Henderson jersey ~ proceed with utmost caution

[TNTtoys]

All,

For sale on ebay is a "1984 Steve Henderson game worn Seattle Mariners jersey"... This appears to be the same retail authentic jersey I sold over ebay last year to another retail authentic jersey dealer. The jersey is the same size, front tagging, and same exact custom lettering job on the back that begins below the top of the numbers and curves completely around them. This lettering job is NOT anything that the Mariners wore in the 80s -- they either used a thinner blue letter or a three-color blue/white/yellow letter.
As the lettering job was just about as unique as the jersey, I am about 99% sure this is the same jersey. Furthermore, when the jersey left my hands, it was immaculate -- I mean not even a blemish -- hardly characteristic of a gamer.
Sadly, the seller is selling as a game worn. His feedback of 100% may suggest that he doesn't know that the jersey is a retail authentic.

Nick

http://cgi.ebay.com/Seattle-Mariners-Game-Used-Jersey-Steve-Henderson-5_W0QQitemZ330078742611QQihZ014QQcategoryZ24910QQr dZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[Eric]

Did the seller change the title and description? Nowhere does it say "game worn"

[TNTtoys]

Did the seller change the title and description? Nowhere does it say "game worn"

The seller has since changed the title and description after I emailed him with some of the facts behind the history of the jersey. I also received an email from him which supports my opinion that he didn't quite know what he was selling -- he appears to have been taken for a ride and was sold the jersey as "game worn". I don't know exactly what happened to the jersey after it left my hands, but it appears to have exchanged hands several times since.
Looks like a good resolution to the issue at hand, but I do feel bad for the current seller, as he likely lost a bit of money on this item.

[TNTtoys]

Guys,

I have been in contact with the seller of this jersey multiple times since my post here. He has been accused of being a liar and a cheat, all based on this thread, and for this I have great regret. For starters, I saw my original retail authentic jersey on ebay, advertised as "game worn", and I reacted. I should have waited before posting here until I at least had the chance to open dialogue with the seller.
As I said earlier, I believe that he was tricked in the tune of a few hundred dollars by purchasing what he believed to be an authentic product which wasn't, and I feel that for this, he has had enough grief. I believe he has done the right thing by changing his listing almost immediately and shouldn't have to be put through any more crap over this.

Nick

[flaco1801]

this is why i never liked "game issued" or "game ready" shirts advertized for sale here even tho it was made clear what they were.(game issued today ,game worn tomorrow) we all knew what would they would become. but the powers that be were under the assumption that we cant police the future. i remember being punished for the remarks i made about the game issued yankee shirts being hawked on this forum. im still angry at the lack of fore thought. we have exposed the selling of these bogus shirts on e-bay. we we have sold them on this very forum. anyone think we need some changes? Jeff

[TNTtoys]

this is why i never liked "game issued" or "game ready" shirts advertized for sale here even tho it was made clear what they were.(game issued today ,game worn tomorrow) we all knew what would they would become. but the powers that be were under the assumption that we cant police the future. i remember being punished for the remarks i made about the game issued yankee shirts being hawked on this forum. im still angry at the lack of fore thought. we have exposed the selling of these bogus shirts on e-bay. we we have sold them on this very forum. anyone think we need some changes? Jeff

Jeff, you're mixing apples with oranges here... this thread was not about the fallout of game issued jerseys being sold as game worn, but what has happened to a retail authentic jersey after it left my hands. It's fairly obvious to spot this particular one as not "game worn", as the lettering was not team style lettering, and the tagging was a retail tag...
but you do bring up a point here -- those game ready jerseys are not made differently... yes, we can "police" the auctions (which I would say we do a fairly good job with given the limited time or resources) but the game issued jerseys need to be marked in a certain way so that they can not be disguised as gamers and sold for 5x the value. Some suggestions as to how to deal with this issue have been made here, but nothing implemented... I'd like to know when we'll start doing something about it as a group... Nick

[flaco1801]

nick, it wasnt really apples and oranges when the selller advertized the shirt as game worn. to the seasoned collector the shirt was not game worn, but to the "rookies" it could be sold as such. this is a game used forum, as such, game ready, game issued, and what ever you wanna call them should not be sold here unless the shirt has been marked with a sharpie noting its description. we cant be the source of these shirts that eventually end up costing innocent buyers a small fortune. i think we have a duty to police what we can. Jeff

[TNTtoys]

Jeff, I agree with you with regards to game ready/game issued jerseys. These have tags identical to the game used jerseys, plus other tagging that would never be found on a retail jersey -- "SET 1 - 2006" for example...
As far as retail authentic jerseys go... And I can probably lump Mitchell and Ness in there with this category... there is a specific market for these, and that will never change. Problem is that someone out there might either deliberately or inadverantly describe one of these as game used... and an unsuspecting buyer might believe that. There are millions of these out there that it will be impossible to watch over the market... but we can hope that this is not common... and for the few that get through the system, we have enough people in our group to right the wrongs.
A side thought about placing the markings on tags in the jersey -- these same tags have been known to be replaced by the fraudsters, so there needs to be a better solution. Someone mentioned invisible ink here at one point, and I think this is an awesome idea -- why would the fraudster go through hoops to remove something if he doesn't even know it's there. The other method, which is foolproof, is to have each jersey catalogued and tracked. Yes, there are overheads, but the good certainly outweighs the bad... and no collector out there will argue that it's a bad idea, because it guarantees them they get what they pay for.