1981 Alan Trammell game used jersey dilemma

[coachnip13@aol.com]

Hi guys, new to the board with an issue that is perplexing to me.

I own an Alan Trammell jersey from 1981. As a kid I worked as a bat boy for the Tigers during spring training, and I was allowed to take various items that no one had any use for any more.

Here is my issue. As you well know, major league jerseys were recycled to be used by minor leaguers during spring training. The "TRAMMELL" name was stitched directly to the jersey. In order to fit a normal replacement nameplate on the back, they cut the "T" off the beginning and the "L" off the end. That nameplate has since been removed. So I have a 1981 #3 jersey with "RAMMEL" stitched on the back, with slight discoloration where the nameplate did not allow that part of the jersey to fade. My question is, would a collector rather have the jersey in its current state, or should I have it restored? I don't want any perception at all that I attempted to fool someone by taking it away from its original state.

I have a feeling that a 1981 Trammel jersey has some value to Tiger collectors out there, but I want to do it the right way. Thanks for any advice.

I'm doing this from my phone and will be glad to post pictures tomorrow.

[commando]

Hi guys, new to the board with an issue that is perplexing to me.

I own an Alan Trammell jersey from 1981. As a kid I worked as a bat boy for the Tigers during spring training, and I was allowed to take various items that no one had any use for any more.

Here is my issue. As you well know, major league jerseys were recycled to be used by minor leaguers during spring training. The "TRAMMELL" name was stitched directly to the jersey. In order to fit a normal replacement nameplate on the back, they cut the "T" off the beginning and the "L" off the end. That nameplate has since been removed. So I have a 1981 #3 jersey with "RAMMEL" stitched on the back, with slight discoloration where the nameplate did not allow that part of the jersey to fade. My question is, would a collector rather have the jersey in its current state, or should I have it restored? I don't want any perception at all that I attempted to fool someone by taking it away from its original state.

I have a feeling that a 1981 Trammel jersey has some value to Tiger collectors out there, but I want to do it the right way. Thanks for any advice.

I'm doing this from my phone and will be glad to post pictures tomorrow.

You yourself are a great source of provenance for the jersey. It would be great if you happened to have a few photos of yourself during your time working for the team. Personally, I would send the jersey to fellow GUU member Lon Lewis, who would do a world-class job restoring the name. Maybe Lon would be kind enough to include a short letter explaining exactly what he did to the jersey to add to the chain of provenance.

I believe the restoration of the missing letters, if done correctly by the likes of Lon Lewis, will increase the value of the jersey.

[TwinLakesPark]

Hi guys, new to the board with an issue that is perplexing to me.

I own an Alan Trammell jersey from 1981. As a kid I worked as a bat boy for the Tigers during spring training, and I was allowed to take various items that no one had any use for any more.

Here is my issue. As you well know, major league jerseys were recycled to be used by minor leaguers during spring training. The "TRAMMELL" name was stitched directly to the jersey. In order to fit a normal replacement nameplate on the back, they cut the "T" off the beginning and the "L" off the end. That nameplate has since been removed. So I have a 1981 #3 jersey with "RAMMEL" stitched on the back, with slight discoloration where the nameplate did not allow that part of the jersey to fade. My question is, would a collector rather have the jersey in its current state, or should I have it restored? I don't want any perception at all that I attempted to fool someone by taking it away from its original state.

I have a feeling that a 1981 Trammel jersey has some value to Tiger collectors out there, but I want to do it the right way. Thanks for any advice.

I'm doing this from my phone and will be glad to post pictures tomorrow.

I would love to see photos of the jersey and please let me know if you are interested in selling it.

wesholden at gmail dot com

Wes

[coachnip13@aol.com]

Thanks for the feedback so far. Commando, I do indeed have photos of myself from those days. The most depressing part is the hindsight. I had access to all of that stuff, and could have had a lot more. And it was all legitimate. At that time, no one thought twice about some old jersey that was passed down to the minors, so it was mine for the taking.

Here are some photos:

http://i1332.photobucket.com/albums/w607/coachnip13/IMG_1667_zps278ae06b.jpg (http://s1332.photobucket.com/user/coachnip13/media/IMG_1667_zps278ae06b.jpg.html)
http://i1332.photobucket.com/albums/w607/coachnip13/IMG_1666_zpscf0454a9.jpg (http://s1332.photobucket.com/user/coachnip13/media/IMG_1666_zpscf0454a9.jpg.html)
http://i1332.photobucket.com/albums/w607/coachnip13/IMG_1665_zps393f11a5.jpg (http://s1332.photobucket.com/user/coachnip13/media/IMG_1665_zps393f11a5.jpg.html)
http://i1332.photobucket.com/albums/w607/coachnip13/IMG_1664_zpsb47cfb39.jpg (http://s1332.photobucket.com/user/coachnip13/media/IMG_1664_zpsb47cfb39.jpg.html)
http://i1332.photobucket.com/albums/w607/coachnip13/alan-trammell-b_zps7d54c897.jpg (http://s1332.photobucket.com/user/coachnip13/media/alan-trammell-b_zps7d54c897.jpg.html)

[spartanservitto]

Man I would love that jersey. My favorite tiger ever.


-Tony

[spartanservitto]

The thumbs down was an accident , on my phone lol.


-Tony

[mbrieve]

I would get it restored and consign it to a top auction house (i.e. Goldin Auctions). That way you know you are getting top value for it.

[emann]

I would get it restored and consign it to a top auction house (i.e. Goldin Auctions). That way you know you are getting top value for it.

+1

[coachnip13@aol.com]

Again, thanks for the tips guys. I sent an email to Mr. Lewis about a week ago, but have not heard back from him yet. Hopefully it's a project he would like to do.

[yosef777]

I would advise against 'restoring' it as it is a one of a kind as is and IMO more valuable. Generally speaking in regards to antiques/memoriabilia, restoring/replacing decreases the value of an object especialy one like yours which has such great provenance.

[commando]

I would advise against 'restoring' it as it is a one of a kind as is and IMO more valuable. Generally speaking in regards to antiques/memoriabilia, restoring/replacing decreases the value of an object especialy one like yours which has such great provenance.

I have to respectfully disagree, Yosef. A serious collector looking for a Trammell jersey with ironclad provenance like this one won't be bothered by the restoration of two letters (hopefully just those two letters can be added, versus having to redo the entire name). I can guarantee that a grail jersey such as this would be proudly displayed by a future buyer. On that note, the jersey would display much better with a complete name on the back.

[yosef777]

I agree for general 'display' purposes the restoration makes sense but not in terms of its value. Any restoration/addition you do (besides basic preservation) to an item whether it is a jersey or any type of antique and you run the risk of devaluing the item. That is Antiques 101, and while I understand sports memorabilia may be in a different category from antiques paintings or furniture I would still consider what major auction houses (Sotheby's, Christies, etc.) recommend with high end sports memorablia, leave the item as found.

[spartanservitto]

I would
Not want to display it as "rammel"

[mdube16]

I would leave the decision to restore/not restore to the next owner if your purpose was to sell it at all quickly. I would think you already likely have some potential buyers here.

[yankees159]

I recall that the Tigers placed a third tag in their jersey from this era to indicate the Bin # that they stored the jersey in. Am I correct in this assumption? Would love to get insight from the expertise of this site.

[yankees159]

I pulled the trigger on this an boy am I glad I did. Turns out that there were signs of an inventory tag in the collar. Also, Lon Lewis did a great job on the restoration. Check it out:

[swainer]

Great looking jersey! Here is a couple of pics of my 83 Road Lance Parrish jersey. I'm not sure if this is the inventory tag to which you're referring.

[swainer]

I guess it helps if I actually upload the pics...

[MSpecht]

Here is another example of the Tiger tagging system on a home Howard Johnson jersey from the 1984 World Championship Season.

Mike Jackitout7@aol.com

[joelsabi]

I pulled the trigger on this an boy am I glad I did. Turns out that there were signs of an inventory tag in the collar. Also, Lon Lewis did a great job on the restoration. Check it out:

nice restoration.

does it bother anyone else that the nameplate doesn't extend to the added two letters? would anyone have done the restoration differently?

does the nameplate kept "as is" keep the story of the changes intact? was that the reason for doing it this way?

[akrover]

nice restoration.

does it bother anyone else that the nameplate doesn't extend to the added two letters? would anyone have done the restoration differently?

does the nameplate kept "as is" keep the story of the changes intact? was that the reason for doing it this way?

There isn't a nameplate currently on the jersey. I think there was & the darker part of the jersey is just where the nameplate was & thus the sun wasn't able to fade the material.

[TwinLakesPark]

I pulled the trigger on this an boy am I glad I did. Turns out that there were signs of an inventory tag in the collar. Also, Lon Lewis did a great job on the restoration. Check it out:

Todd - I am not about to start mudslinging, but I just exchanged some very interesting emails with Ron. Care to comment? I tried to take it offline but your email address came back as invalid (twestover@beckett.com).

[yankees159]

I assume you had interst in the jersey too. so sling away. The person that restored the jersey said it would be tough to find material similar to the letters on the back. I just got really lucky that he found some similar tackle twill. he told the same thing to Ron, the seller. I bought this jersey under the impression that it might not be able to be restored. I just got lucky that Lon had similar material. i know you are looking for a Trammell jersey too. good luck in our search.

Todd

p.s

If you want to take it off line please feel free to contact me at Tjwinnie @aol.com
Also please know this jersey is not for sale.

[yankees159]

Todd - I am not about to start mudslinging, but I just exchanged some very interesting emails with Ron. Care to comment? I tried to take it offline but your email address came back as invalid (twestover@beckett.com).

I just contacted Ron and forwarded him all communication I had with Lon regarding restoration, specifically Lon stating how hard it would be to find replacement letters, he used the term" i would have a better chance of winning the lottery. after seeing the comminication Ron "the Seller" says he has no issues. So I'm kind of curious why you have interest in this sale. Also,did you contact Ron too about restoring this jersey? Why did you post this on behalf of Ron?

people like you are the reason why I don't post much anymore. I thought it would be cool to show the restoration to the community. Again, I realize you are looking for a Trammell jersey and it isn't for sale.

best,



Todd

p.s. sorry Lon for you getting dragged into this by this crack pot.

[TwinLakesPark]

I just contacted Ron and forwarded him all communication I had with Lon regarding restoration, specifically Lon stating how hard it would be to find replacement letters, he used the term" i would have a better chance of winning the lottery. after seeing the comminication Ron "the Seller" says he has no issues. So I'm kind of curious why you have interest in this sale. Also,did you contact Ron too about restoring this jersey? Why did you post this on behalf of Ron?

people like you are the reason why I don't post much anymore. I thought it would be cool to show the restoration to the community. Again, I realize you are looking for a Trammell jersey and it isn't for sale.

best,

Todd

p.s. sorry Lon for you getting dragged into this by this crack pot.

You win some and you lose some. I missed out on this one and I am fine with it. I thought Ron posted the picture of the restoration and I emailed him to offer my thoughts. I was shocked by his response, and very shocked by his followup email to me. I have a habit of keeping people honest, it is one of my pet peeves.

I am not here to fight his fight. Given what he said to me, I urged him to come back on the board, and he declined... You got a great jersey for $450, and absolute steal. I am also glad that Lon found the material, I have 6 old Tigers jerseys that need restoration. Good luck in your search for a Whitaker jersey.

I am tempted to respond to your personal attacks, but I am not going to there, this is not my battle. Tell the other 99% that I said hello.

[yankees159]

You win some and you lose some. I missed out on this one and I am fine with it. I thought Ron posted the picture of the restoration and I emailed him to offer my thoughts. I was shocked by his response, and very shocked by his followup email to me. I have a habit of keeping people honest, it is one of my pet peeves.

I am not here to fight his fight. Given what he said to me, I urged him to come back on the board, and he declined... You got a great jersey for $450, and absolute steal. I am also glad that Lon found the material, I have 6 old Tigers jerseys that need restoration. Good luck in your search for a Whitaker jersey.

I am tempted to respond to your personal attacks, but I am not going to there, this is not my battle. Tell the other 99% that I said hello.

I don't know your name cause you never posted it.

Anyway, I was hoping you would answer a few questions, that i previously posted since you kind of called me out on the forum not really understanding any prior history or communications regarding this.

1. Did you contact Lon about jersey restoration?
2. Did you inquire about buying this jersey?

My advise to you is that you should enjoy collecting and not get involved in issues that do not involve you. There's a fine line between being passionate and fanatical. You are coming close to crossing a line were this might be considered an unhealthy obsession.

I truly wish you no ill will, in fact I really feel bad for you if you can't realize you crossed some lines here. I wish we could post on collecting and sharing collections and ideas not issues like this.

Best regards,


Todd

p.s. sorry for calling you a crack pot, that was the only thing I did wrong here.

[mbrieve]

I don't know anything that went on with this, but I am absolutely shocked that this jersey didn't end up consigned to a reputable auction house...short of that, this would have gone for a good chunk of cash on eBay (considerably more than has been alleged).

I get taking the "best offer", but...

[ChrisCavalier]

I don't know anything that went on with this, but I am absolutely shocked that this jersey didn't end up consigned to a reputable auction house...short of that, this would have gone for a good chunk of cash on eBay (considerably more than has been alleged).

I get taking the "best offer", but...

If he had contacted me rather than trying to do something on his own, the owner of the jersey would have gotten A TON MORE MONEY for the jersey than he did. Apparently, some people don't care about leaving money on the table and, if that is case, good for him that he has enough money not to have to think about such things. If that is not the case, I hope he contacts me in the future if he has any other items he is looking to sell.

Todd, I'm glad you were able to use this site to get such a great deal on such a nice addition to your collection. I also hope you start posting more as I believe the overall environment here is now very positive and the members are truly a great group of people worth interacting with on this forum.

Sincerely,
Chris

[mbrieve]

If he had contacted me rather than trying to do something on his own, the owner of the jersey would have gotten A TON MORE MONEY for the jersey than he did. Apparently, some people don't care about leaving money on the table and, if that is case, good for him that he has enough money not to have to think about such things. If that is not the case, I hope he contacts me in the future if he has any other items he is looking to sell.

Todd, I'm glad you were able to use this site to get such a great deal on such a nice addition to your collection. I also hope you start posting more as I believe the overall environment here is now very positive and the members are truly a great group of people worth interacting with on this forum.

Sincerely,
Chris

I tried to, subtly, push the OP in your direction. If I had known it was going to go for so little, I would have made an offer. I guess I just figured it was a no-brainer that this would come to auction.

[joelsabi]

There isn't a nameplate currently on the jersey. I think there was & the darker part of the jersey is just where the nameplate was & thus the sun wasn't able to fade the material.

So if this jersey was side by side with a Whitaker jersey from the same year. the Trammell jersey would have no nameplate and the Whitaker would have a nameplate? Can someone clarify.

[mbrieve]

So if this jersey was side by side with a Whitaker jersey from the same year. the Trammell jersey would have no nameplate and the Whitaker would have a nameplate? Can someone clarify.

The "T" and "L" were stripped, when a nameplate was added in the minor leagues. When the nameplate was removed, "RAMMEL" remained, and the faded outline of the nameplate also remained.