Historic Nolan Ryan Warm-up

[hblakewolf]

Forum Readers-
Over the last few years, quite a few Texas Rangers minor league pre-games have surfaced and are offered as TEXAS RANGERS PRE-GAMES. Most often, the numbers are tied to the star players, such as Ryan, Sosa, etc.

Once again, the #34 minor league jersey has re-surfaced at Historic as Nolan Ryans.

http://www.historicauctions.com/search/showphotos/auctionid/37394/imageid/13036/

The easiest way to tell the difference is as follows:
1. The Rangers did not wear this style during Ryan's time, 1989-93
2. The Rangers did not use heat-pressed name/#'s, rather, sewn
3. Wrong tag. If it was from 1989-91, it should have the usual white Rawlings tag with the MLB logo on it. 1992-3 would have a different Rawlings style tag, or it would have a Majestic/Russell tag.

When one tries to determine who authenticated it, the description simple indicates it is included in the description; there is no mention, however, in the description.

FYI

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

ALWAYS BUYING PHILLIES, PORTLAND BEAVERS AND PORTLAND MAVERICKS JERSEYS

[TNTtoys]

Forum Readers-
Over the last few years, quite a few Texas Rangers minor league pre-games have surfaced and are offered as TEXAS RANGERS PRE-GAMES. Most often, the numbers are tied to the star players, such as Ryan, Sosa, etc.

Once again, the #34 minor league jersey has re-surfaced at Historic as Nolan Ryans.

http://www.historicauctions.com/search/showphotos/auctionid/37394/imageid/13036/



I clicked this link and got a message of "historic" proportions... I suppose that one would have to conclude that your message warning buyers not to buy a piece of crap $50.00 minor league BP for $1,000+ is "misleading" and "unscrupulous." Howard, you are a bad man, a very bad man!!

[hblakewolf]

Go Directly to their site and search under NOLAN RYAN. It's worth the thirty seconds time to at least get a good laugh.

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

[TNTtoys]

Oh jeez... the screen printed numbers are classic. I hope nobody is silly enough to fall for this one!

[kingjammy24]

i am unaware of the texas rangers ever wearing a jersey that looked remotely like this one. apparently though, someone at historic must have some evidence of this being a texas rangers jersey. to that extent, i'd very much like to see a single photograph of the texas rangers ever wearing such a jersey in their entire 35 yr existence.

during the late 80s/early 90s, the texas rangers had 3 minor league teams that were also called the "rangers"; the gastonia rangers, charlotte rangers, and gcl rangers.

rudy.

[cjw]

My game worn jersey knowledge is limited but I do know that this Blue Jays jersey would have to have team script tagging in the collar to be team issued.

http://www.historicauctions.com/search/list/auctionid/36563/

[cjw]

the link won't bring you to the Alex Rios replica jersey advertised as game worn. Rudy...pls tell me that I am not wrong

[kingjammy24]

chris,

sure, the jerseys ought to have strip tags in the collar. i've heard reports that some modern jays gamers were legitimately missing such tags. i don't follow modern jerseys closely enough to know the veracity of this information. historic had a rios jersey in their last auction. see: http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=5881

both the rios and wells jerseys on historic seem to lack blue jays or mlb provenance. it's akin to a 2006 yankees jersey without steiner certs or a 2005 rangers jersey without meigray papers. it's possible but in lieu of such provenance it better have a solid story behind it. so what's the solid story behind these jerseys? (an "impeccable source" doesn't cut it.)

there seem to be modern jerseys out there that, for the most part, are up to spec yet they clearly haven't originated from the team. see: http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=6219
it's not just jays jerseys. i'm seeing '05 and '06 0062-coded jerseys out there from various teams with proper fonts, patches, sizes, and tagging that show almost no use. spec-wise though, they're almost perfect. i think the delgado in the link above is a great example. here's a jersey that should've had jays certs or at least player certs. it didn't seem to have either. however, it had the almighty 0062 tag, proper fonts, an "impeccable source", etc. however, it was missing the strip tag and the size was so off that it's unlikely that it ever saw the inside of a clubhouse. who's ordering and making these things then?

similarly, historic's last auction had multiple '05 yankees jerseys and none of them mentioned any sort of mlb, yankee, steiner, player, or even charity certs. arods, jeters, matsuis. somehow all of the yankees biggest (and most lucrative) superstar jerseys escaped the clubhouse under steiner's nose? yet these jerseys were up to spec. personally, i think we're in a period where the supply of un-worn, un-issued, pro-spec jerseys is almost unlimited. if legit gamers are mixed in with the giant pool of perfectly spec'd "non gamers", then it seems the only thing left to depend on is the provenance. when you see 2 identical jerseys and 1 comes with genuine, solid provenance and the other with nothing more than some tired, vague story of "impeccable sources", then anyone picking the latter is taking a gamble simply to save money. provenance is no guarantee, but it's certainly more of a guarantee than the alternative. in my opinion, if you're serious about the quality of your collection, provenance is worth paying for. dealers like kim stigall and mike quick chose to pay a premium in order to offer legit jays gamers by getting their jerseys straight from the jays (both dealers offer team certs). i'd like to think that, in return, they ought to attract more customers than the dealer who chose cut corners and pay less to obtain his jerseys from a questionable source. after all, the jays had plenty of delgado gamers for sale. what's a dealers justification for going through someone else? an affinity for passing risk along to their customers? the jays charge a premium and some dealers simply don't want to see their profits reduced. they feel they can find "similar" jerseys elsewhere for less. unfortunately, some buyers seem to think they can score a bargain simply by going for the cheapest jersey. it's hardly a bargain if it's really just a pro-cut. i genuinely wonder about the mentality of buyers bidding on '06 non-steiner yankees jerseys. are they diehard risk takers? do they hate sleeping peacefully at night? or do they genuinely think it's very likely that steiner lost track of several jeter, matsui, and arod jerseys as they slipped out the back door?

rudy.

[Eric]

Still no answer from Historic Auctions sent to their "ask a question" area on the website and personal email to James Brown

[hblakewolf]

Eric-
My co-worker also asked for additional info, specifically, how this is offered as a Texas Rangers pre-game?

He sent Historic an email a few weeks ago. No answer has been received.

FYI
Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

[hblakewolf]

Please see the response I received from James Brown. I responded by again indicating that the shirt in question is a minor leage Rangers jersey, and I would like to see one photo or piece oif evidence to support any type of LOA indicating this is a Texas pre-game. Likewise, I have asked what evidence Lampson used to determine this is MLB jersey?

From: James Brown [mailto:James@HistoricAuctions.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 2:29 PM
To: Howard Wolf
Subject: RE: Ryan jersey

Howard,

Lou already came, authenticated the item and will be sending the LOA shortly. As soon as we receive it, we’ll post it on the site and I’ll send it to you.
--
James

From: Howard Wolf [mailto:hwolf@medprodlabs.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 2:47 PM
To: Info@HistoricAuctions.com
Subject: Ryan jersey

James-
How can you offer a Gastonia Rangers #34 jersey as a Nolan Ryan Texas Rangers? Can you please provide a copy of the LOA or information on what was used to make this determination?


Thanks.

[hblakewolf]

I received this message the following day, May 2nd, however, have never seen a copy of the Lampson LOA or heard back from James Brown. I'm well aware that he reads this Forum, and would appreciate seeing a copy of the LOA that supports Lampsons findings on a minor league pre-game being woprn by Nolan Ryan with the Rangers.




From: James Brown [mailto:James@HistoricAuctions.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2007 1:34 PM
To: Howard Wolf
Subject: RE: Ryan jersey

Howard,

As I said before, as soon as I receive the letter, I’ll forward it on. Once we receive the letter, we’ll take a look at the jersey and make a final determination.
--
James

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

[kingjammy24]

4 hrs left until the auction ends. the loa still isn't up.

just when you think james brown has stopped impressing you, he steps up and hits another home run.

rudy.

[hblakewolf]

Rudy-
With 13 minutes to go, it has 4 bids and is at $350.

It's criminal that this shirt is clealry NOT a Texas Rangers jersey, however, some poor novice will tuck this away-only to learn down the road that it's some sort of $25.00 Rangers minor league warm-up.

James Brown-shame on you. Not only for never sending me the promised copy of the Lampson LOA, but also for knowingly selling this as a Ryan pre-game when you have clearly been presented with the facts.

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net