Mets "#41" jersey on ebay. I wonder who wore #41 for the Mets?

[metsmetsmets]

Auction on ebay for what is purported to be a 1973 road Mets jersey, #41. As "near as the seller can tell":

(IT HAS THE NUMBER 41 ON IT AND AS NEAR AS I CAN TELL, THAT IS THE ROAD COLORED JERSEY. IT IS A SIZE 46)

The auction listing includes this odd non-sequitur:

(THIS #35 JERSEY IS VERY POSSIBLY ONE WORN BY RUDY LARUSSO IN THE 1960'S. CAN'T PROVE IT, BUT CAN'T FIND ANOTHER PLAYER WHO WORE THE SAME NUMBER.)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-YORK-METS-JERSEY-41-WILSON-SZ-46-WORN-USED-COND-/190573803052?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c5f15762c

Shouldn't the "#1" digit in "#41" extend beyond the "K" in York?

[Dolphins23]

Yes it should extend past the K. Wouldn't trust this guy.

[Dolphins23]

Its proably a Minor Leauge jersey.

[sox83cubs84]

Nope...it's a bogus MLB jersey. The collar tag font isn't consistent with Wilson Mets road gamers of the era, and the Wilson tag is a 1979-86 design on an alleged 1973 jersey. AVOID!!

Dave Miedema

[hiramman]

Smooth way to list it on ebay with all of the photos showing Tom Seaver and then calling it a #41 jersey. He's just hoping someone will look past all of the inconsistencies and greedily think they are stealing a star jersey at a good price. Scam 101.

[metsmetsmets]

Smooth way to list it on ebay with all of the photos showing Tom Seaver and then calling it a #41 jersey. He's just hoping someone will look past all of the inconsistencies and greedily think they are stealing a star jersey at a good price. Scam 101.

The Seaver photos were mine. I posted them at the end of my thread-starting post to compare with the seller's #41 jersey.

[Doodles]

The front numbers look pretty close to the original...love to see what's on the back and the sleeve patch.

[metsmetsmets]

More BS from the seller.

1) He won't include pictures of the back of the jersey because (he claims) the auction ends in less than 48 hours and there is not enough time to provide additional photos -- even though the auction ends on 9/14, four days from now.

2) He won't acknowledge or even address the in-authenticity of his collar and Wilson tags on grounds that he is a co-signee selling the jersey on behalf of the original owner and therefore, is bound by whatever information the original seller has provided him. As if his status as co-signee absolves him from listing the item accurately and honestly.

[Metsfan808]

The seller sent me the following pictures of the black & the sleeve patch after I pointed out that there are more than 48 hours until the auction ends:

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q285/metsfan808/100_6559.jpg
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q285/metsfan808/100_6557.jpg

[cohibasmoker]

Nope...it's a bogus MLB jersey. The collar tag font isn't consistent with Wilson Mets road gamers of the era, and the Wilson tag is a 1979-86 design on an alleged 1973 jersey. AVOID!!

Dave Miedema

Here are some 1973 jerseys to consider.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1973-New-York-Mets-Game-Used-Jersey-George-Theodore-/330562791739#ht_720wt_1059


Jim

[metsmetsmets]

The seller sent me the following pictures of the black & the sleeve patch after I pointed out that there are more than 48 hours until the auction ends:



So if the seller was able to send you those pictures shortly after you requested them, then what's the deal with his 48 hour rule? Why did he originally balk at sending extra pictures when it's now apparent that he's able to send them almost immediately? And why can't he just add the pictures to the auction page?

[Dolphins23]

So if the seller was able to send you those pictures shortly after you requested them, then what's the deal with his 48 hour rule? Why did he originally balk at sending extra pictures when it's now apparent that he's able to send them almost immediately? And why can't he just add the pictures to the auction page?

I'll tell ya why, because hes a FRAUD!!!!!! DO NOT BUY HIS GARBAGE! I don't believe for a second that he is eh consigner. Its def all his items and hes a lier!

[metsmetsmets]

I'll tell ya why, because hes a FRAUD!!!!!! DO NOT BUY HIS GARBAGE! I don't believe for a second that he is eh consigner. Its def all his items and hes a lier!

Oh, I know that. I was being rhetorical. :)

[sox83cubs84]

Jim:

While both the Berra and the Theodore detoured to the minors (Mets front) before joining our hobby, they are both solid, with tags that look like they're supposed to.

Dave Miedema

[Doodles]

The patch looks authentic...the back numbers look good. If you realize that this jersey is probably not a game-worn Seaver, it still looks much better than any Mitchell and Ness replica that goes for $300.

[LHG39]

Exactly. He is not exactly trying to pass this off as a game used Seaver jersey. Now, he doesn't discourage anyone who wants to think that on their own, but as Doodles said, it is at least as good as a Mitchell and Ness.



The patch looks authentic...the back numbers look good. If you realize that this jersey is probably not a game-worn Seaver, it still looks much better than any Mitchell and Ness replica that goes for $300.

[metsmetsmets]

Sold! For $885.00. For that amount of money, I'm guessing that the winning bidder thinks he has a game used Seaver jersey.

[LHG39]

Sold! For $885.00. For that amount of money, I'm guessing that the winning bidder thinks he has a game used Seaver jersey.

I would have to agree with you on that.

[Doodles]

I would have to agree with you on that.

Assuming it isn't authentic, any ideas on what is a possible story behind it? It really looks tot good to be all faked.

[metsmetsmets]

Assuming it isn't authentic, any ideas on what is a possible story behind it? It really looks tot good to be all faked.

I have a theory. I remember that Mitchell & Ness, in the late '90's, before the internet took off, before M&N became hugely popular, when M&N had no internet presence and used to print color brochures of their inventory, they did a limited run on polyester '73 style Mets jerseys. Perhaps, the auctioned ebay jersey originally an M&N jersey from that '73 run, altered to resemble a game used '73. I can't say for sure because I don't own an M&N '73 Mets jersey, and never saw one. But it's a theory.

[Doodles]

That means they went out and got an authentic team issue sleeve patch and changed the tag from M&N to Wilson...I don't think so. I'm not a top expert, but the inside collar is white which matches the real jerseys and the button placement also looks identical. I doubt M&N would have duplicated that.

I think it could be a Mets 1973 authentic jersey with a number change. Don't know about the Wilson tag...what makes it a 1979, vs. a 1973?

[metsmetsmets]

That means they went out and got an authentic team issue sleeve patch and changed the tag from M&N to Wilson...I don't think so. I'm not a top expert, but the inside collar is white which matches the real jerseys and the button placement also looks identical. I doubt M&N would have duplicated that.

I think it could be a Mets 1973 authentic jersey with a number change. Don't know about the Wilson tag...what makes it a 1979, vs. a 1973?

The 1979's look nothing like the 1973's.

[TNTtoys]

Guys,

I am just catching up with this thread now. And I must say that whoever paid nearly $900.00 for this jersey got taken to the cleaners.

Where do I begin...

1. The strip tag is absolutely fake.
As compared to multiple other strip tags found on 1973 Mets jerseys...
The material is WRONG.
The number 41...the 4 is incorrect and the 1 is incorrect
The number 46...the 4 is incorrect and the 6 is incorrect
The number 73...the 7 is incorrect and the 3 is incorrect
There is NOTHING correct about this tag.

2. The size is ridiculous. There is no way Tom Seaver was a size 46 in 1973. He wore this size jersey 10-12 years later, when he was much older.

3. This one I would assume not many would be able to spot, because it is very subtle. The sleeve patch (Mets skyline) is from a jersey of 1974 or later.

4. I know it's been said before -- the Wilson tag is incorrect for a 1973 jersey. This tag did not come into existence until 1978. It was obviously placed on the jersey at some later stage. For those of you reading who don't understand the differences between the 1973 and the 1978-1985 tag, please refer to post #1 on this thread:
http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=8660


My theory on this jersey...

It is a 1974 or 1975 road gamer with a fabricated strip tag, a replaced Wilson tag and a very good number change. And a travesty.

[Doodles]

Guys,

I am just catching up with this thread now. And I must say that whoever paid nearly $900.00 for this jersey got taken to the cleaners.

Where do I begin...

1. The strip tag is absolutely fake.
As compared to multiple other strip tags found on 1973 Mets jerseys...
The material is WRONG.
The number 41...the 4 is incorrect and the 1 is incorrect
The number 46...the 4 is incorrect and the 6 is incorrect
The number 73...the 7 is incorrect and the 3 is incorrect
There is NOTHING correct about this tag.

2. The size is ridiculous. There is no way Tom Seaver was a size 46 in 1973. He wore this size jersey 10-12 years later, when he was much older.

3. This one I would assume not many would be able to spot, because it is very subtle. The sleeve patch (Mets skyline) is from a jersey of 1974 or later.

4. I know it's been said before -- the Wilson tag is incorrect for a 1973 jersey. This tag did not come into existence until 1978. It was obviously placed on the jersey at some later stage. For those of you reading who don't understand the differences between the 1973 and the 1978-1985 tag, please refer to post #1 on this thread:
http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=8660


My theory on this jersey...

It is a 1974 or 1975 road gamer with a fabricated strip tag, a replaced Wilson tag and a very good number change. And a travesty.

You are then saying the Mets script was removed and the prior to 1974 "New York" placed on...wouldn't that leave serious marks on the jersey? I guess we need to examine it, which is unlikely.

[TNTtoys]

You are then saying the Mets script was removed and the prior to 1974 "New York" placed on...wouldn't that leave serious marks on the jersey? I guess we need to examine it, which is unlikely.

One way or another, the front logo and the back numbers were removed. If the jersey was a 1973 or earlier, the "NEW YORK" would have been removed and replaced with "Mets" when recycled through the minors. For example, the George "Stork" Theodore jersey. In this case (pre-1974), the jersey would have been stripped not once but twice.

Fact of the matter (and I think you nailed it) is that all of this is speculation without having the jersey in front of us to be able to examine.

Course, how it came about is secondary to the fact that there are obvious problems with it -- such as bogus strip tag and bogus manufacturer tag. There were enough issues there for me to stop analyzing and conclude that it's a bad jersey.

I wonder if the buyer reads the forum...hmmmm...

[Doodles]

One way or another, the front logo and the back numbers were removed. If the jersey was a 1973 or earlier, the "NEW YORK" would have been removed and replaced with "Mets" when recycled through the minors. For example, the George "Stork" Theodore jersey. In this case (pre-1974), the jersey would have been stripped not once but twice.

Fact of the matter (and I think you nailed it) is that all of this is speculation without having the jersey in front of us to be able to examine.

Course, how it came about is secondary to the fact that there are obvious problems with it -- such as bogus strip tag and bogus manufacturer tag. There were enough issues there for me to stop analyzing and conclude that it's a bad jersey.

I wonder if the buyer reads the forum...hmmmm...

There did exist at one point an authentic 1973 Seaver 41 road...this is probably not it...do you think the Mets recycled Seaver's jersey too, knowing he was already a two-time Cy Young winner and potential Hall of Famer? Or did they keep that one in its original form for posterity?

[TNTtoys]

There did exist at one point an authentic 1973 Seaver 41 road...this is probably not it...do you think the Mets recycled Seaver's jersey too, knowing he was already a two-time Cy Young winner and potential Hall of Famer? Or did they keep that one in its original form for posterity?

It would make sense that they would hold onto some of the star player jerseys like Seaver... but to tell you the truth, nothing would surprise me. I have seen multiple Darryl Strawberry mid-80's gamers that were recycled.

I even met a fellow collector who found Nolan Ryan's late 1960s road flannel in a dumpster outside the stadium. Forum member UltimetFan was with me when I was shown the Ryan... and our jaws dropped in sync.

[Doodles]

It would make sense that they would hold onto some of the star player jerseys like Seaver... but to tell you the truth, nothing would surprise me. I have seen multiple Darryl Strawberry mid-80's gamers that were recycled.

I even met a fellow collector who found Nolan Ryan's late 1960s road flannel in a dumpster outside the stadium. Forum member UltimetFan was with me when I was shown the Ryan... and our jaws dropped in sync.

WOW

:eek:

[metsmetsmets]

It's back.