Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

[Tunis]

Hello,

Those experts in photo matching, what are the chances of 2 different jerseys showing the same positioning of numbers and letters?

The reason I ask is that I am trying to photomatch 2 jerseys worn by Jose Lopez with the Rockies in 2011. They were all purchased from Kruk with game-used docs from the Rockies. I have a white pinstripe jersey that I feel is just game issued because I can't match it with any games. I have seen 2 variations and neither ones match mine.

The grey pinstripe jersey seems to be dead-on with 4 possible game matches so far.

Back to the question posed, is it most likely 1 jersey used in all four games, or possibly two jersey with same characteristics?

The games are between April 7 and May 7 of 2011. I still have a couple more games to check but this got me wondering.

Thanks in advance.

Paul

[Rob L]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

No two are the same. Even if the lettering on the front panels is the same, the front, back and sleeve panels never line the same.

[xpress34]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

No two are the same. Even if the lettering on the front panels is the same, the front, back and sleeve panels never line the same.

+1

I live in Denver and have owned quite a few Rockies jerseys - and like any Pinstripe jersey, each is like a finger print and each one is unique.

If your jersey has the CR on the chest area, those are even easier to match (providing you can find photos) due to all the unique point on the CR crest.

If you want to know more, feel free to contact me.

- Smitty

[rdeversole]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

No two are the same. Even if the lettering on the front panels is the same, the front, back and sleeve panels never line the same.

You'll come across a lot of similarities but if you're referencing the placement of logos and lettering, how the front and back stripes match at the top seam, and how the majestic and MLB logo or additional patches fall in the pinstripes.. You won't find two gamers exactly the same.

How the numbers fall on the pinstripes can be tricky because a lot of teams try to keep the look uniform (no pun intended), but it's pretty hard to letter the NOB the same way every time.

[CampWest]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

I'll try to find the pictures later, but I was looking at buying an Astros pinstripe jersey of Lance Berkman a year or two ago... I photomatched the front of the jersey 95% as far as I could tell to several games over a span of time, there were just a couple spots where I couldnt get a good picture or the seller's photos didnt include. And I thoroughly checked every single stripe visible in the photos I was working from. Almost made the purchase then found a few good pictures from the same span of games of the back of the jersey and decided to do the extra diligence. To my utter shock the back of the jersey was nowhere even near a match. Ultimately, I could not find a photomatch to the back of the jersey. I knew there were at least three pinstripe Berkman's from that year on the market and one showed tons of undeniable use and the other two were lightly worn if at all. And from the game photos I could really only find two different stripe patterns throughout the entire season. I wound up passing on the jersey as I could find no evidence based on the back of the jersey and the provenance/LOA of the jersey was somewhat unreliable.

I've always been somewhat skeptical of pinstripe and mesh hole matches, because I've seen some claim a match based on one or two stripes intersecting at a common spot that did not hold up to further scrutiny of the rest of the piece. That said, if you can find no inconsistencies, I think it adds a lot of certainty to its authenticity.

[CampWest]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

I'll try to find the pictures later, but I was looking at buying an Astros pinstripe jersey of Lance Berkman a year or two ago... I photomatched the front of the jersey 95% as far as I could tell to several games over a span of time, there were just a couple spots where I couldnt get a good picture or the seller's photos didnt include. And I thoroughly checked every single stripe visible in the photos I was working from. Almost made the purchase then found a few good pictures from the same span of games of the back of the jersey and decided to do the extra diligence. To my utter shock the back of the jersey was nowhere even near a match. Ultimately, I could not find a photomatch to the back of the jersey. I knew there were at least three pinstripe Berkman's from that year on the market and one showed tons of undeniable use and the other two were lightly worn if at all. And from the game photos I could really only find two different stripe patterns throughout the entire season. I wound up passing on the jersey as I could find no evidence based on the back of the jersey and the provenance/LOA of the jersey was somewhat unreliable.

I've always been somewhat skeptical of pinstripe and mesh hole matches, because I've seen some claim a match based on one or two stripes intersecting at a common spot that did not hold up to further scrutiny of the rest of the piece. That said, if you can find no inconsistencies, I think it adds a lot of certainty to its authenticity.

Also, the one jersey with undeniable use, I photomatched to April through Mid September, when he then switched to the second set jersey which provided a false front match and blew the back match.

[rdeversole]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

I've always been somewhat skeptical of pinstripe and mesh hole matches, because I've seen some claim a match based on one or two stripes intersecting at a common spot that did not hold up to further scrutiny of the rest of the piece. That said, if you can find no inconsistencies, I think it adds a lot of certainty to its authenticity.

Agreed. The whole jersey and all of the potential match locations should be carefully examined when making a decision. I find the top jersey seam where the front and back pieces of material meet to be the most compelling evidence towards confirming or ruling out the possibility of a match.

[Klattsy]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

Great thread, I was only thinking about this yesterday and was going to post a question. Thanks Paul.

[jbean023]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

Hello,

Those experts in photo matching, what are the chances of 2 different jerseys showing the same positioning of numbers and letters?

The reason I ask is that I am trying to photomatch 2 jerseys worn by Jose Lopez with the Rockies in 2011. They were all purchased from Kruk with game-used docs from the Rockies. I have a white pinstripe jersey that I feel is just game issued because I can't match it with any games. I have seen 2 variations and neither ones match mine.

The grey pinstripe jersey seems to be dead-on with 4 possible game matches so far.

Back to the question posed, is it most likely 1 jersey used in all four games, or possibly two jersey with same characteristics?

The games are between April 7 and May 7 of 2011. I still have a couple more games to check but this got me wondering.

Thanks in advance.

Paul

Paul,

The Rockies are still one of the great teams and don't flood the market with jerseys. The majority of players use 2 jerseys each season of each style. 2 blacks, 2 purples,2 white,2 grey. They usually change on memorial day or the AS break. I got all this info from the gentleman in charge of Rockies game used, so its likely your jersey was worn for months.



Thanks
Jacob

[Tunis]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

Guys,

Thanks for all the great replies and thoughts. As Jose Lopez is (was) my favorite player, I picked up several of his jerseys from Kruk at decent prices. I do not have a Purple jersey, however

Lopez's first game was April 1, 2011 and his last was May 26, 2011 before he was released.

I have 2 Black vest jerseys, 1 Grey pinstripe and 1 White pinstripe.

I am still working on the photomatching of the Grey pinstripe. I believe he wore it on April 7, April 8, April 22, May 7, and May 19

I still have 7 more games to look at.

Thanks to the above information, once I finish looking at those last 7 games, I will go back and review front, side and rear shots of the jerseys. As of right now, all 5 games seemed to be the same jesrsey.

I will post my potential matches to gather more opinions.

Thank you to all that have helped, especially jb23 for the "insider" information.

[Tunis]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

Guys,

Thanks for all the great replies and thoughts. As Jose Lopez is (was) my favorite player, I picked up several of his jerseys from Kruk at decent prices. I do not have a Purple jersey, however

Lopez's first game was April 1, 2011 and his last was May 26, 2011 before he was released.

I have 2 Black vest jerseys, 1 Grey pinstripe and 1 White pinstripe.

I am still working on the photomatching of the Grey pinstripe. I believe he wore it on April 7, April 8, April 22, May 7, and May 19

I still have 7 more games to look at.

Thanks to the above information, once I finish looking at those last 7 games, I will go back and review front, side and rear shots of the jerseys. As of right now, all 5 games seemed to be the same jesrsey.

I will post my potential matches to gather more opinions.

Thank you to all that have helped, especially jb23 for the "insider" information.

I have finished reviewing all the games that he wore the Grey pinstripe. They are as follows:

April 7, April 8, April 22, May 7, May 19, May 20, May 21, May 22

Now I will start looking intensely at photo matching.

[xpress34]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

Here's some Rockies examples for you from my own collection:

2009 Jason Giambi:









And my jersey even made it one his 1st Rockies Card (2009 Topps Unique):



Smitty

[rdeversole]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

Xpress34: Nice jersey! You also have the advantage of a wonky #2. The #2 and 5 on jerseys tend to "pull" in whatever direction based on how they are sewn, so they each tend to have their own unique look. IMO, those numbers tend to be the easiest to match regardless of being on a pinstripe or a solid color jersey.

Have you tried to match the back yet?

[xpress34]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

Xpress34: Nice jersey! You also have the advantage of a wonky #2. The #2 and 5 on jerseys tend to "pull" in whatever direction based on how they are sewn, so they each tend to have their own unique look. IMO, those numbers tend to be the easiest to match regardless of being on a pinstripe or a solid color jersey.

Have you tried to match the back yet?

Thanks! It's G-Man's 1st Rockies jersey - worn in his 1st couple of games when he was called up in September 2009. The picture is from his 2nd game - a double that scored 2 that won the game for the Rox.

I have not been able to find any back shots from the games he was in while they were wearing these jerseys - if it's not Tulo Cargo or Helton, the Rox don't get much in the way of API or Getty pics.

I'm happy beyond just the numbers, but the button placement. I've had jerseys with the buttons lined up between the stripes, buttons on the stripes, etc.

Someone said earlier that the logo placements and all are usually similar, and I disagree.

Besides the shoulder and side seams and how the pinstripes match up, the stripes don't always lay the same before logos and numbers are applied. They simply cut the material for each jersey pattern (based on size) but their is no 'baseline) (i.e. they don't always start on a stripe when cutting material).

Yankees and Rockies (CR) jeresys may be the easiest to photomatch because of all of the unique points on the interlocking NY and the interlocking CR against the pinstripes.

[rdeversole]

Re: Photomatching pin-striped uniforms

Have you looked at his 2010 Upper Deck card? It shows some of the back of the vest and would have to be an 09 image. Also, it's pretty cool that his jersey tag is visible.