Jeter Not Mvp ?

[JETEFAN]

Have to vent !!!!

Jeter vs. Morneau
Jeter 22 points better BA, 42 points better on base Pct. 58 points better with runners in scoring position, Jeter also had more Hits, Runs, Doubles and stolen bases than Morneau.

Defense:
Jeter- Gold Glove
Morneau- NOT

Did I miss something????? WOW I feel better......

[staindsox]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Morneau hit over .360 from the break 34 HR 130 RBI .559 SLG and he didn't have the same bats behind him in the lineup. He is why the Twins made the playoffs. The Yankees would have either way. Morneau was my pick.

[allstarsplus]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Did I miss something

You didn't miss anything. Mourneau does not do well under pressure also. He is from Canada so when he plays in Canada he chokes as he had 1 hit vs. Toronto. Could you imagine if he played for a NY team? Jeter is clutch under pressure.

Mourneau was an All Star player last year and did deserve MVP votes, but this was certainly Jeter's year.

Now let me vent about Ryan Zimmerman not winning the NL Rookie of the Year. Some people thought David Ortiz was Mr. Clutch with the walk-off HRs....but Zimmerman led ALL major leaguers with Hits w/ Runners in Scoring Position and had 5 walk-off RBIs. He had 9th inning HRs/hits vs. the best in the game including Billy Wagner, Chien Ming-Wang, Mariano Rivera, Armando Benitez, and Joe Borowski. On top of that 120 RBIs as he was the only Rookie with over 100 RBIs!!!!

Fine, Hanley Ramirez who won the ROY had a .292 vs. .287 Batting Average and more runs scored and more stolen bases, but look at runs produced then (RBI + Runs Scored) and Ryan Zimmerman smoked him at 194 vs. 178.

Many writers got it right as it was a close vote, but some writers just missed the clutch aspect and runs produced which besides defense is key to winning games. Zim was also Mr. Web Gem too!

Unfortunately you only have 1 shot at a Rookie of the Year. Hopefully both these guys will have the oppportunity to win MVP in the future.

[chicagoglen]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Jeter is soooooo over rated. Mourneau had my vote as well.

I personally thought it should have been in the following order.

Mourneau
Dye
Jeter
Thomas
Ortiz

[sylbry]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

I just don't think Yankee fans can grasp the concept that a guy who made only $385,000 can be an MVP.

[JETEFAN]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Jeter is soooooo over rated. Mourneau had my vote as well.

I personally thought it should have been in the following order.

Mourneau
Dye
Jeter
Thomas
Ortiz

Over rated is when you do not perform to the hype...Jeter overated, no way. He has been performing to the hype since day 1. Along with Ortiz, Jeter is on of the most clutch players in the game!! The best playoff performer in the game by far, offense and defense. Morneau has had one good 1/2 season in his career. Jeter consistant since 1996!!!!

[JETEFAN]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

I just don't think Yankee fans can grasp the concept that a guy who made only $385,000 can be an MVP.

$385,000 seems fair when you you only show up for 1/2 the season!!

[richpick]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

I believe Jeter is suffering from the fact that AROD won the MVP last year and that the Yankees with that huge payroll have not won a World Series for how long?

[rose14]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Jeter is a good player, but you take Jeter away from the Yankees and put him on the Royals or Rockies and see what kind of stats that he has. Jeter is surrounded by some of the best talent in baseball every year. I will give Jeter his props, he comes up big when the game is on the line.

[allstarsplus]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Jeter is a good player, but you take Jeter away from the Yankees and put him on the Royals or Rockies and see what kind of stats that he has. Jeter is surrounded by some of the best talent in baseball every year. I will give Jeter his props, he comes up big when the game is on the line.

You can't score many runs if nobody knocks you in and you can't drive in many runs if nobody is on base so your point with the Royals is valid, but Jeter would do great on the Rockies! He would hit 10 more HRs there! Now he couldn't win a MVP at either place because the voters want you to be on a Playoff team to win a MVP.....

Now back to the Twins, they had Mauer lead the league in batting average at .347 and was a MVP candidate, Luis Castillo an All Star 2nd baseman at .296 and Tyner and Bartlett both batted over .300 with in addition Torii Hunter who had an off year with 98 RBIs and 31 HRs.

In my opinion, I think for most of the season that Morneau had more coverage around him than Jeter did with all the Yankee injuries! Morneau batted in the 5 hole with guys on base with Torii Hunter in the on-deck circle!

Both excellent players, but Jeter got robbed!!!

[staindsox]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Come on, Jeter was not robbed. Morneau put the Twins in the playoffs. And for the record, Jeter's gold glove isn't deserved. His range is crap. SABR measures this statistically. If you look at the number of balls he fields over the course of a season, it has typically far less than other shortstops. Over the course of a week, there could be a variance depending on how often the ball is hit to you, but over the course of the season, it averages out. He won the gold glove because of his popularity. If anyone were to ever be robbed, it would never be Jeter. He is far too popular. Why can't anyone be big enough to give Morneau credit. Jeter had a great season, but Morneau is the MVP.

[Yankwood]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

As the nickname Yankwood might imply, I am a lifelong Yankee fan, which goes back to the mid 1960's. My opinion, for whatever weight that carries, is that a case can be made for both players, as well as a few more. We all like to think out favorites were the "best" and I too was hoping that Derek Jeter would win the award. Had he won, I'm sure we Yankee fans would have had to "defend" this selection against the cries of angry Yankee haters. This is pretty much common practice and has formed a tough hide in most of us. However, this is what makes the game fun. For over a hundred years, friendships have formed and even flourished in the face of so-called heated debates concerning our teams that we choose early in life. And if the arguments between fans of teams and players were not enough, the SABRmetricians and "traditionalists" have locked horns. These make for interesting discussions and arguments that never really get settled once our minds are made up but as time goes by and we get a little older we realize that the heated discussions of today get lost in the shuffle of all the debates of the past once a new season begins.
I have no problem with Morneau's selection. His team was wallowing early in the year as he struggled close to the .200 mark, however as he heated up so did his team. Fans of Johan Santana make the same claim. On the other hand, Jeter, I believe held his team together through many injuries, overall suspect pitching and also in the face of A-Rod's less than stellar production, especially in the clutch. This can debated too, however, it is the way I saw the season unfold. Jermaine Dye, David Ortiz, Johan Santana, Frank Thomas, et al. all had fabulous seasons and I'm sure the fans of the White Sox, the A's, the Twins, Red Sox, Yankees, etc. all have different opinions. The trick here, though, is to listen when the other one is talking because if the same players we speak in favor of switched uniforms, our "opinions" might become radically different. This is why we are called "fans", which is short for "fanatics". Fanaticism knows no logic.

[sylbry]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Yes, Morneau had a lousy start to his season, just like his team. Starting at the end of June, Morneau put together a MONSTER season, which none of the other candidates could come close to matching. In the end he had a very fine season. So did Jeter.

The Twins would NOT have made it to the playoffs without him (or Santana or Mauer for that matter.) They played in, and won THE HARDEST division in baseball against two of the best teams in the game in 2006. Unlike the Twins, the Yankees would have very likely made the playoffs without Jeter as they played in much less competitive division (sorry Jays and Red Sox fans.) Therefore Morneau was much more valuable to his team than Jeter.

As far as Jeter being clutch and Morneau not, ask yourself what did Jeter do that was clutch in 2006? Nothing I can think of. In fact he choked on the last day of the season when he had a chance to win the batting title.

Jeter and Jeter fans should just be content with the two awards he didn't deserve to win, the Hank Aaron award and a Gold Glove.

[sylbry]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

[quote=allstarsplus;26430]Now back to the Twins, they had Mauer lead the league in batting average at .347 and was a MVP candidate, Luis Castillo an All Star 2nd baseman at .296 and Tyner and Bartlett both batted over .300 with in addition Torii Hunter who had an off year with 98 RBIs and 31 HRs.[quote]

Tyner and Bartlett are bench players. The Twins lineup is not exactly Giambi, Cabrera, A-Rod, Cano, Damon, and Posada. (Ignoring Abreu, Sheffield and Matsui who only played part of the season for the Yankees.)

[JETEFAN]

Re: Jeter Not Mvp ?

Morneau hit 226, 271, and 239 his first 3 years and has had only 1/2 of a decent season since he came up. To even try to compare or imply that he is a more valuable player to his team than Jeter is insane!! Like Shakira say's hips, I mean numbers, plays, flips, dives and midnight homers don't lie!!!! The views expressed are not necessarily (But probably are!!) the views of this forum or it's members.