What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

[Masimen]

It seems that recently we have had 2 disputes on this board where members have claimed that other members or well respected companies are misrepresenting items they have and that the real item is actually in their possession and not that of the other member/company. While I take no sides in either of those arguments, what I don't understand is that in both cases the folks who are throwing up the red flags are not willing to show us their purported item. Both of whom claim they have photo matches.

If you aren't willing to show your item, which is totally understandable, then why raise the red flag on a public forum? I understand that you may not want people to know or see what you have, but if that is the case, I think it best that you just leave it alone or contact the other party privately.

The other thing that is a bit perplexing to me is that the 2 items in question, while being very cool and not cheap by any standard aren't exactly super high end items likely to be Copied, or sought out for some sort of nefarious activity. We are talking about a bat that on a good day is probably worth a few grand and a helmet that I am guessing is in the same ballpark. I think that if this issues goes to a public forum for all to see, then at least show us some evidence so we can all make an informed decision/judgment.

Apologies if I offended anyone, this is just something that seems a bit odd to me.

[therealaxis]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

I completely agree well said!

[therealaxis]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

I completely agree well said!

Wish you could edit...

I forgot to add at least with the helmet situation the op has no problems sending photos to mods instead of expecting people to meet him at a airport 1000's of miles away to see the item in question!

[frikativ54]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

Again - Totally agree with the OP. If you've got the goods, then do share them. It always makes me wonder when people claim they have some really rare item but are unwilling to show pics.

-Frik

[BU54CB]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

I guess I don't understand why posting the photos of the items is such a big deal? There are countless threads in this forum that members have voluntarily photos posted of items and collections that run the spectrum of value.

In my short time as a member, I don't recall seeing any posts from members claiming someone has mis-appropriated their photos or something bad happenning to their items because they posted them in this forum.

[MLB_Authentic]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

Is it possible he is AFRAID to post it because he believes that it may be proven NOT AUTHENTIC??

[xpress34]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

Is it possible he is AFRAID to post it because he believes that it may be proven NOT AUTHENTIC??

That's what my thoughts are as well.

The claim always seems to be that they don't want the item or it's features to be 'copied'.

I am certain that posting pics of your items will lead to mass copies going into production... all you have to do is show SOME pics of the item that show the Game Use - you don't necessarily need to show things like writing under the bill that is unique to the player or whatever.

I just don't get it - I've always been more than happy to show pics.

All the best -

Smitty

[Greenbaumer]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

In reference to that thread from earlier bashing JO, not only is all my GU Jets stuff from them, but the Vice President of the Jets told me himself that all of their game worn stuff goes to JO and that they cannot get me anything through the team because of their contract with JO. Take that for what it's worth.

The other thread was obviously a guy with some time on his hands trying to bad mouth a company he couldn't get a good deal with. It's stuff like that that usually makes me stay away from message boards/chats/forums/etc.

Have a good night.

[josportsco]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

Here is our helmet match. we are doing more work on it as we speak. I would love to add more now but we sent the helmet to arenas01 to view.
Also notice the indention in the decal above the GAL in "Bengals" perfect match. We will post better matches when the helmet is back in our hands.

[solarlottry]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

The photo match is sweet with the stripes and the stickers acting like pinstripes on a Yankees shirt. We now have one side of the story at least with regards to whose helmet is a photo match! It will be interesting to see how the OP follows this up.

The entire thread is just another example of people speaking before thinking. If someone has a problem go to the moderator first. Years ago I purchased some 49er gamers from someone and they were not quite as advertised. Instead of going " public" I asked for some help via Chris Cav. and guess what- the entire situation was resolved with both parties happy.

Always buying 1994 49ers and ANY shirt with a team letter
Paul
garciajones@yahoo.com

[BU54CB]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

The photo match is sweet with the stripes and the stickers acting like pinstripes on a Yankees shirt. We now have one side of the story at least with regards to whose helmet is a photo match! It will be interesting to see how the OP follows this up.

The entire thread is just another example of people speaking before thinking. If someone has a problem go to the moderator first. Years ago I purchased some 49er gamers from someone and they were not quite as advertised. Instead of going " public" I asked for some help via Chris Cav. and guess what- the entire situation was resolved with both parties happy.

Always buying 1994 49ers and ANY shirt with a team letter
Paul
garciajones@yahoo.com

I agree, that's exactly how things should be handled. What kills me with this situation is nothing was bought or sold, someone just had a grudge they chose to express the absolute wrong way.

[beavisrules]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

I guess I don't understand why posting the photos of the items is such a big deal? There are countless threads in this forum that members have voluntarily photos posted of items and collections that run the spectrum of value.

BU54CB,
I am actually going to give you a different perspective on why I don't post many pics - it's because many of these pics may then serve as "templates" to those who like to "doctor" ND jerseys.
In the past 3 years, I have seen more mis-represented or altered ND "game worn" jerseys then I have seen of true, quality game worn jerseys (excluding the modern day gamers with Steiner letters, which are fine and legit). And I don't just mean ebay - many major auction houses have also had bad jerseys, and yes, I have contacted them to alert them - most don't respond or tell me not to bid if I don't like the item, which I find sad because their knowledge of ND gamers is minimal at best. In particular, my favorite response is "the source is good" - so apparently even though Notre Dame NEVER wore green jerseys in 2003, it is ok to sell a green ND jersey tagged 2003 as game worn instead of team issue, I guess. I started a thread on general ND jersey information a while back that I need to resume, but again, I am keeping it general to aspects of the jersey that would take a heroic effort to alter (sleeve style, etc). I think it is really sad how much bad/altered product there is out on the market, and my lack of spending money on game used items over the past year definitely goes along with this. Anyway, this is why I am cautious about posting pics, because at least I can still typically discern a gamer from a team issue from a fake because there is such a lack of easy access to close up ND gamer pics, especially from the 1980s and 1990s.

[solarlottry]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

BU54CB,
I am actually going to give you a different perspective on why I don't post many pics - it's because many of these pics may then serve as "templates" to those who like to "doctor" ND jerseys.
In the past 3 years, I have seen more mis-represented or altered ND "game worn" jerseys then I have seen of true, quality game worn jerseys (excluding the modern day gamers with Steiner letters, which are fine and legit). And I .don't just mean ebay - many major auction houses have also had bad jerseys, and yes, I have contacted them to alert them - most don't respond or tell me not to bid if I don't like the item, which I find sad because their knowledge of ND gamers is minimal at best. In particular, my favorite response is "the source is good" - so apparently even though Notre Dame NEVER wore green jerseys in 2003, it is ok to sell a green ND jersey tagged 2003 as game worn instead of team issue, I guess. I started a thread on general ND jersey information a while back that I need to resume, but again, I am keeping it general to aspects of the jersey that would take a heroic effort to alter (sleeve style, etc). I think it is really sad how much bad/altered product there is out on the market, and my lack of spending money on game used items over the past year definitely goes along with this. Anyway, this is why I am cautious about posting pics, because at least I can still typically discern a gamer from a team issue from a fake because there is such a lack of easy access to close up ND gamer pics, especially from the 1980s and 1990s.

I understand your point about not wanting to post pics which would give forgers more information to use to make the finished product. The problem with that that is that pictures are everywhere already. NFL, NBA auctions, all the major auction houses, eBay etc etc. If someone is going to make a fake shirt and they are that good at it chances are your few images are not going to change that fact. Maybe someone will see your images and realize that a shirt is a fake and not buy and stop the forger from producing them. I think it can go both ways. Posted images can be used as a valuable learning source for collectors and as a way to weed out bad shirts so, as with everything in life, there is risk and benefits. What kind of hobby would game used collecting be if everyone just bought the stuff they liked and hoarded it in a dark room for only themselves to look at. What fun is that. A good part of the satisfaction of this hobby is sharing the stuff you like with others and to not do that due to fear seems like the forgers have already won. Criminals like a to fill a void and they are going to make shirts regardless of what we do. If we don't continue to share the stuff we like, communicate with each other and weed out the bad stuff then the hobby is sure to suffer.

[Jules9]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?







These pictures are from Daylife and can be enlarged there. Looks like you can see the white scratch on the stripes.

[cliffjmp33]

Re: What gives with not showing us your item when you claim you have the real deal and someone else doesn't?

I know the other thread is closed, but here is a photo from Bengals/Colts on 11/14/10 by AP attributed to Chad's helmet and you can obviously see the difference in style.

As for why people don't post, I love seeing peoples collections, but I don't mind if they don't want to. It is their choice. The one thing that I thought of as I followed the thread was the possibility that a person may be afraid of having their item stolen. I know that it is a worst-case scenario, but we're talking about items that could range well over four and five figures. Just a thought, but I don't blame anyone for not wanting to share either.

Here's the pic...Photo credit to the Associated Press (Mods, if any copyrights are violated, please remove pic).