Historic Auctions Tony Gwynn jersey

[Nathan]

http://cgi.ebay.com/Tony-Gwynn-1994-Game-Used-Jersey_W0QQitemZ230154850436QQihZ013QQcategoryZ605 97QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


I love the Lampson LOA here. First, the body tag looks sharp enough to shave with (if I shaved, but that's another story). Second, the "light overall wear does not appear to be a result of game use, rather unconventional laundering after the fact".

This is being represented as a Tony Gwynn gamer here. Is it or is it not?

[Vintagedeputy]

Its linty!

[skipcareyisfat]

Conversely, the actual description says, "This jersey is amazing, showing extreme game use and wear. There is pilling all across the front, as well as fraying and puckering of the numbers in the back." The relationship between seller and authenticator here seems appropriate given that Lou doesn't bother to look at the stuff he authenticates, while HA apparently doesn't bother to examine the LOUs that accompany their crap.

[skipcareyisfat]

...and how does one give a 7.5 to a jersey whose "light overall wear" is due to "unconventional laundering after the fact?"

[Eric]

Is the gwynn jersey being sold on ebay the same as the one listed Historic Auctions' previous auction?

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:3WYzDFq39rQJ:www.historicauctions.c om/search/showphotos/auctionid/32935/+site:www.historicauctions.com+gwynn&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=6&gl=us&ie=UTF-8

The pinstripes match up with the numbers and the nameplate but the only difference that I can see is- the Gwynn jersey offered in the Historic Auctions auction had a hologram on the #1. The one on ebay has no hologram.

Here again is the link to the ebay auction
http://cgi.ebay.com/Tony-Gwynn-1994-Game-Used-Jersey_W0QQitemZ230154850436QQihZ013QQcategoryZ605 97QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[kingjammy24]

the 2 gwynn jerseys are identical in every single aspect.

the HA ebay guerrero:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230155260924
is the same one they auctioned off here:
http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:5N9iXS2fX1sJ:www.historicauctions.c om/search/showphotos/auctionid/37512/+site:www.historicauctions.com+guerrero&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=us

the HA ebay boggs:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230155260906
is the same one they auctioned off here:
http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:-bDnYiN9QpgJ:www.historicauctions.com/search/list/auctionid/36745/+site:www.historicauctions.com+boggs&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=us

the HA ebay sanchez:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230155260941
is the same one they auctioned off here:
http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:S1jUTtksTAQJ:www.historicauctions.c om/search/list/auctionid/36724/+site:www.historicauctions.com+sanchez&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

the HA ebay ortiz:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230155260901
is the same one they auctioned off here:
http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:25wR8NAqVOUJ:www.historicauctions.c om/search/list/auctionid/37525/+ortiz+%22historic+auctions%22+jersey&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

the HA ebay ramirez:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230155260934
is the same one they auctioned off here:
http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:hRg9st_hLP0J:www.historicauctions.c om/search/list/auctionid/37575/+site:www.historicauctions.com+ramirez&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

the HA ebay reggie williams:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230154850418
is the same one they auctioned off here:
http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:4yFF9y-lpSkJ:www.historicauctions.com/search/showphotos/auctionid/33412/+site:www.historicauctions.com+reggie&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=22&gl=us

my goodness that's odd. so many "sold" jerseys being sold again, on ebay no less. especially odd given that historic's next incredible auction is less than a month away. i wonder why the "consigners" of all these jerseys allowed HA to auction them off on ebay when the consigners could've sold them on ebay themselves. even poirot couldn't figure out this mystery.

seriously, i suppose the real mystery is why anyone in this day and age even bids with historic auctions.

rudy.

[allstarsplus]

Did you see on most of the auctions they are USER ID KEPT PRIVATE

private listing - bidders' identities protected US $2.25http://pics.ebaystatic.com/aw/pics/s.gifJul-24-07 14:03:31 PDThttp://pics.ebaystatic.com/aw/pics/s.gifhttp://pics.ebaystatic.com/aw/pics/s.gifhttp://pics.ebaystatic.com/aw/pics/s.gifhttp://pics.ebaystatic.com/aw/pics/s.gif

private listing - bidders' identities protected US $2.00http://pics.ebaystatic.com/aw/pics/s.gifJul-24-07 10:11:48 PDT

[allstarsplus]

seriously, i suppose the real mystery is why anyone in this day and age even bids with historic auctions.

rudy.

I figure people bid because on some of the real items the prices have been reasonable. I stopped bidding in their auctions a while ago, but in their first auction I got a few really nice items.

To turn your statement around, the bigger question is why anyone in this day and age even consigns with historic auctions.

If items are going to eBay then aren't we to assume bidders are now not paying????

Andrew

[kingjammy24]

"..the bigger question is why anyone in this day and age even consigns with historic auctions. If items are going to eBay then aren't we to assume bidders are now not paying????"

andrew,

i'm not sure why so many items that received multiple bids and were listed as "sold" are now being dumped on ebay. especially given that historic's next auction is right around the corner. is historic saying that they believe these items will realize higher sales prices on ebay than in their own auctions?

just so i'm clear on your statement, are you saying that you believe that historic has actual consigners and that most of those items weren't consigned by james brown himself?

rudy.

[Eric]

Tony Gwynn jersey sold for $368.63

[kingjammy24]

here's how these jerseys faired:

Vladimir Guerrero 2006 Game Used Angels Jersey
historic's auction: $878.90 (incl BP)
ebay: $815.00

Wade Boggs Game Used Coach's Jersey
historic's auction: $203.73 (incl BP)
ebay: $203.50

Freddie Sanchez Signed Game Used Jersey
historic's auction: $460.00 (incl BP)
ebay: $275.00

David Ortiz Game Used Jersey
historic's auction: $842.57 (incl BP)
ebay: $954.00

Manny Ramirez Signed Game Used Jersey
historic's auction: $920.00 (incl BP)
ebay: $1182.87

Reggie Williams Game Used Jersey
historic's auction: NO BIDS
ebay: NO BIDS

when you don't include the buyer's premium, 4 of 5 jerseys sold for more on ebay than they did at historic's auction.

rudy.

[Eric]

Wait-
only 2 pieces sold for more on ebay, right? Ortiz and Ramirez

[kingjammy24]

"when you don't include the buyer's premium"

historic has a 15% buyer's premium. for an accurate comparison between sales prices, the buyers premium should be removed as ebay doesn't charge one.

guerrero jersey sold on historic for $747.06 not including buyer's premium. with the buyer's premium it was $878.90.

$747.06 is less than the $815.00 it later sold for on ebay. not including buyer's premium in either case, ebay managed to realize a higher sales price on 4 of the 5 jerseys (not including the reggie williams which did not receive any bids in both cases).

rudy.

[kingjammy24]

the carlos lee jersey that historic sold for $267.41 in historic's last auction is now being offered by ASI here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180159393221

the carlos beltran jersey that historic sold for $302.50 here:
http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:bg4-vIemXyUJ:www.historicauctions.com/search/showphotos/auctionid/33425/+site:www.historicauctions.com+beltran&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

is now being offered by ASI here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180158972634

the hideki matsui that historic sold for $990 here:
http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:uEc7ODZCYSEJ:www.historicauctions.c om/search/showphotos/auctionid/32926/+site:www.historicauctions.com+matsui&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

is now being sold by historic on ebay here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230170862008

i'm curious why so many Historic consigners would agree to have their jerseys sold on ebay 3-4 months after the auction ended, especially given the fact that Historic's next auction is right around the corner. when Historic sells these jerseys on ebay, do the consigners still owe a seller's fee? of course, with so many jerseys that appeared "sold" later hitting ebay it makes me wonder if they really were consigned or whether these jerseys were all really the property of james brown and brad wells/ASI using their own auction house to dump items.

rudy.

[bigjimsguitars]

Man, it's scary that what appears to a newbie like me (well I'm a newbie only because I stopped collecting for about 12 years and recently gotten the bug again) that what on the surface appears to be a legit auction house that if what is being said here is true is to avoided like the plague.

Who are the reputable merchants of real game used?

[lund6771]

bigjim

I sure hope the "suits" are reading these posts...I used to collect a while ago like yourself, and have recently come back also....be carefull, do your homework, and ask questions here

[bigjimsguitars]

bigjim

I sure hope the "suits" are reading these posts...I used to collect a while ago like yourself, and have recently come back also....be carefull, do your homework, and ask questions here

There was a time when I was able to get game used bats directly from the Los Angeles Dodgers and since I had the old dugout seats from my uncle, I actually got some nice stuff directly from some of the players.

That was in the mid 1990's, on or about the same time the press took off with many stories of bogus autographs (which there were) and it spilled over into other area's of collecting such as Game Used.

It got to the point where I would show off some of my stuff to friends and such and they would surely ask hey how do you know it's not a fake or is it really game used to the point it was bothersome and frankly I lost interest in it for that and other reasons.

It should be noted that many teams would make jerseys, bats and other clubhouse stuff that was legit available to the public or to season ticket holders and such...much of that has also gone by the wayside as corporate enities have forged into the picture and are now the ones who have entered into contracts with many teams to have the exclusive rights to such game used items.

Is it good or bad, I haven't gotten to that point yet, I do know that the prices are very high now on the semi-star to super star items, whereas the everyday players items can be at times very affordable.

Maybe not the right forum, but what really irks me is how much some of the authenticators are charging to verify autographs and is based on the overall monetary value of the player in question... Gimme a break, $20.00 for a common or semi-star player and $50.00 and more for a star?

So they cash in on your efforts to obtain a valuable autograph and because of their stamp of approval is worth more eventhough it takes the same expertise as for that same autograph werein they only charge $20.00 to authenticate it?

It's become a hands out give me the money industry spawned by those who feel the need to create and sell fake items...

No doubt even the so called experts have made mistakes and have said things that were the real deal, weren't and visa versa.

I will say that I thing from what I have seen so far that this forum is trying to and appears to be a great place to get great and useful information about the hobby which is refreshing to say the least.

Nevertheless, it's too bad that their will always be those in the marketplace that feel the need to rip people off with outright fakes...

Sorry for the long and rambling editorial!

[TNTtoys]

with so many jerseys that appeared "sold" later hitting ebay it makes me wonder if they really were consigned or whether these jerseys were all really the property of james brown and brad wells/ASI using their own auction house to dump items.
rudy.

I didn't think of this as a reason, but it certainly makes a lot of sense. When I first saw the trend of same items selling at one place and then selling for a second time at another place only a couple of months later, I was thinking that the item did not sell at all the first time around, and that a form of shill bidding was in play - hence a "bid" for the lowest amount that the consigner wanted for the jersey was placed on the item, and when that wasn't reached, it was "sold" to the consigner... however, in reality it was not sold at all. Then, the auction house looked for a channel other than their own to unload the item, as it would appear sort of strange to the regualar customers of the auction house to see the same jersey sell in back to back auctions?