from 1990 home. 1990 road is fine. A home or road of any other year is fine.

Nick, a legitimate dealer who had a bunch of these in the early 1990s did NOT sell them as game used, but claimed in the first price list he offered them in that he had 75 of them.:eek: :eek: :eek:

[TNTtoys]

Nick, a legitimate dealer who had a bunch of these in the early 1990s did NOT sell them as game used

And there lies the problem... we're 20 years into the future and nobody (apart from perhaps a couple of guys -- yourself included) would have even seen this first-hand. Some of these will be sold as gamers (we have seen many of them come through auction houses who should know better). Some of these will be correctly listed without the "game used" notations; however, the uneducated buyer might see the team tagging and jump on it in thinking they are getting the bargain of the century. The hobby has a lot of newcomers who will have never heard of Scoreboard... and I'm happy to say that this site is there to educate against this very scenario.

[commando]

I was unable to find any SCORE BOARD advertising for the Jefferies jersey, but have added photos of it to the reference thread. I lifted the images of two different jerseys that are on eBay at the moment.

Thanks -- Anthony

[trsent]

I was unable to find any SCORE BOARD advertising for the Jefferies jersey, but have added photos of it to the reference thread. I lifted the images of two different jerseys that are on eBay at the moment.

Thanks -- Anthony

What's interesting is that the jersey being sold as a game used jersey is not autographed, and generally Scoreboard jerseys were all autographed. The other jersey is being sold as just an autographed jersey with a $39.99 opening bid.

The tagging inside each jersey does appear identical and the stitching on front appears identical or at least very similar. I did not compare stitching on the back.

[sox83cubs84]

What's interesting is that the jersey being sold as a game used jersey is not autographed, and generally Scoreboard jerseys were all autographed. The other jersey is being sold as just an autographed jersey with a $39.99 opening bid.

The tagging inside each jersey does appear identical and the stitching on front appears identical or at least very similar. I did not compare stitching on the back.

Joel:

For reasons I am not privy to, the Jefferies shirts, unlike other Score Board retail tagged jerseys, were NOT signed.

Dave Miedema

[trsent]

Joel:

For reasons I am not privy to, the Jefferies shirts, unlike other Score Board retail tagged jerseys, were NOT signed.

Dave Miedema

Interesting. So the one at auction, not being sold as game used was signed later if this is fact.

So the next question is, did Scoreboard actually own and sell these jerseys or were they made for someone else, similar to Scoreboard? I guess it is possible Scoreboard bought them but never had them signed and sold them privately or unsigned.

It should also be remembered, the jerseys were 100% authentic, pro-cut style jerseys that at the time I'm pretty sure there was zero intent that they would be sold as game used years down the road.