New scam -- forged sidewriting on vintage bats

[BoneRubbedBat]

I knew it would only be a matter of time before we would start seeing it. We have already had to deal with forged autographs, contrived game-use, sewing creativity on jerseys, and undisclosed repairs on items. It now appears that some unscrupulous individuals are obtaining legitimate early blank-barreled bats, and placing their own H&B factory "sidewriting" on them. A couple of "stars" are on e-bay right now. The handwriting style, placement, and instrument used do not appear consistent with any examples I have ever seen. While these forgeries are laughable to the majority of vintage bat collectors, the sellers of these bats are marketing them in a way as to deceive buyers, but have chosen their verbage very carefully in their descriptions.

What bothers me the most is not that the bats are being sold, but the fact that some very nice vintage bats had to be ruined in the process. What a shame.

[sportscentury]

Marcus,

I saw a Joe Jackson bat that I questioned with respect to this issue - is this one of the bats to which you are referring.

Thanks for your post.
Reid

[brianborsch]

What about the Joe Sewell bat on ebay? It is froma reputable source, but it has name etched, it just says Joe sewell and some date. How can you tell if this was an actual bat used to make Joe Sewells bats?

Brian B

[BoneRubbedBat]

Reid,

I didn't name names yet because I am awaiting responses from the sellers per forum rules, but you are on the right track.



Brian,

The Sewell bat is a great bat, and not one of the ones in question. As a general rule, I don't question anything that Left Field Collectibles/Art Jaffe is selling. Art is one of the most knowledgeable and honest guys in the business. Art has forgotten more about vintage bats than most of us could ever strive to know. The handwriting on the Sewell bat is consistent with other H&B factory bats. Some of the lathe and master bats do not have any stampings on them, as they were not being prepared for player use, only for internal usage in reproducing those player model bats. The bats that Art has originated from the H&B factory "find", so the source is as good as it gets.

[sportscentury]

What about the Joe Sewell bat on ebay? It is froma reputable source, but it has name etched, it just says Joe sewell and some date. How can you tell if this was an actual bat used to make Joe Sewells bats?

Brian B

Brian and Marcus,

Would you please post (or email me) the link to the Sewell bat? I could not find it. Thank you.

And Marcus, thanks for your responses.

Reid

[sportscentury]

Never mind. Found it:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-Bat-joe-Sewell-era-circa-1935-Yankees_W0QQitemZ270014938155

Marcus,

Is this a gamer? Interesting bat. Side-writing but no factory markings at all ... a homemade bat, I presume.

Reid

[BoneRubbedBat]

Reid,

I can't tell without seeing the ends of the bat, but I do have some examples like this in my collection, with and without lathe "nubs" on the ends. All are unused and have no stamping on them, just sidewriting. H&B used these as "masters" for creating new bats for the player sidewritten on the master. I am fairly certain that they were produced internally by H&B just for this purpose.

[sicollector1954@insightbb.com]

If you are correct--someone just spent A LOT of money for about a $100.00 to $200.00 bat! Best offer of $3200.00 plus was just taken.

[suave1477]

Well I would say that bat is worth a lot more then $100 to $200. I have seen lathe bats go for very high, not to mention vintage Yankees bats.

[corsairs25]

In reference to that Joe Jackson bat---in addition to noting the anomaloous side writing, I checked the seller's feedback transactions and found that the seller bought a dash--dot--dash LS bat back on Aug. 6 that looks a lot like the Jackson bat---except it didn't seem to have any sidewriting back then. If only every suspicious item were so easy to trace. Mark.

[sicollector1954@insightbb.com]

What did he pay for it without any sidewriting? Just curious.

[karamaxjoe]

This is about as blatant a ripoff as it gets. The seller paid $177.50 in an ebay auction in August and forged the sidewriting on the bat. The pictures match up perfectly. It incredible how by writing Joe Jackson on a bat will make you about $3000.00 Here's the link which tells the whole story:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=60596&item=300012904725

[b.heagy]

Looks like a match to me. Amazing how the grease writing went from barely legible to clearly legible in a matter of a month:eek: .

"The bat has the usual grease pencil marking on the side of the bat that is quite faint. I can’t make out what it says and I think it would be difficult for anyone to read it." as stated in the original listing when it was bought for the $177.50

Would it be possible to carefully clean the surface to enhance the grease pencil writing?:confused:

[brianborsch]

So is anyone going to try to contact the seller before he pays?

This is ridiculous! What shiesty sellers there are out there! I feel sorry for the guy...

[karamaxjoe]

The buyer claims he cancelled his offer and I reported the transaction to ebay.

[corsairs25]

Karamaxjoe,
I'm very glad to hear that the buyer didn't pay up. I sent him a message and also contacted ebay soon after I read on this board that he'd bought the bat and then noticed how the seller had purchased an astonishingly similar but unwritten bat in August. I'd bet that this forum saved the guy 3 grand. As I think about all the bats I've bought over the years, I'd say I've been very fortunate and that I really hate to see people tarnish the hobby.

[BoneRubbedBat]

Here is the other one.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=019&item=290029477276&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

I have had two sidewritten Honus Wagner bats in the past couple of years, and neither of them looked remotely close to this. Another nice vintage bat ruined.


Does anyone know who "championshipsportsinvestments" is? Inquiring minds want to know.....

[BoneRubbedBat]

And the answer is..........

Peter Freund
c/o Trinity Packaging Corp.
84 Business Park Drive
Armonk, NY 10504


Anyone have any more insight into this person?

[eGameUsed]

Marcus,

I recently sold Peter a game used Barry Bonds hat on eBay. It was signed, GAI authenticated for the hat, PSA/DNA authenticated on the auto. Not much he could forge there I guess. Here is the link:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=50117&item=270020702343

My experience was good; he paid and I shipped!

E-mail me Marcus, we need to catch up!

Thanks,

[BoneRubbedBat]

Peter's at it again. The fake Joe Jackson bat is back on e-bay.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Shoeless-Joe-Jackson-Black-White-Sox-Game-Used-Bat_W0QQitemZ230038388142QQihZ013QQcategoryZ60596Q QrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[earlywynnfan]

I just made him an offer of $177.50, exactly what he paid for it!!

Think he'll take it??

ken

[BoneRubbedBat]

I'm going $177.51 then. :D

[earlywynnfan]

somebody paid over $5600 for the forged shoeless joe bat!!

This kind of stuff really makes me angry!

Ken

[brianborsch]

The seller is at it again with this fake Joe Jackson bat. Buyer beware!!! I have already contacted the current high bidder:

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fore5k2ahy (http://myworld.ebay.com/fore5k2ahy/)http://pics.ebaystatic.com/aw/pics/s.gif( 135 (http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback&userid=fore5k2ahy&iid=230074926205)http://pics.ebaystatic.com/aw/pics/icon/iconTealStar_25x25.gif)