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sarahsdad
05-14-2007, 05:24 PM
Hello Forum Members:
About 2 weeks ago I received an email from Bob Malandro at Steiner Sports containing a spread sheet with a massive amount of Yankees memorabilia for sale. As I went through the list I saw a Jason Giambi Game Issued LS bat for $100. I ordered it and it arrived today. It is a LS model G174, just like he uses and under the "125" there is a line. Anyone out there have any idea why a game issued bat from Steiner would have this line under the "125" in the center oval just above the "Louisville Slugger." I have a half dozen game used LS bats and none of them have a line under the 125. I thought that when a bat had the line under the 125 the bat was for promotional use only and not for potential use in a game. Needless to say I am quite disappointed that this happened. Anyone had a similar incident? Anyone know why the line is under the 125? Thanks for any help.
Howard

ChrisCavalier
05-14-2007, 06:17 PM
Hello Forum Members:
About 2 weeks ago I received an email from Bob Malandro at Steiner Sports containing a spread sheet with a massive amount of Yankees memorabilia for sale. As I went through the list I saw a Jason Giambi Game Issued LS bat for $100. I ordered it and it arrived today. It is a LS model G174, just like he uses and under the "125" there is a line. Anyone out there have any idea why a game issued bat from Steiner would have this line under the "125" in the center oval just above the "Louisville Slugger." I have a half dozen game used LS bats and none of them have a line under the 125. I thought that when a bat had the line under the 125 the bat was for promotional use only and not for potential use in a game. Needless to say I am quite disappointed that this happened. Anyone had a similar incident? Anyone know why the line is under the 125? Thanks for any help.
Howard
Hello Howard,

My understanding of bats stamped with the underlined 125 is consistent with the definition found in the Glossary of Terms in Vince Malta's new book. Here is the relevant passage:

Show Bats Made to display player autographs for large sports conventions and shows, often resembling a professional bat, but usually made of a random weight. In the 1990s, most H&B show bats were stamped with a baselined 125, distinguishing them from their pro counterparts.

Hope that helps.

Sincerely,
Chris

suave1477
05-14-2007, 08:23 PM
In Steiners defense and human arror defense....

thats all this might be is a human error.

Possible reasons for this bat..

1) It could have gotten mixed by accident with Giambis Game Issued bats and they grabbed whichever bat and sent it out. Bob doesnt ship the bats he would have placed the order and there shipping department would have sent it out.
2) Giambi himself (it is possible have heard of things like this before) might of ran out of bats and asked the gift store to send him one down.
3) Maybe the manufacturer by accident got it mixed in with Giambis batch and thats why he didnt use it.

If it really bothers you that much I am sure you can contact Bob and explain to him the situation, he will try to correct it.

sarahsdad
05-15-2007, 08:07 AM
I did contact Bob by email and by phone. He replied with a 2 sentence email basically telling me to send it back if I was not happy with it. No explanation, no "Oops". I think its sad that Steiner of all people would send out something like that. Steiner hologram or not, most collectors won't touch a bat with the line under the 125 and then to sell it as "Game Issued". If there is a collector out there who thinks I am being unreasonable I would love to hear from them. Thanks everyone for all of your help.
Howard

suave1477
05-15-2007, 09:21 AM
Well again I think your being a bit unreasonable. It is human error as I mentioned before Bob himself doesn't ship out the items himself. They just put in an order to the shipping dept with a ton of Giambi Issued bats they grab one package it and ship it out there is no real science to it, to some average joe working in shipping to know anything more then it was labeled as Game Issued.

On top of that I gave you 3 other possible reasons which anyone of them could of actually happend.

It is not like Bob turned around and said too bad your stuck with it. You said it yourself Bob asked you to return it I am sure if he could he would try to replace it with the correct item.

Again it is just a minor human error, I am sure you werent singled out to be done intentionally.

sarahsdad
05-20-2007, 03:23 PM
I am trying to understand what you are saying. Here is how I see it. Steiner and many in the collecting world consider Steiner to be the Holy Grail whem it comes to Yankees items and as such everyone who purchases from them pays a premium for their items. Yet they send me what they believe to be is a game issued Giambi bat with a line under the 125, and they did not include a LOA. I am going out on a limb here but I'll bet Lampson would have rejected this bat due to the line under the 125. And we all know Lampson does not reject anything. I tried to get an explanation from Bob Malandro as to why the bat had a line under the 125 and he did not give me one. All he said was if you are not satisfied send it back. Are there any collectors out there who would have kept this bat? I'd like to hear from you. Thanks everone.
Sarahsdad

Carlevv
05-20-2007, 03:32 PM
The bats with the line under them cost the team about half of what the real game bats cost. They started buying them that way to save money when someone wanted an autograph bat from a player. For instance, Posada needs a bat for his charity from Jason Giambi, they get the replica because to some people they just dont know the difference. The wood on the replica bat is bad as far as good graing goes hence the price cut in half. For Steiner to send one of those out IMO it not a human error its just plain wrong. That bat should have never even been in the same room with Giambi's game bats. Im going to go out on a limb here and say this isnt the first time Steiner has done this.

stlbats
05-20-2007, 08:26 PM
You can buy that exact Giambi bat from Anaconda Sports for $75 right now. Blonde LVS G174 with the line under the 125. Its simply not a game issue bat, but a promo. I personally would send it back.

Thanks
Jason
ripken8@bellsouth.net
Always looking for STL bats.

sarahsdad
05-20-2007, 08:37 PM
Thanks for the replies. The bat was sent back but I paid the postage for the POS to be sent to me and then for me to send it back. Steiner clearly does not need my business. They was not even an attempt to make things right but it does make me suspect and doubt Steiner's reputation and some of the items they are representing as game used and game issued. And by the way the 25 page spreadsheet they emailed to me went right in the trash and I will not purchase another item from them. And in my opinion their LOA's are just as good as toilet paper.
Sarahsdad

Carlevv
05-20-2007, 08:59 PM
LOA's are the biggest joke in this hobby IMO.

suave1477
05-21-2007, 10:19 AM
Thanks for the replies. The bat was sent back but I paid the postage for the POS to be sent to me and then for me to send it back. Steiner clearly does not need my business. They was not even an attempt to make things right but it does make me suspect and doubt Steiner's reputation and some of the items they are representing as game used and game issued. And by the way the 25 page spreadsheet they emailed to me went right in the trash and I will not purchase another item from them. And in my opinion their LOA's are just as good as toilet paper.
Sarahsdad

I hate to say this but I am taking this personally not just to defend Steiner but as a Dealer/ Collector.

You said there was not even an attempt to make things right in the same breath you said Bob offered to tak the bat back - Make up your mind!!
Have you ever heard of Human Error???
It happens no one is perfect espcially in this hobby.
You sit here and act like they targeted you and did this on purppose.
I don't understand how you can't comprehend that it was a bat that got mixed into there Game Issueds by accident. They wren't selling you the retail bat as a Game Issued on purpose.
You can hold Steiner as the Holy Grail or not, but the remainder of the fact is they have the contract with the Yankees and you can sleep easier at night knowing for sure you got an item that came directly from the Yankees.
Again the "Average Joe" who works in shipping, just grabs the bat and ships it out (Thats his Job shipping nothing else).

suave1477
05-21-2007, 10:21 AM
Thanks for the replies. The bat was sent back but I paid the postage for the POS to be sent to me and then for me to send it back. Steiner clearly does not need my business. They was not even an attempt to make things right but it does make me suspect and doubt Steiner's reputation and some of the items they are representing as game used and game issued. And by the way the 25 page spreadsheet they emailed to me went right in the trash and I will not purchase another item from them. And in my opinion their LOA's are just as good as toilet paper.
Sarahsdad

I hate to say this but I am taking this personally not just to defend Steiner but as a Dealer/ Collector.

You said there was not even an attempt to make things right in the same breath you said Bob offered to tak the bat back - Make up your mind!!
Have you ever heard of Human Error???
It happens no one is perfect espcially in this hobby.
You sit here and act like they targeted you and did this on purppose.
I don't understand how you can't comprehend that it was a bat that got mixed into there Game Issueds by accident. They wren't selling you the retail bat as a Game Issued on purpose.
You can hold Steiner as the Holy Grail or not, but the remainder of the fact is they have the contract with the Yankees and you can sleep easier at night knowing for sure you got an item that came directly from the Yankees.
Again the "Average Joe" who works in shipping, just grabs the bat and ships it out (Thats his Job shipping nothing else). I dont know how much more you can ask of Steiner are you looking for blood????

All Dealers are human mistakes do happen as long they as they tried to make things right is what counts.

sarahsdad
05-21-2007, 10:53 AM
Telling me to send it back is not making it right. Sending out the correct bat is making it right. Asking "What can I do to correct this?" is making it right. A 2 sentence email telling me to send it back does not make it right. What other "Human Errors" has Steiner made that the average collector did not catch? Would someone who just started out in this hobby have known to reject a bat with a line under the 125? Maybe. Maybe not. You would have relied on Steiner to send out the appropriate item only to perhaps find out years later that it was no good and since Steiners return policy is 30 days you are SOL when trying to return it. What has Steiner done with the bat since I sent it back? Did they destroy it or is it back in the shipping department waiting to be shipped to an unsuspecting/novice collector who assumes Steiner knows what they are shipping out? I never once said they targeted me. You infered that. All I reported was the facts. Would you have kept the bat? Bottom line, this should have never happened and it makes other items from them suspect and all items from Steiner should be airtight since as you pointed out they "Have the contract", so how did a promo bat get in their warehouse and what other promo items are in their warehouse waiting to be shipped out?
Thanks for the dialogue.
sarahsdad

suave1477
05-21-2007, 11:10 AM
Telling me to send it back is not making it right. Sending out the correct bat is making it right. Asking "What can I do to correct this?" is making it right. A 2 sentence email telling me to send it back does not make it right. What other "Human Errors" has Steiner made that the average collector did not catch? Would someone who just started out in this hobby have known to reject a bat with a line under the 125? Maybe. Maybe not. You would have relied on Steiner to send out the appropriate item only to perhaps find out years later that it was no good and since Steiners return policy is 30 days you are SOL when trying to return it. What has Steiner done with the bat since I sent it back? Did they destroy it or is it back in the shipping department waiting to be shipped to an unsuspecting/novice collector who assumes Steiner knows what they are shipping out? I never once said they targeted me. You infered that. All I reported was the facts. Would you have kept the bat? Bottom line, this should have never happened and it makes other items from them suspect and all items from Steiner should be airtight since as you pointed out they "Have the contract", so how did a promo bat get in their warehouse and what other promo items are in their warehouse waiting to be shipped out?
Thanks for the dialogue.
sarahsdad

Sarahsdad I don't know to me them asking you to send it back seems pretty good. its not like the turned around and said "oh well too bad" Your saying they have a 30 day return policy I am almost certain in a case such as this if you realized it was a retail bat after the 30 days they would still honor or try to rectify the situation.
Yes they are human just like every other dealer.
Which means every dealer is run by a Human so human error will alsway be made.
If you know of a company that is completely run by computers and robots please point it out I would love to visit there corporate office.
Since you feel human error is unacceptable how do you purchase anyting??? All companies that I know of have made a Human Error at some point.
MicroSoft
Pepsi
HBO
Johnson & Johnson

These are all billion dollar companies that have human error going on daily I wonder how they survive????

I think your a bit unreasonable to make Steiner a target of of questioning!!!

This will be my last post on this topic and I think everyone here can see the point I am making with out draging this out any further.
Sarahsdad I wish you luck in your collecting and would like to say I don't think Steiner should be held accountable for one mistake as then you shouldnt purchase from anyone since we all make mistakes.

sarahsdad
05-21-2007, 01:26 PM
You continue to miss the point. So I will let it go. I have said what I have to say and I know, based on the response, others have gotten my point. Enough said.
Sarahsdad

GameBats
05-22-2007, 07:26 PM
I have personally searched Steiner's Yankee cage multiple times in search of quality game used bats. While doing so I came across two (2) Chuck Knoblauch game used bats both of which had the underline under the 125. The bats were clearly used during regular season games by Knoblauch.
Is it OK for Steiner to sell them as Game Used?

sarahsdad
05-22-2007, 07:37 PM
Not to me. Lets take a poll. Are there any collectors out there that would be satisfied with a LS game used/issued bat with a line under the 125? With a Steiner letter?
Sarahsdad

Carlevv
05-22-2007, 07:49 PM
I'd have to see those Knoblauch bats to believe it. Im not calling you a liar but i know Chuch was VERY particular with his bats and for him to use one of those is mind boggling. I remember the one year he started numbering his bats like 1 of 12, 2 of 12, so on and so forth. Every he would have 12 gamers on the road and mark them that way i guess to keep track of them. He would also bone his bats and stare at them like he was reading off of them. I dont think he would take one of those bats to war. Maybe this is a case of a yankee bat boy using them in the cage and Steiner said they are game used. Just my thoughts.

GameBats
05-22-2007, 08:16 PM
I could hardly believe it myself. The bats were clearly utilized by Knoblauch. The pine tar application & cleat marks throughout were unmistakable.

Carlevv
05-22-2007, 08:43 PM
Cleat marks on barrell and handle?

suave1477
05-22-2007, 09:47 PM
Well if it has Knoblauch characteristics then it is what it is GAME USED

Do you remember if they were T141 as I know he had a differnt choice of bat for Batting Practice?

Technically if it was used by Knoblauch during an actual game whether it has the line under it or not it is still Game Used!!!

metsbats
05-22-2007, 10:13 PM
I think we are all missing the most important question.

How much fault can we attribute to the team?

Steiner gets these items from the team. That's their selling point. I don't remember Steiner saying they are experts in game used memorabilia. Their whole business model is based on the fact that they have exclusive arrangements with the Yankees and Mets to market their game used equipment for resale. The clubhouse personnel if anyone should be experts on these game used items and they are the ones sending these items to Steiner. I believe Steiner is taking their word that what is being sent is actually legit and game used. If you read the text of a Steiner LOA it states that "the item was obtained as part of the "TEAM NAME" Steiner Collectibles Program, a direct partnership between the "TEAM" and "Steiner Sport Memorabilia"

Should Steiner take additional steps to authenticate the items to ensure underlines are not under 125s, model number and bat weights and lengths match player spec, location of pine tar and hit marks are on the correct side of the bats, player jersey numbers are the correct size and with the proper customizations?

I personally don't think they would and are just relying on the teams to send them legit game used or game issued items.

-David

Carlevv
05-22-2007, 10:40 PM
David, The Yankees dont send anything to Steiner. Steiner comes to the Yankee clubhouse to collect thier stuff. Its there where they document what the get. You cant blame the Yankees one bit here. If Steiner is selling GAME USED stuff they should make sure its GAME USED. I think they do a good job in doing this but some things are slipping through the cracks and that isnt right. They are in charge of what they sell and if something is used it doesnt make it game used. They have to know better IMO.

metsbats
05-23-2007, 05:58 AM
Carlevv,

I'm not so sure that is true. From conversations with Bob Malandro he indicated to me that the Yankees and Mets sent the items to Steiner.

However whether Steiner goes to Yankee stadium or Shea is irrelevent.

I think my point was missed.

It's the teams who provide the items to Steiner and Steiner is not in the business of authenticating but is selling the fact that they have an exclusive relationship with these teams to get these items.

To use an old computer saying "garbage in garbage out"

David

sarahsdad
05-23-2007, 08:38 AM
So where does the responsibility lie? Steiner markets the items and Steiner collects the money. Steiner collected my money when I bought the bat. And when I received the bat not only was the LOA missing, also missing was the MLB emblem on the back side of the bat. I watched Giambi on TV last night and the bat he was using was a LS and it looked a lot different then the one Steiner sent to me. One time I brought an old gold necklace to a pawn shop to sell. Before the pawn shop bought it from me they checked it to see if it was real gold. The pawn shop did not take my word for it. The pawn shop owner did his homework first. Does this not apply to Steiner as well?
Sarahsdad

Yankwood
05-23-2007, 08:49 AM
Give it the Jason Giambi authenticity test. Try unscrewing the knob from the handle.

suave1477
05-23-2007, 10:18 AM
oh My God This Is Ridiculous It Was A Simple An Honest Mistake Your Crying About This Like It Was A Game Used Pujols World Series Exclusive One Time Only Bat That You Got Screwed On.

it Was A Cheap Game Issued Steroid Using Player Bat - Get Over It It Was A Mistake - It Wasnt Intentional And Thats That You Caught It In Time Good For You - They Said They Would Refund You Or Whatever There Deal Was With You To Make Good On It.

and You Still Want To Sit Here And Beat This Horse Till Its Beyond Dead Over A Crappy Item

i Bet You Would Never Cut The Tags Off Your Mattress

im Sorry Didnt Mean To Get Loud But This Topic Is Just Beating A Dead Horse Of An Honest Mistake And Nothing More.

sarahsdad
05-23-2007, 11:53 AM
Suave 1477:
Who held a gun to your head and made you type? You don't want anything to do with the thread then stay out of it. Obviously by the response rate it is an issue of concern with several collectors. You have never gotten the point from day one, judging from your posts, but I appreciate your effort.
Sarahsdad

Yankwood
05-23-2007, 12:18 PM
Something tells me this isn't over yet.

Carlevv
05-23-2007, 12:41 PM
Carlevv,

I'm not so sure that is true. From conversations with Bob Malandro he indicated to me that the Yankees and Mets sent the items to Steiner.

However whether Steiner goes to Yankee stadium or Shea is irrelevent.

I think my point was missed.

It's the teams who provide the items to Steiner and Steiner is not in the business of authenticating but is selling the fact that they have an exclusive relationship with these teams to get these items.

To use an old computer saying "garbage in garbage out"

DavidI know for a fact that Steiner comes to Yankee stadium to collect their game used stuff. I can't comment on the Mets situation but if Bob told you that he or his staff dont go to the yankee clubhouse thats not true. If have numerous conversations with Yankee clubhouse staff about the whole process. This isnt the point of the thread but i have to defend what i know. I dont ever want to just be blowing smoke on these boards. I only try to help when i comment on things. As a matter of fact, one Yankee and i wont say who it is was VERY, VERY, pissed off that Steiner took his helmet over the winter. Its the same helmet that he has used over the last four seasons. The players agent even got involved trying to get the helmet back but the Yankees said they goofed and let Steiner take it. Ask Bob about that one.

Carlevv
05-23-2007, 12:43 PM
So where does the responsibility lie? Steiner markets the items and Steiner collects the money. Steiner collected my money when I bought the bat. And when I received the bat not only was the LOA missing, also missing was the MLB emblem on the back side of the bat. I watched Giambi on TV last night and the bat he was using was a LS and it looked a lot different then the one Steiner sent to me. One time I brought an old gold necklace to a pawn shop to sell. Before the pawn shop bought it from me they checked it to see if it was real gold. The pawn shop did not take my word for it. The pawn shop owner did his homework first. Does this not apply to Steiner as well?
Sarahsdad
FYI, Giambi's bats that have the line underneath the 125 have the TPX logo on the reverse side of the barrell.

sarahsdad
05-23-2007, 01:10 PM
The bat that I received from Steiner did not have the TPX logo on the other side of the barrel.
Sarahsdad

suave1477
05-23-2007, 01:35 PM
Yankwood your funny lol lol

Sarahsdad I got your point and correct me if I am wrong your point is how could Steiner make such a mistake with letting a normally known retail item get into the hobby as being Game Issued, because that means how many other items can end up into the hobby that they call game used or game issued???? Is that correct?

If so my answer still stands it is HUMAN ERROR, Steiner is not just sitting there grabbing whatever is lying around on the floor in a pile and just labeling stuff issued, retail, or game used just like that.
They do try to make an effort to the best of what they can to label items as correctly as possible and put there best foot forward.

Ill tell you this if Steiner lets 5 retail items get into the hobby as Game Issued or Used by accident. I would rather that then the hundreds of fakes that Lampson puts into the hobbya year or the thousadnds a year that makes it way into the hobby from ebay.

Here is something I want you to think about how long does it take you to understand if an item is real maybe if you know the players characterisitics, maybe it takes you a matter of minutes, what if you don't know the player how long would it take you, a day, a week, a month to get the proper information for that players bat??? Am I right? Now Steiner when they made the exclusive deal with the Yankees took over all there stuff that has been stored for 20 - 30 years or more with no records.
Do you think they truly have the time to sit with every peice and examine every detail of it to know where exactly it came from. It would take them another 20 years just to try to do the perfect due diligence on each item.

Technically all in all to you or any other new or old collector in this hobby as the Motto of this forum "DO YOUR HOME WORK"
Which means you can try to hold Steiner responsible but the responsibilty is ultimately yours.
When you buy a house and the seller says don't worry its a good house do you just go on his word NO
When you buy a Used car and the seller says dont worry its a good car, do you just go on his word NO
It is your responsibility to do your homework on what you should be looking for

Look, I been burned myself on items it happens again what matters is if the person who sold me the item tries to make good on it or not.

Carlevv
05-23-2007, 03:18 PM
Good post Suave. Break it on down!

sportscentury
05-23-2007, 03:49 PM
This will be my last post on this topic and I think everyone here can see the point I am making with out draging this out any further.

Jason, you shouldn't tease us like this.

metsbats
05-23-2007, 05:46 PM
This is my last post on this too.

Carlevv: It's still does not matter whether Steiner picks up equipment or are sent the equipment. The source is still the same. If the Yankees allow Steiner free reign of the clubhouse then that may actually explain how they can pick up a promo bat from a players lockers thinking it's a real gamer so good point.

I agree completely with Suave that no matter who you get something from you need to question and do your homework. Thanks to SarahsDad we now know that the motto just because it's Steiner it has to be real does not apply all the time. They are human and they make mistakes (i've heard that somewhere before and can't get it out of my mind) and we need to be aware. We do hold them to a higher standard than most others but it comes with the territory for them.

I still stand by my point at they don't profess to be experts/authenticators and are selling the partnership (just read the LOA). But as time progress and as we as collectors provide feedback to Bob perhaps mistakes like this one can be avoided.

David

R. C. Walker
05-23-2007, 07:01 PM
Look, I been burned myself on items it happens again what matters is if the person who sold me the item tries to make good on it or not.

When all is said and done, what more can you ask for.

2000mvpfan
05-24-2007, 01:07 AM
"it Was A Cheap Game Issued Steroid Using Player Bat"


Suave,dude,your favorite player is Daryl Effin' Strawberry...would those be cheap,game issued coke-snorting,wife-beating,parole-skipping bats??

poo-poo on you..

lol
Joe

suave1477
05-24-2007, 08:22 AM
2000mvpfan it took you lon enough i was waiting for you lmaoooooooooo

Where have you been havent seen you post much on thr forum?

By the way those are Strawberrys good qualities lol lol:D

2000mvpfan
05-24-2007, 10:21 AM
Suave, a new 2nd daughter has cut some of my posting time,but I still read the forum most nites...

Don't worry though-wherever injustice against Jason Giambi rears it's ugly head,you will find me...(cue Three Amigos music..)

take it easy,
Joe