PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

[gnishiyama]

Just saw this Vlad jersey on Grey Flannel and interesting enough it
notes " This jersey is further accompanied by a LOA from PSA/DNA attesting to the photomatch."

A quick search shows no results but is PSA/DNA offering a new
photomatch service?

Also while on the topic how does any company actually offer photomatching
services? While bats and pinstriped jerseys are quite easy I'm looking
for a service that uses scales and other measures to get a photomatch
for road jerseys. I've heard Meigray does and their website does offer
authentication but it seems to be only for hockey jerseys. I've seen
MEARS LOAs but for modern jerseys they seem to limit their authentication
to 'style match' unless its a high end item.

[emann]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

When I saw this listing, my assumption is that it was a piece that originated with JT Sports and Taube included a LOA attesting to the photomatch.

I've seen him sell equipment, other than bats, on his website with photomatch LOAs included before. Someone on GUU owns a Pedroia photomatched ALCS jersey that I distinctly remember presented on JT's website w/ a photomatch LOA from PSA/DNA).

[gnishiyama]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

Also while on the topic how does any company actually offer photomatching
services?

What I meant to ask was does any company actually offer photomatching
services?

Emann, I thought the same thing as well.

[David]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

I don't know how it could be offered at a price collector's would find palatable. Think of the time involved.

[xpress34]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

I don't know how it could be offered at a price collector's would find palatable. Think of the time involved.

Time? You mean like how much time they put into each signature they verify?

I'm sure they would charge you handsomely and if they can't find a photo match, still keep your fee just like when they can't verify your item is legit, but can't really call it fake either and they still keep your money for the time they spent trying to authenticate it.

[trsent]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

Time? You mean like how much time they put into each signature they verify?

I'm sure they would charge you handsomely and if they can't find a photo match, still keep your fee just like when they can't verify your item is legit, but can't really call it fake either and they still keep your money for the time they spent trying to authenticate it.

I'm curious, do you know firsthand how much time they spend verifying each signature or are you just assuming?

[Jags Fan Dan]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

I don't know how it could be offered at a price collector's would find palatable. Think of the time involved.

I don't know, if you are just obtaining measurements and dimensions and things, it might not be that bad. As a property claims adjuster, I can get very detailed roof measurements on very complex roofs from satellite images from a company for $50. Maybe something comparable could be found to do the same with game images? I don't know...

[xpress34]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

I'm curious, do you know firsthand how much time they spend verifying each signature or are you just assuming?

Joel -

I did a very detailed breakdown on this issue about a year or so ago based on numbers taken DIRECTLY from PSA/DNA's site.

How many items they had AUTHENTICATED to that point divided by the number of years that they have been in existence from their 'about us' page and presuming they had 10 employees and them working 24 hours a day ended up allowing less than 1/2 an hour per item and that would include them receiving the item, researching it, photographing, writing the opinion, applying the invisible daub and sticker, and shipping out and NOT including items that they have REJECTED.

I have written and asked how many employees they have and have never received an answer, so I can only go with a projected number.

They currently claim 19,077,518 items CERTIFIED (I have to guess this means autos, grading, etc) as of 5/12/12 claiming they were founded in 1998. That is 14 years of business.

This is based on a one man crew to get a base number:
19,077,518 items / 14 years = 1,362,679 items per Year / 365 = 3,733 items per Day / 24 = 155 items per hour / 60 = 2.6 items per minute.

Even if they have 100 employees working 24 hours a day (meaning all 100 are working every minute of everyday), that would boost it to 4 hours and 20 minutes per item. Again, that time would have to include the unpacking, photos, research, writing the letter, printing the letter, packing to ship out, etc.

If they had those same 100 employees ONLY working 8 hour shifts EVERY day, then that number (4hrs 20min) gets dropped to 1hr 26 minutes to get all of that stuff done.

I understand they do player signings and such, but even with those basically pre-certified items, it wouldn't dent these numbers that much. It's not like they are getting a couple of thousand 'in person' signed items each day.

So no, I don't know '1st hand', but the numbers are THEIR numbers, not mine.

If you presume they actually only work a normal 5 day, 8 hour a day shift with weekend shows thrown in, those numbers go down even further. That final number is based on them working around the clock every day, no breaks, no days off.

Either they are over estimating how many items they have 'Certified' or there is no way they are giving each item the time and care that it requires.

If those are the numbers for 'certifying' items, how much time do YOU think they would put into photo-matching?

- Smitty

Granted, these are only 'avg' numbers - but don't forget - they don't include the handling of and writing letters for items that are rejected each day.

[xpress34]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

OOPS... I used the number of ITEMS not amt of time when I did the math for 100 employees, so let's revisit this again and the numbers are even more staggering and mind numbing to even think about what they charge for their 'service'...

@ 1 employee working 24 hours a day, they do 2.6 items a minute, that's LESS than 20 seconds per item.

@ 100 employees, that means they are spending 2000 seconds (roughly 33.3 minutes) per item IF they are working 24 Hrs a day, so realistically for an 8 hr day, they are spending just over 10 minutes per item to do ALL of the steps.

Yep. That sounds like they really put a WHOLE lot of work into each 'certification'.

- Smitty

[solarlottry]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

Does anyone have any idea what MEARS or a similar service charges to evaluate and photo-match a mid 90s NFL game worn jersey?

I am wondering what forum members think is fair to charge for the evaluation and photo-matching of game worn jerseys from the 1980s to present?

I know Dave Miedema offers a service to authenticate jerseys. He charged me 50$, if I remember correctly, to write an LOA for a mid 80s Bears Jim Harbaugh gamer I own. I sent him the jersey plus all of my research, which included images that I thought were photo-matches.

One would think that to provide a definitive photo-match, which can both authenticate and increase (sometimes substantially) the value of an item, that it would depend on the difficulty of the photo-match.

To provide a match of a jersey from the last 5 seasons, with the use of NFL rewind and high def DVD should cost less than matching up a jersey from 1981 thru the late 90s. The question is how much of a difference?

If any fellow members would like to chime in please do so!

Always buying 49er game worn jerseys, paying a finders fee and matching all offers on things I want.

Paul
garciajones@yahoo.com

[David]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

I was thinking the cost would include the man hours of finding the a photo(s) that photo matched. Searching one's photo archives.

A possible way to make money is for someone to maintain a massive online photo archive and charge for collectors to search through them. The money would be in having the archive. Hiring someone to look through their archives for you is like hiring a librarian. And paying someone for an expert opinion that a photo is a genuine official match is another thing.

[David]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

Sarlotty's post involved providing the expert with the photo, which was different than what I was thinking about.

[David]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

As far as PSA/DNA goes and, say autograph authentication, I think the experts can authenticate many autographs really quickly-- almost at first site--, and more time is spent on other, harder ones.

I used to work for Beckett as their outside photograph (not autographed) expert, and they would send me digital via email photos of hard ones, ones they had troubles dating. I can tell you I took more than 2 seconds looking at those. And, before you ask, I was giving them outside advice not authenticating the digital image.

[trsent]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

As far as PSA/DNA goes and, say autograph authentication, I think the experts can authenticate many autographs really quickly-- almost at first site--, and more time is spent on other, harder ones.

I used to work for Beckett as their outside photograph (not autographed) expert, and they would send me digital via email photos of hard ones, ones they had troubles dating. I can tell you I took more than 2 seconds looking at those. And, before you ask, I was giving them outside advice not authenticating the digital image.

David, the guy who attacks the authenticators also doesn't count "In The Presence" authentications which take place when a PSA/DNA staff member witnesses an autograph and puts a sticker on the item.

It is the same service I see MLB Authentic authenticators do at trade shows all the time. You can eat up a lot of numbers really quickly with such a service.

They also do not appreciate when you authenticate a common autograph is takes seconds, while more obscure autographs often take a lot of time.

[xpress34]

Re: PSA/DNA, New Photomatch Service?

David, the guy who attacks the authenticators also doesn't count "In The Presence" authentications which take place when a PSA/DNA staff member witnesses an autograph and puts a sticker on the item.

It is the same service I see MLB Authentic authenticators do at trade shows all the time. You can eat up a lot of numbers really quickly with such a service.

They also do not appreciate when you authenticate a common autograph is takes seconds, while more obscure autographs often take a lot of time.

Wow Joel -

You really know how to read, huh.

I understand they do player signings and such, but even with those basically pre-certified items, it wouldn't dent these numbers that much. It's not like they are getting a couple of thousand 'in person' signed items each day.

So yes, I DID take that into account. Without knowing how many people they employ (as I also mentioned), it is impossible to narrow it down to a 'specific' number, but even if every auto/certification was 'in person', there is still time involved to sticker the item, record the cert number, write the cert, enter it into the database, etc, etc.

No matter how you slice it, the numbers don't add up.

And again, I am not even figuring in time for TOUGH to cert autos, how long they spend GRADING a card (which I presume is part of the numbers they include in the 'certified' items count) or the time spent on bad items or items they can't quite certify but won't call 'fakes' either.

I am ONLY using the number of items they claim to have certified which implies items that they have authenticated, numbered, put in the database, etc. I would imaging that the number of BAD items they handle is at least 25% or more of the items they have 'certified' which would be approx another 5,000,00 items handled over the past 14 years.

So don't tell me what I 'appreciate' or don't take into consideration before you actually READ what I wrote.

- Smitty