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kylehess10
06-09-2007, 04:40 PM
After recieving the most current issue of "American Memorabilia Magazine", I would never buy from them, ever. They have models actually wearing these very old jerseys, all game worn, which are going to be in their Summer Auction. I hate seeing things like this since we all spends tons of money on this stuff and it was suppose to be last worn by the player themselves, not some model working for American Memorabilia.

Gaylord Perry game worn jersey:

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l178/kylehess10/ctmpphp4MGaAe.jpg


Graig Nettles game worn 1971 jersey

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l178/kylehess10/ctmpphpSqYjkN.jpg



Mickey Lolich game worn 1970 jersey

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l178/kylehess10/ctmpphpesQuja.jpg

Canseco44
06-09-2007, 04:45 PM
I had the same disgust as you. I'm not sure what direction they are trying to go in with this company, but I'm not sure what some of the topics in the latest couple of issues have to do with the contents of the auction. I think they probably need to devote a different magazine to those issues and just keep the catalog to what it has been about. I'm glad you posted. I thought I was the only one reading this thing.

Todd

JasonM33
06-09-2007, 05:32 PM
Outrageous. I'm not well with that.

-Jason M

gamehawk
06-09-2007, 05:44 PM
I could not agree more! I have noticed this with there past 2 auction magazines.......And while there at it, throw out that bum Lampson. :mad:

suave1477
06-09-2007, 06:03 PM
Oh my god when I saw this I was going to throw up, nuff said!!!:( :mad:

sportscentury
06-09-2007, 06:07 PM
Absolutely tasteless... and just what I have come to expect from AMI.

MooseDog
06-09-2007, 07:28 PM
OK, I agree tasteless, but just to play devil's advocate - how would you feel if the babe was the one wearing the jersey?

bat_master
06-09-2007, 07:43 PM
MooseDog,

Can you send me an email? I can be reached at either tim@hofbats.com or t_byington@yahoo.com.

Thanks

CollectGU
06-09-2007, 07:55 PM
Why was it a male model wearing the stuff? Let the women models wear the stuff if you are going to do that...

Dave

Eric
06-09-2007, 08:05 PM
Why was it a male model wearing the stuff? Let the women models wear the stuff if you are going to do that...

Dave

No one should be wearing them... It compromises the pieces.

otismalibu
06-09-2007, 08:28 PM
Shows nice runway use and exhibits a subtle hint of Calvin Klein's Obsession For Men.

jboosted92
06-09-2007, 09:05 PM
Shows nice runway use and exhibits a subtle hint of Calvin Klein's Obsession For Men.


Thats not even the worst.... on the frontpage they have a frigin video of when the 2 owners were in teh music video business...its from like 1985...

talk about hangin on to something that left, when WHAM did...

JasonM33
06-09-2007, 09:05 PM
No one should be wearing them. Man, woman or child.

-Jason M

CollectGU
06-09-2007, 09:13 PM
No one should be wearing them... It compromises the pieces.

LOL. ..That's a just a tiny bit overboard, and I'm not surprised...Did you ever try on a helmet or jersey in your collection? I know some hockey fans that wear their player game worn jerseys to games. Do you think that collector's have never slipped on the jersey of their favorite player after adding it to their collection, or tried on the game used baseball glove, or the batting helmet, or batting glove they just bought of their favorite player? I think what they did was silly, but it certainly doesn't make the item less authentic or add wear.....

Dave

Eric
06-09-2007, 09:21 PM
LOL. ..That's a just a tiny bit overboard, and I'm not surprised...Did you ever try on a helmet or jersey in your collection? I know some hockey fans that wear their player game worn jerseys to games. Do you think that collector's have never slipped on the jersey of their favorite player after adding it to their collection, or tried on the game used baseball glove, or the batting helmet, or batting glove they just bought of their favorite player? I think what they did was silly, but it certainly doesn't make the item less authentic or add wear.....

Dave

You're talking about two different things. If you went into a store that had the workers wearing the game used items they were selling, you might not be very happy with it.

Putting this stuff on for a photo shoot is a bizarre business decision. What exactly is the upside here? Is the sports collectibles target audience (the cross section of people you would see at a memorabilia show) going to look at that model guy and say "He looks really good in that piece, maybe I should buy it"

Dave, if you choose to put your hand in a glove in your collection, that is one thing. AMI decided it would be a good marketing strategy to hire models to wear the items being auctioned. That wouldn't have been my decision, but hey, it's not my company to run.

And Dave, what exactly did you mean by "That's a just a tiny bit overboard, and I'm not surprised." I'd love to hear what your explanation is.
Eric

Eric
06-09-2007, 09:27 PM
Also, I would like to point out that there are collectors who buy inexpensive game worn shirts to wear around. If that's what they want to do, that is their choice. I would hope if they then re-sold the item, they would mention that the used came from the consumer and not the player.

Back to AMI, it is such a bizarre thing to see four figure items clearly being shown having use added to them by people other than the players.

Is that an overreaction Dave?
Eric

CollectGU
06-09-2007, 09:34 PM
Eric,

I see no upside at all. Only downside as this thread clearly proves. I'm simply stating that to sat they are compromised is very strong wording. That means every time any game used equipment is tried on by someone other than the player it is compromised? Is it a stupid business idea by AMI? yes. Does it make the piece any less authentic? No (in my opinion). I've carefully tried on jerseys that I've bought of players, as have some of my friends. Did I compromise the item? In my opinion, No..

Regards,
Dave

CollectGU
06-09-2007, 09:37 PM
Eric,

I'm not commenting on this thread again. It's already turning into another pissing match....

Regards,
Dave

sportscentury
06-09-2007, 09:56 PM
I'm not commenting on this thread again. It's already turning into another pissing match....

Hmmm, I wonder how that could've happened...

both-teams-played-hard
06-09-2007, 10:46 PM
This isn't about a collector trying on a jersey. This is about a pathetic attempt of a sports memorabilia auction catalog trying to front like a psuedo-hip-poser fashion magazine. There are grown-folks who read the catalog and don't want to be force-fed this nonsense. Want to target an audience and widen your demographic? Then, AMI should quit the memorabilia racket and publish Maxim-type fish-wraps for 20-year-olds. Put the jersey on a mannequin and move on.

Skanks for the memories!

ironmanfan
06-09-2007, 10:52 PM
Actually my first thought when "CollectGU" bought that obvious fake Ripken glove on eBay was how disappointed Kieta was going to be not being able to do a picture shoot with it.....

Nathan
06-09-2007, 11:07 PM
Eric,

I see no upside at all. Only downside as this thread clearly proves. I'm simply stating that to sat they are compromised is very strong wording. That means every time any game used equipment is tried on by someone other than the player it is compromised? Is it a stupid business idea by AMI? yes. Does it make the piece any less authentic? No (in my opinion). I've carefully tried on jerseys that I've bought of players, as have some of my friends. Did I compromise the item? In my opinion, No..

Regards,
Dave

It has nothing to do with the authenticity and everything to do with the condition being compromised. It's one thing for, say, a wool jersey to be stored for 50+ years and be partially eaten by moths. At least then it can be said that an item was unintentionally improperly stored.

But in this case, you're talking about basically a fashion shoot with valuable items from sports history being modeled. Why stop at putting a jersey on? Why not pop a football helmet on and play some two-hand tag? Maybe put a Nettles jersey on for a company softball game?

There's unintentional damage and there's intentional compromising. This definitely falls into the latter.

CollectGU
06-09-2007, 11:13 PM
Actually my first thought when "CollectGU" bought that obvious fake Ripken glove on eBay was how disappointed Kieta was going to be not being able to do a picture shoot with it.....

I'm curious, tell me how you were able to determine that the glove is obviously a fake? What exactly is wrong with it in your opinion? I will add that no Rawlings employee has stated that the glove had the wrong lining as was reported here earlier..

Regards,
Dave

ballofbases@hotmail.com
06-10-2007, 12:22 AM
I just received the magazine/catalog the other day in the mail and could not agree more with what everyone thinks about the marketing being ridiculous for them. Has anyone contacted American Memorabilia to let them know that as a present or future customer that this is not something that wants to be seen??? Just wondering what they have to say about the matter.

And Lampson is a writer as well as an expert authenticator??? HA! who knew!?!?

Michael

hblakewolf
06-10-2007, 07:03 AM
I can’t remember ever seeing such amateurish and ill-conceived antics in another sports memorabilia auction catalog. I’ve received catalogs from Lelands, Grey Flannel, Christies, Sotheby’s and Mastro to name just a few. I can’t remember the last time I saw models shooting hoops or even wearing vintage uniforms in any other auction houses’ catalog. It’s inconceivable to even think that you may see some guy or model wearing a Babe Ruth jersey and shooting hoops in the next Christies catalog.

Likewise, I’ve never been subjected to viewing pages from any of the above-mentioned auction houses of the owners self-promoting themselves, let alone in extremely “creepy” motifs. The first AMI catalog had a photo of Vic and Kieta sitting on a couch. My co-worker happened to see the photo and asked if the guy (Vic) was the little boy in the Munsters, now grown up!

Likewise, I’d be interested to know why Kieta needs to be featured in these catalogs in belly shirts and including past cover shots of her from 1980’s playboy covers? I understand she was a model in the 1980’s, but this is 2007.

Can we expect to possibly see Lou Lampson and the 100% Authentic team modeling in the next catalog?

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

metsbats
06-10-2007, 08:29 AM
There's only one word for the whole approach AMI takes in my opinion

Unprofessional

Perhaps they are compensating for something.

-David

sarahsdad
06-10-2007, 10:16 AM
And your Buyers Premium and Consignment commissions pay for this "magazine".
Sarahsdad

sportscentury
06-10-2007, 11:18 AM
By the way, hats off to whomever did the editing of this catalog. A terrific job!

A few responses to other posts:


The first AMI catalog had a photo of Vic and Kieta sitting on a couch. My co-worker happened to see the photo and asked if the guy (Vic) was the little boy in the Munsters, now grown up!

Howard, this is too funny. Too much for a Sunday morning.


Perhaps they are compensating for something.

David, one has to wonder. I think you may have hit the nail on the head.


And your Buyers Premium and Consignment commissions pay for this "magazine".
Sarahsdad

Solid point. How much could buyers and sellers save if their money was not being spent on this nonsense?

sportscentury
06-10-2007, 12:17 PM
I'm curious, tell me how you were able to determine that the glove is obviously a fake? What exactly is wrong with it in your opinion? I will add that no Rawlings employee has stated that the glove had the wrong lining as was reported here earlier..

Regards,
Dave

Dave,

Below is a quote by Rob Steinmetz (from the original thread about your Ripken glove: http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=8394). I'm trying to balance Rob's statements in that thread and your statement here that "no Rawlings employee has stated that the glove had the wrong lining as was reported here earlier."

Any help?

Thanks,

Reid


It is my understanding that the glove purchased on eBay by Dave O'Brien was recently rejected by Dennis Esken. Apparently the glove has the wrong lining...information that was confirmed with the Rawlings employee who actually made gloves for Cal Ripken, Jr. I'm not sure if Dave was able to get a refund on the glove from the eBay seller, but hopefully the glove isn't sold to another unsuspecting collector as a Ripken gamer.

Rob

geoff
06-10-2007, 01:35 PM
When I see someone wear a game used jersey it just makes me sick.When I was at the Orioles Fanfest this year I saw people buying the Gamers then wearing them the rest of the day.I just don't understand it don'these people know better.

My friend wanted to buy a Orioles game used jersey from me to wear to games this year and I told him I would not sell him one because u just don't do that and he did not understand why.

CollectGU
06-10-2007, 02:39 PM
Dave,

Below is a quote by Rob Steinmetz (from the original thread about your Ripken glove: http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=8394). I'm trying to balance Rob's statements in that thread and your statement here that "no Rawlings employee has stated that the glove had the wrong lining as was reported here earlier."

Any help?

Thanks,

Reid

Hi Reid,

I am stating that incorrect information was presented and that no Rawlings employee ever confirmed or validated the theory that there was something wrong with the lining in the glove.

Regards,
Dave

sportscentury
06-10-2007, 03:25 PM
Hi Reid,

I am stating that incorrect information was presented and that no Rawlings employee ever confirmed or validated the theory that there was something wrong with the lining in the glove.

Regards,
Dave

Dave,

Thanks. In that case, I share your confusion as to what (if anything) is wrong with the glove.

Reid

RobSteinmetz
06-10-2007, 10:26 PM
Reid,

With regard to the information shared about the lining of the Ripken glove, my information was obtained through Dennis Esken (and shared with his permission in this forum). As most know, Denny is widely regarded as the world's foremost authority on game used gloves.

I spoke with Denny again tonight to get his permission to make this follow-up post, and he stands behind the facts presented. According to Denny, he also shared this information with Bob Clevenhagen at Rawlings. To my knowledge, neither Denny nor Bob have authenticated the glove.

Best,

sportscentury
06-10-2007, 11:00 PM
Rob,

Thank you for this information (and thanks to Denny, as well). Sounds like a case of "he said, she said" (or "he said, he did not say," as the case may be). Like you, Rob, I have great respect for Denny's knowledge and integrity.

Again, thank you.

Best,
Reid

richpick
06-10-2007, 11:41 PM
I must admit that I owned a 1985 Home Red Sox Roger Clemens Gamer Jersey and once I did slip it on. But in my defense I did wear a t-shirt and all I did was stand there. I agree to me what American Memoabilia is doing is just poor business sense. Collectors are very particular and would like to assume that a jersey goes from a player straight to the collector.

worldchamps
06-11-2007, 01:36 PM
My problem with this is, what if I really wanted one of those jerseys, and I bought it, would the image of some model wearing it be stuck in my mind?

Maybe the model's name is Gaylord Perry and this is a photomatch to show it was "photo-shoot" worn.

kneerat
06-11-2007, 01:49 PM
This is an interesting one... As some of you know, I am a big Packers memorabilia buyer and seller. I honestly can say, if this model was wearing a game-worn Max McGee or Jim Taylor jersey I would still bid as high as I could. The fact that she was wearing it would not affect my bidding at all.
Just my take.

sportscentury
06-11-2007, 02:17 PM
This is an interesting one... As some of you know, I am a big Packers memorabilia buyer and seller. I honestly can say, if this model was wearing a game-worn Max McGee or Jim Taylor jersey I would still bid as high as I could. The fact that she was wearing it would not affect my bidding at all.
Just my take.

Chris,

Please don't take this the wrong way, but how much advertising does American Memorabilia do with your magazine (Sports Collectors Digest)? I subscribed to SCD for many years, but cancelled my subscription because it was frustrating to see nothing but incredibly positive stories about your advertisers, even when some of them were the centerpieces of great controversy and questionable activities. I'm not trying to be confrontational (I have great respect for many of the guys who work for SCD), but I have to call it as I see it, particularly since this new AMI marketing scheme is such a complete disaster.

Best,
Reid

kneerat
06-11-2007, 02:50 PM
Reid,
Trust me... This has nothing to do with any of that. Also, AMI doesn't advertise as much as they used to. I think toward the end of last year they started distributing and printing their own catalogs... We no longer do that for them.
I bid in many auctions and I think that anyone who knows me will tell you that I would bid on any big Packers item whether it was worn by a mannequin, model or anything else. I am not going to say that I think the model idea will help sell an item, but it doesn't really bother me.

I am sorry to hear you let your subscription run out for those reasons.
We have been adding new features in our magazine, even including a column from gameusedforum.com's Eric Stangel.
Troy Kinunen and Dave Bushing have also contributed this year and other freelancers such as Joe Phillips and Kevin Glew have added some nice game-used memorabilia stories as of late. If you want to continue the discussion about SCD, you may want to send me a private email, call or start a new thread about this, as I wouldn't want to run the risk of hijacking this current topic.
Thanks.

sportscentury
06-11-2007, 02:57 PM
Reid,
Trust me... This has nothing to do with any of that. Also, AMI doesn't advertise as much as they used to. I think toward the end of last year they started distributing and printing their own catalogs... We no longer do that for them.
I bid in many auctions and I think that anyone who knows me will tell you that I would bid on any big Packers item whether it was worn by a mannequin, model or anything else. I am not going to say that I think the model idea will help sell an item, but it doesn't really bother me.

I am sorry to hear you let your subscription run out for those reasons.
We have been adding new features in our magazine, even including a column from gameusedforum.com's Eric Stangel.
Troy Kinunen and Dave Bushing have also contributed this year and other freelancers such as Joe Phillips and Kevin Glew have added some nice game-used memorabilia stories as of late. If you want to continue the discussion about SCD, you may want to send me a private email, call or start a new thread about this, as I wouldn't want to run the risk of hijacking this current topic.
Thanks.

Chris,

Fair enough. Thanks for your response. As an aside, I really miss the articles that Michael Montbriand used to write in SCD about game used bats ... those were the days (Dave Grob's uniform articles were always informative, as well).

Best,
Reid

both-teams-played-hard
06-11-2007, 03:58 PM
As some of you know, I am a big Packers memorabilia buyer and seller.

Did you recently consign a large group of Packers jerseys that were sold by a company through one of eBay's "live" auctions? There were some really nice Packers jerseys!

kneerat
06-11-2007, 04:12 PM
No... I knew the person who consigned them though. He is from the Green Bay area. I bought some of the nameplates he had and some other pieces from that same collection.
Probably one of the best Packers game-used finds of my lifetime.

kingjammy24
06-11-2007, 04:56 PM
didn't the banning of eric, rob, and chris teach any of you anything? will victor be forced to ban every single one of you ingrates before you finally learn your place? if you guys still want to have the privilige of giving your business to AMI, you all ought to pipe down if you know whats good for you.

re: ami's catalog.
i guess i'm the only one who found it funny in that sort of "my 4 yr old made me a breakfast of cereal with ketchup" kind of way. sure it was amateurish but not everyone can be a marketing pro or have good taste.

granted, when i first saw the lolich jersey in some sort of pseudo-calvin klein ad, i didn't find it so comical. it was a little sad to see such a piece being treated like nothing more than a wet tshirt in a hooters ad. i was confused about the intent of the ad. was i supposed to get whipped into a lusty frenzy and bid even more than i normally would? was victor trying to tap into the masses of game-used collectors who enjoy pictures of sweaty, young, shirtless men? in the future, can we look forward to an amazing gehrig game-used bat literally being straddled by some buxom young woman? honestly, i'm not being facetious in the least here. it's one of the most bizarre, misguided pieces of advertising i've ever seen.

a collector putting on a jersey for a few minutes, as we've all done, isn't close to the same thing. i wonder if the consigners consented to having their pieces treated and displayed in such a way. maybe i mollycoddle my pieces but i prefer them not to be subjected to any unnecessary manhandling. key word being unnecessary. if you dont need to subject a piece to sunlight, oils and dirt from peoples hands, further the loosening of the buttons, etc why would you? the lolich isn't exactly a common or new jersey so why subject it to any more stress than necessary? just to produce some ridiculous, ineffective and somewhat offensive ad?

"I’d be interested to know why Kieta needs to be featured in these catalogs in belly shirts and including past cover shots of her from 1980’s playboy covers? I understand she was a model in the 1980’s, but this is 2007."

howard, i don't know the answer to your question but at least we now know what happened to baby jane.

my sincere sympathies go out to dave o'brien who apparently is faced with the unenviable task of editing phrases like "i like to be swooned". reminds me of http://www.engrish.com/recent.php .

i see the 100% team or tracking system or whatever it is added ron fukushima. along with his team contacts and extensive knowledge, ron also brings some great expertise in shill bidding.

rudy.

lund6771
06-12-2007, 11:13 AM
Hi Rudy...

How do you know that Ron Fukushima has been shill bidding?...

Eric
06-12-2007, 11:22 AM
Here is his apology from the old game used forum

http://www.network54.com/Forum/379976/message/1120867150/

Eric
06-12-2007, 11:34 AM
Question for Dave O'Brien

Have you voiced your displeasure about Fukushima with your comrades at AMI?

Here's what you wrote about him on the old site

This is total crap...

July 4 2005 at 12:54 PM Dave (djob0001@yahoo.com) (Login CollectGU (http://www.network54.com/Profile/CollectGU))

Response to Ron (http://www.network54.com/Forum/379976/message/1120495182/Ron)
TRUST NO ONE....that's basically what this hobby has boiled down to. There are no good guys. Ron was supposed to be one, but if Ron was shill bidding, then he is STEALING people's money, and is CORRUPT.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/379976/message/1120496064/last-1120582432/This+is+total+crap...

lund6771
06-12-2007, 11:37 AM
wow...I never heard that

I wonder if AMI will hire Rick Kohl next...

CollectGU
06-12-2007, 12:44 PM
Question for Dave O'Brien

Have you voiced your displeasure about Fukushima with your comrades at AMI?

Here's what you wrote about him on the old site

This is total crap...

July 4 2005 at 12:54 PM Dave (djob0001@yahoo.com) (Login CollectGU (http://www.network54.com/Profile/CollectGU))

Response to Ron (http://www.network54.com/Forum/379976/message/1120495182/Ron)
TRUST NO ONE....that's basically what this hobby has boiled down to. There are no good guys. Ron was supposed to be one, but if Ron was shill bidding, then he is STEALING people's money, and is CORRUPT.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/379976/message/1120496064/last-1120582432/This+is+total+crap...

Eric,

Yes I have.

Regards,
Dave

CollectGU
06-12-2007, 12:57 PM
Eric,

I also believe that people should be given second chances. I know there are forum members who have done business with Ron and have been happy with the product and the service. I've never personally done business with him but have heard good things from others who have.

Regards,

Dave

Eric
06-12-2007, 01:13 PM
I do agree that people should be given second chances. I give him credit for coming on the forum an writing the apology and hopefully he learned a lesson and moved on since then.I am not familiar with the aftermath of the Fukushima controversy.

Were the consumers affected by the shill bidding refunded their money?

lund6771
06-12-2007, 01:41 PM
that's a great question Eric?

Would this have stopped if he didn't get caught?..One can only speculate...

I also saw a post about Fukushima and some Dallas Cowboy's jerseys around 12-13 years ago...If I remember correctly, he had many of their thowback jerseys listid in an SCD ad...Shortly afterwards a collector who had boughten from Fukushima posted a full page ad in SCD about the transaction...(ads those days were running around a $1,000 a week)...he stated that he had contacted the equipment manager of the Cowboys and was told that the team still had possession of the jerseys...the guy went back to Fukusima to get his $, and Fukushima would not refund it to him...out of anger he spent a lot of money to expose Fukushima in SCD...he let everyone else know who had bought one of these, what the facts were...

Dealers like Fukushima have been able to do this to people for years...so what if they screw a collector over....who is the collector gonna tell?...because of the ineternet and this site, collectors do have a voice without taking $1,000 ads out in SCD

Maybe & hopefully he has changed..,.but by looking at a time frame from the Cowboys incident to shill bidding, around 10 years lies in between...who knows what else has happened in the mean time...has his ethics really changed?...or is he just sorry that he got caught?...to many unawnsered questions here for this guy to be working for an auction house

allstarsplus
06-12-2007, 01:48 PM
Eric,

I also believe that people should be given second chances. I know there are forum members who have done business with Ron and have been happy with the product and the service. I've never personally done business with him but have heard good things from others who have.

Regards,

Dave Dave - Your quote above seems to be such a softened stance given your writings from 2005 where you didn't mince words.
Here's what you wrote about him on the old site

This is total crap...

July 4 2005 at 12:54 PM Dave (djob0001@yahoo.com) (Login CollectGU (http://www.network54.com/Profile/CollectGU))

Response to Ron (http://www.network54.com/Forum/379976/message/1120495182/Ron)
TRUST NO ONE....that's basically what this hobby has boiled down to. There are no good guys. Ron was supposed to be one, but if Ron was shill bidding, then he is STEALING people's money, and is CORRUPT.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/37997...+total+crap... (http://www.network54.com/Forum/379976/message/1120496064/last-1120582432/This+is+total+crap...)

I also believe in 2nd chances depending on the severity of the issue, but is it just a crazy coincidence that now that Ron has an association with the authenticator for AMI you now have a change of heart?

Your quotes of TRUST NO ONE...STEALING...CORRUPT are extremely strong words and now you write "have heard good things about him".

Dave, you seem to now talk from both sides of your mouth. It was great to see you voice yourself in an unbiased way in your July 2005 post and now.....Ron's association changes and all of a sudden "I also believe that people should be given chances". Why didn't you say that in your July 2005 post about Ron?

Dave, when are you going to come clean and write with the same objectivity on Lampson and other issues as you did on that July 2005 post?

Andrew

kingjammy24
06-12-2007, 02:44 PM
"Were the consumers affected by the shill bidding refunded their money?"

great question. anyone know the answer? did ron's feelings of guilt simply stop at an apology or did put his money where his mouth was, step up to the plate, and actually make restitution for his fraudulent actions?
to top it off, just like rick kohl, ron was allowed back on ebay.

"Would this have stopped if he didn't get caught?"

do most of these people stop if they aren't caught?

anyway, i'm sure many people have had successful and enjoyable dealings with ron. for me, regardless of the item, life is too short to deal with cheats.

rudy.

both-teams-played-hard
06-13-2007, 03:06 AM
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/9383/tigerbeatlz1.jpg

reed1216
06-13-2007, 05:17 AM
Holy crap!! What has all this turned into?? I feel like I just waded into the Amazon and a school of pirhanas has made its way to me and there's no escape...

Ron admitted he was wrong and has obviously paid a price for a mistake. Not to diminish his error- it was wrong. But what do you guys want? Should he fold up the tents, call it a career and retreat into obscurity?? I ask that everyone who has crushed him for his mistake, have you ever done anything in your personal or professional life that you regret??? I include "personal life" because his errors are as much an indication of a character flaw as a professional one.

I try my best to run my life in a manner that will contribute to me being proud of the person I am and hope to become. However, to portray myself as a flawless figure would be a grotesque distortion. I have made mistakes. I have also been burned by others who have made mistakes. But the bottom line is that we have ALL made mistakes and those who have gone out of our way to be accountable for the mistakes we have made are far better than those who use half truths and semantics to hide theirs.

Let's all back off Ron until there are some FACTS that substantiate him being a crook today. I haven't purchased from Ron in years. In fact, I almost bought his ARod Rangers set, before opting for a jersey with MeiGray papers that was photomatched. It really bums me out to see him being lynched for a mistake that he went out of his way to be accountable for. No one here is perfect and (in my humble opinion) it's time for us all to look at ourselves in the mirror and evaluate what it is we see.

To those that are perfect, you will probably miss my point. But I hope the rest of you can see what it is I am suggesting. Ron doesn't deserve a medal for admitting a mistake, but he does deserve some forgiveness for being accountable for one......

Eric
06-13-2007, 10:11 AM
Reed-

I don't want to speak on behalf of other people, but whenever something like this comes up you'll find that once they or a fellow consumer has been burned, taken advantage of or in this case stolen from (let's remember, that's what shill bidding is), it's hard for many people to forget.

If people have since had positive experiences with Mr. Fukushima, then that's terrific, maybe he did turn things around- but I hope people were compensated for their bids being inflated.

If not, then the issue is still unresolved.

AMI is comfortable with Mr. Fukushima being added to their 100% Authentic authentication staff, which is fine- it's their business decision- just as it was their business decision to play dress-up with the game used equipment, but once again, the consumer does not have to choose to forgive.

The hobby is about taking calculated risks- Is the item genuine? Is the wear from the player? Do I trust the source?

People can choose to forgive those who have tried to take advantage of them, or they can choose to deal with people who would never take advantage of them.

Your name is your value in this hobby. In this case, Fukushima put that on the line when he chose to shill bid. People can forgive if they choose to and I respect that, or they can choose not to, and I respect that too.

When trying not to get ripped off on the next deal, the consumer has the right to make that decision.

Just my opinion
Eric

kingjammy24
06-14-2007, 05:09 PM
"But what do you guys want?"

only what's fair; restitution. ron said he was sorry but i'd like to know if he was sorry enough to actually give back his fraudulent profits. if i ripped you off, would you be satisfied if i simply said "sorry about that" and kept the money?

"have you ever done anything in your personal or professional life that you regret???...the bottom line is that we have ALL made mistakes"

the idea that all mistakes are equal is beyond ludicrous. we've all made mistakes but very few of us have sunk so low as to intentionally defraud people. i'm not perfect but i've never sunk that low. have you? we've all made mistakes but it really takes a special sort of degenerate to scam people out of their money. it's insane to think that not calling my mother enough means i'm no better than a guy who scammed people out of their money.

"..a mistake that he went out of his way to be accountable for."

so you're saying he paid back all of his victims? if so, that's great. honestly.

rudy.