Game Useds off the web

[gameusedfan]

Quick question for anyone willing to help. I notice there a couple of websites (MeiGray, J.O., etc) that sell game used jerseys. First off, they are asking a lot more for these items than what the "bidding process" will bring and sometimes, there is no well-known authenticator standing behind the item. AS A GENERAL RULE, is it acceptable to make an offer for their items in the range of what auction sites (plus the premium) get for the items, even if it is way below their offering price? Do you bid less if they are not backed by a team letter, MEARS, Lampson, MeiGray (etc...) authentication? Thanks in advance. Later

Roger

P.S. Example:
http://www.meigray.com/edealinv/servlet/ExecMacro?nurl=control/StoreItem.vm&ctl_nbr=2381&siId=488089&catLevel=1&scLevel=1&thisCatLevel=&oldParentID=4210&catParentID=4450&scId=4450

[trsent]

Quick question for anyone willing to help. I notice there a couple of websites (MeiGray, J.O., etc) that sell game used jerseys. First off, they are asking a lot more for these items than what the "bidding process" will bring and sometimes, there is no well-known authenticator standing behind the item. AS A GENERAL RULE, is it acceptable to make an offer for their items in the range of what auction sites (plus the premium) get for the items, even if it is way below their offering price? Do you bid less if they are not backed by a team letter, MEARS, Lampson, MeiGray (etc...) authentication? Thanks in advance. Later

Roger

P.S. Example:
http://www.meigray.com/edealinv/servlet/ExecMacro?nurl=control/StoreItem.vm&ctl_nbr=2381&siId=488089&catLevel=1&scLevel=1&thisCatLevel=&oldParentID=4210&catParentID=4450&scId=4450

Roger, I do not understand. If someone offers an item for sale at Peachy Groceries for $12.99 and across the street at Rosie's Groceries the same item is $19.99 but if you drive over to the local street cart vendor the same item is $7.00, should you go to Rosie's and ask them for a lower price?

Really, a guy lists his item for sale at his asking price, sure, make an offer if you wish, but what is the problem? You wish to state that the item isn't worth what they are asking, but then you criticize them for selling without a letter that you find attractive, and you still wish to make an offer for the item?

My point is in a free market, they can set whatever price they wish, and if you can buy it cheaper through a major auction house, why do you insult the seller on here by really pointing out their merchandise the way you have? You don't like that their name may not be as big as a 3rd party's name to write a LOA, really your post seems to insult the seller who is just posting an item for sale with their letter.

Sorry, I just hate it when people don't like the price someone sets to sell their merchandise and they complain about it as you have. Just don't buy it, but don't insult them as you have above.

I once told a guy I needed $5000.00 to sell a jersey, and he laughed and told me I would never get half that. A few days later the auction ended at almost $7000.00.

I got the last laugh.

[gameusedfan]

The two web sites I listed are the only ones I know of that specialize in game-used equipment so incidences of their listed names was not an indictment, just blanket examples of web sites with GU jerseys.

However, I am sorry I asked and for offending you and others. Wasn't trying to insult anyone, was just looking for some advice in a site relating to a budding interest of mine. I will try to avoid asking future questions like this.

[bigtime59]

The two web sites I listed are the only ones I know of that specialize in game-used equipment so incidences of their listed names was not an indictment, just blanket examples of web sites with GU jerseys.

However, I am sorry I asked and for offending you and others. Wasn't trying to insult anyone, was just looking for some advice in a site relating to a budding interest of mine. I will try to avoid asking future questions like this.

Well, it's really difficult to offend me, so don't worry about it. I see absolutely nothing wrong in making an inquiry about an item, and telling the vendor "if you haven't gotten your price for this item by (x date) would you consider offers? I like the piece, but can't afford it at that price." I really believe, that if you're nice about it, and not out to lunch on the pricing, that it never hurts to ask.

[trsent]

I see absolutely nothing wrong in making an inquiry about an item, and telling the vendor "if you haven't gotten your price for this item by (x date) would you consider offers? I like the piece, but can't afford it at that price." I really believe, that if you're nice about it, and not out to lunch on the pricing, that it never hurts to ask.

I think my issue was with how Roger made comments about how the seller was asking more than such items sell for at various auction houses. There is nothing wrong with making an offer, but the issue is that a seller can pick their own price. End of story, if you don't like their price, buy elsewhere.

[kingjammy24]

Roger,

A few words:

- I think you've accidentally missed the point with MeiGray as you've lumped them in with all the other "websites selling game used jerseys", when in fact it couldn't be further from the truth. The price of a jersey is partially influenced on it's provenance. An Eagles jersey sold directly by the Eagles should necessarily cost more than an Eagles jersey sold by BackAlleyHarry on Ebay. You're paying for provenance and in many cases, I think this is a cost worth paying. MeiGray has a formal, contractual agreement with the Philadelphia Eagles, meaning there is documented and tangible proof that MeiGray acquires it's Eagles jerseys directly from the Eagles. When you go to 'another website', where have they acquired their Eagles jerseys from? Maybe it's legit and maybe it isn't. Why wouldn't you pay more and why shouldn't MeiGray charge more for an Eagles jersey that came, without a doubt, directly from the Eagles?

I don't consider MeiGray a typical 'dealer' in that most dealers don't have formal contracts with teams. There isn't a single better place to get a Texas Rangers jersey than MeiGray. They have an exclusive contract with the Rangers. That sort of provenance will cost more and rightfully so. I purchased a couple of jerseys straight from the BlueJays and I paid more than "the bidding process" would suggest. I did this intentionally so I could sleep better at night without any doubt of my Jays jerseys. Sure you can always find a 'cheaper jersey', but are you in this hobby to get the lowest price or to get truly legit pieces? If it's the latter, then it'll cost you more.

Re: MeiGray's lack of a "well-known authenticator".
I think Barry Meisel's pretty well known. It's irrelevant though because what's left to really authenticate with a MeiGray Eagles jersey? They're getting them straight from the team! (And unlike many dealers who say the same, MeiGray actually has documentation regarding their team contracts). I think all that's really needed with an outfit like MeiGray is a letter stating the item was acquired directly from the team.

Re: your question about a lack of a COA/LOA.
Personally, I don't purchase or bid on things with a Lampson letter. For some reason, every time I see a Lampson letter, I just get a nauseous feeling in my stomach so I just avoid his items altogether. As for the other 'authenticators', I don't bid less or bid more if they've written a letter on the item. They don't mean anything to me because with or without their letter, I still need to authenticate every item I purchase. I take very little comfort in a COA or LOA from an authenticator. A team letter or letter directly from the athlete or related person is a whole different matter. (I recently purchased a superb 1990 Cecil Fielder game-used bat. 1990 being the big 51-hr year. I purchased it directly from Duane Ward who was a pitcher for the Jays. I had Duane write a note about how he acquired the bat directly from Cecil after a game at Tiger Stadium in 1990. Duane even wrote that Cecil cracked the bat specifically when he pitched to him and gave it to him after the game. The bat is also signed with a personal inscription to Duane. Based on this, I've been able to narrow down the crack occuring in one of only 3 possible games in 1990). This is not even close to a LOA or COA. Should I ever decide to sell the bat, you can bet it should cost more than a Cecil Fielder bat with no provenance.

Re: making lower offers.
Go ahead and make any offer. Either you'll get laughed at, your offer will be accepted, or they'll start to barter with you depending on how desperate they are to get rid of the item. Either way, I don't think it's "unacceptable" to make a lower offer. If they feel you're lowballing them or they're offended, then what does it matter? It's not like you'll be blacklisted or tarred and feathered. Personally, I'm as concerned with offending a dealer with a low offer as I am with the weather in Borneo.

Joel's right by saying the seller can set any price they want and you obviously are free to go elsewhere. On the same token though, you're free to offer whatever you like and if they don't like it, you can take your offer elsewhere. (Personally though, if I were in the market for an Eagles jersey, I'd probably choose to pay more for a MeiGray and sleep easier at night).

Rudy.

[suave1477]

THIS POST IS TO ( TRSENT / JOEL ) I give you a lot of credit you seem to be very educated and articualte and make great points in your posts, but I do notice everyone who speaks, asks a question, or asks for advice. YOU SLAM. I can see you are a senior member and you know your stuff and have a lot of experience but to the new guys to the hobby EDUCATE THEM DONT SLAM THEM. I noticed you feel everytime you must make a sarcastic example ( about rosies grocereies and peachys ). JUST AS MUCH AS YOU LIKE PEOPLE NOT TO BE NEGATIVE TOWARDS SELLERS. PEOPLE DONT LIKE TO BE SLAMMED WHEN ASKING FOR INNOCENT ADVICE. This last gentleman was asking for advice and proper etiquette of how to handle looking for a valid item, there is nothing wrong with that. YOU DON'T NEED TO SLAM EVERYONE. ( JUST AN OBESERVATION )

[trsent]

THIS POST IS TO ( TRSENT / JOEL ) I give you a lot of credit you seem to be very educated and articualte and make great points in your posts, but I do notice everyone who speaks, asks a question, or asks for advice. YOU SLAM. I can see you are a senior member and you know your stuff and have a lot of experience but to the new guys to the hobby EDUCATE THEM DONT SLAM THEM. I noticed you feel everytime you must make a sarcastic example ( about rosies grocereies and peachys ). JUST AS MUCH AS YOU LIKE PEOPLE NOT TO BE NEGATIVE TOWARDS SELLERS. PEOPLE DONT LIKE TO BE SLAMMED WHEN ASKING FOR INNOCENT ADVICE. This last gentleman was asking for advice and proper etiquette of how to handle looking for a valid item, there is nothing wrong with that. YOU DON'T NEED TO SLAM EVERYONE. ( JUST AN OBESERVATION )

Ok, I am sorry if my reply came off that way. I really am.

I believe the point I was trying to make is the seller was being punished for 1. Selling at a price they feel is reasonable (we don't need to know their reasons) and 2. For not having a letter from a 3rd party authenticator. Needless to say, I felt their question unfair to the seller in the link offered in the original post - Making a legitimate company look like a bad guy.

You can question how anyone sets a price, but the comments about what papers come with their items really got under my skin.

I DO NOT SLAM EVERYONE - by the way. I have now publicly stated that I am sorry if anyone felt this way. I was not trying to pick on anyone, just defend a 3rd party that has done not a thing wrong.

To answer the original question at hand - Yes, email or call the seller and make them a counteroffer. They may say yes, no, or something close, but then you can be happy you tried. In the meantime, don't use other auction prices to set a market. I see an item sell on eBay for one price and then go for five times more in a private auction house and I can never figure out why.

Case closed?

[lee pdx]

I don't consider MeiGray a typical 'dealer' in that most dealers don't have formal contracts with teams. There isn't a single better place to get a Texas Rangers jersey than MeiGray. They have an exclusive contract with the Rangers.

Rudy.
Forgive my ignorance, but I am new to game-used and signed memorabilia collecting arena and have been very particular about the authenticators/ guarantors of memorabilia that I have purchased. Accordingly, I would have passed on a 'MeiGray' item without thinking twice simply because I do not recognize the name. Thus, I would appreciate it if some of you wouldn't mind educating me a bit... For example:

(1) who are some of the the 'reputable' memorabilia dealers (to date, I have generally limited my purchasing to items from/by MLB, Steiner, Tri-Star, Mounted Memories and individual players sites such as the Clemens Foundation)?

(2) who would have (or have had) an exclusive contract/be an atypical dealer (like MeiGray in the example above) for Clemens (Boston/Toronto/New York/Houston era) game used memorabilia or Nolan Ryan game used memorabilia (if there were any 'exclusive contracts' in that era)?

Thanks in advance for the tutilage,

Lee

[kingjammy24]

1) it's somewhat difficult to say who has a good rep and who doesn't because for every dealer that someone says is good, someone else will
disagree. i think what matters to me is the intent and behaviour of the dealer. almost every dealer at some point will acquire a fake item in
their inventory. it's not that big a deal. what really matters is that the dealer genuinely tries their hardest to discern good from bad (as
opposed to just selling anything that comes down the pipe for the sake of profit) and that when one of their items (sold or otherwise) is
shown to be fake, they act ethically and responsibly. As well, this behavior should extend throughout the entire process from
communications with potential buyers to actually buying and selling.
Under those criteria, I'd say Dennis at www.sportswarehouseinc.com (http://www.sportswarehouseinc.com) is a great guy. Rob Steinmetz (www.authenticgamers.com (http://www.authenticgamers.com)), Howard
Wolf, Jim Yackel (www.jimyackel.com (http://www.jimyackel.com)), Chris Boyd for Astros items (www.egameused.com (http://www.egameused.com)) also come to mind. MeiGray/Barry Meisel (www.meigray.com (http://www.meigray.com)) for Texas Rangers, Philadelphia Eagles, and Dallas Mavericks items. Steiner for Yankees items (www.steinersports.com (http://www.steinersports.com)), John Taube for bats (www.gameusedbats.com (http://www.gameusedbats.com))
Andy of Vintage Bats (www.vintagebats.com (http://www.vintagebats.com)).

2) Re-posted from an earlier thread:

Master List- Teams who sell game used- need help
July 26 2005 at 9:46 AM Eric (Premier Login ecky3)
Forum Owner
Hey everyone-
I'm working on a master list of teams who sell their game used items directly. Based on the info you can provide, I'll keep updating this page.
Thanks Eric

Baseball

Atlanta Braves (Barry Sanders)

Baltimore Orioles (fan fest)

Chicago Cubs (garage sale)

Chicago White Sox (garage sale)

Cincinnati Reds (team store- jerseys bats and batting helmets.
(Reds Caravan team sale)

Cleveland Indians (team store- jerseys, bats and lineup cards) (garage sale)

Colorado Rockies (through Steve Tomlinson & Dugout Stores) (7 different phone #'s available)

Detroit Tigers (team store- bats)

Florida Marlins 2004 Team sets sold to Wayne Otto at http://www.gamewornuniforms.com (http://www.gamewornuniforms.com/)

Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim (fanfest)

Los Angeles Dodgers (a lot of them go to Scott Welkowsky www.authentic-sports.com (http://www.authentic-sports.com/))

Milwaukee Brewers Team Store Phone: (262) 789-1148

Minnesota Twins Team Store Phone: (952) 546-0815
651-635-0777
952-891-2934

New York Mets AMAZIN’ MEMORABILIA gameused@nymets.com
Phone: (718) 559-3144
Shea Stadium
123-01 Roosevelt Ave.
Flushing, NY 11368

New York Yankees (yankees steiner)
http://www.steinersports.com/256984.html

Oakland A's (garage sale- fanfest)

Pittsburgh Pirates (Team Store- bats) (also Team Fanfest (Christine Serkoch 412-325-4781) She works for Fanfest- do not call direct to buy a jersey)

San Francisco Giants Team Store phone #415-972-2000

St. Louis Cardinals (team store- BP jerseys, game used)

Tampa Bay Devil Rays 2004 Team sets sold to Wayne Otto at http://www.gamewornuniforms.com (http://www.gamewornuniforms.com/)

Texas Rangers (http://www.meigray.com (http://www.meigray.com/))

Toronto Blue Jays (Team Store run by Mike Andrejak michael.andrejek@bluejays.ca)

Washington Nationals (team store)

Football

Buffalo Bills
http://www.buffalobillsproshop.com/m...Title=Sideline (http://www.buffalobillsproshop.com/main_parentgroup.cfm?gid=10&sAuxTitle=Sideline)

Cincinnati Bengals (team store)

Dallas Cowboys
http://www.cowboysonlineproshop.com/...Title=Sideline (http://www.cowboysonlineproshop.com/main_parentgroup.cfm?gid=9&sAuxTitle=Sideline)

Miami Dolphins
http://www.miamidolphinsproshop.com/...le=Game%20Worn (http://www.miamidolphinsproshop.com/main_parentgroup.cfm?gid=9&sAuxTitle=Game%20Worn)

Minnesota Vikings
http://vikingmerchandise.com/vikings...ome.php?cat=48 (http://vikingmerchandise.com/vikings/customer/home.php?cat=48)

New York Giants
http://www.giantsproshop.com/main_pa...le=Game%20Worn (http://www.giantsproshop.com/main_parentgroup.cfm?gid=9&sAuxTitle=Game%20Worn)

Philadelphia Eagles
http://shop.philadelphiaeagles.com/s...?deptcode1=522 (http://shop.philadelphiaeagles.com/showitems.asp?deptcode1=522)
and
(http://www.meigray.com (http://www.meigray.com/))

Tennessee Titans
http://www.titansproshop.com/main_pa...le=Game%20Worn (http://www.titansproshop.com/main_parentgroup.cfm?gid=9&sAuxTitle=Game%20Worn)

Basketball

Dallas Mavericks
(http://www.meigray.com (http://www.meigray.com/))

Hockey
22 of 30 teams
(http://www.meigray.com (http://www.meigray.com/))

[lee pdx]

Rudy, thanks for the info. -Lee