Mickey Mantle UDA Ball

[sammy]

Any comments?

http://cgi.ebay.com/UDA-Mickey-Mantl...QQcmdZViewItem

[sammy]

[Yankwood]

Any comments?

http://cgi.ebay.com/UDA-Mickey-Mantl...QQcmdZViewItem

Yes, I believe it says "Mickey Mantle"

[Swoboda4]

This is a very good seller but he mostly auctions cards. To be honest the signature looks like there's a couple of "stop points". The signature doesn't appear fluid and the two half moon M's look almost like quarter moons. The first "M" is where I see a stop point. I'm looking at a half dozen Mantle baseballs I've gotten signed personally over the years and I never seen as much separation between the y and the start of "Mantle". The COA states:"the signature WAS WITNESSED by an Upper deck authentication representative.." Does that mean he saw Mantle sign it or he "witnessed" the autograph-post signing? ---Now quick ,reference this to something game used before Eric or Chris throws us off.
Robert

[trsent]

I know UDA's policy is to witness all autographs in person from their authentication process. I know often on the trading card side this may vary, but I was always told items with the UDA hologram were witnessed in person by an UDA representative.

[cohibasmoker]

Guys, what's the problem with the ball? Isn't it any good?

[Swoboda4]

I'm not a Mantle expert but I do observe in this example that the usual half moon "M" in "M"ickey and "M"antle are not as full or round,at the bottom as expected. The "M's" look pointed rather than slightly turned at the beginning. The first "M" doesn't appear to be done fluidly,in one motion and with the appearance of a stop point. Mantle was so consistent with his penmanship that any variation gets me nervous.

[PJK]

Remember a few things Mickey was a major drunk. I met him one time at his bar when I was staying at the St. Moritz next door. He signed a menu sloppy drunk and his signature was different then the norm. I also don't care how consistentent your sig is the #1 signed ball will be slightly different from ball #1000. Mickey might have been also talking to a UDA rep who happened to be a hot female and his brain was thinking of ""Gee, I wonder..." that's why it's not a consitent text book Mick sig. You can start a sig and have a hand cramp also. You try signing 1000-2000 baseballs at one time and tell me if they look the same. Having someone talking to you may also distract you from placing it perfectly on the sweet spot. I'm sure half of the time when these athletes are signing stuff they are not actually looking at where they are signing it. I'm sure a UDA exec gives the ball to Mick with the sweet spot up. But I would be shocked that he didn't ocasionally sign a side pannel of a ball by mistake. I know athletes that have done these signings and they normally don't exactly like doing them.

I remember seeing several years a go Matt Groening, the creator of THE SIMPSONS, sign at the famous San Diego Comic-Con. He signed for almost 5 hours. Matt's sig is basically printing as most artists do yet it does have a certain style and consistency to it. I saw sigs that people got and sketches from Matt during hour 1 and hour 5. Hour 1 they were textbook Groening sigs and sketches. Hour 5 where his hand was actaully shaking and it looked like a 75 year old man was doing them. Those people that got Matt to authentically do a sketch of Bart or Homer, have alsost 0 chance of anyone ever believing that he did that sketch at the hour 5 ones, even though they are authentic.

-PJK

[Swoboda4]

A final comment from me on this non-game used thread and one that Sammy cryptically started but hasn't responded to,but I know he has a life outside of this forum and will say something when time allows. PJK-your comments about how and why this ball can look like this are 1,000% correct and may have answered all this. Some of the Mantle personal stuff wasn't neccessary since he owned up to his shortcomings like a man,and in particular since he's dead. My comments are strickly based on how the ball looks to me. I have and will buy from this dealer. But understand that Mantle is the number 1 forger target in the hobby and Mantle's worse effort can look like someone else's best.
Robert

[PJK]

Robert,

I was in no way trying to demean the Mick in my comments. He was one of the nicest guys I have ever met. He bought my group of friends from college that were with me several rounds of drinks and told us some great stories about living at the St Moritz during his playing days. Trust me on this I respect anyone that owns up to there shortcomings like the Mick did. And yes I know Mick is one if not they most forged sigs in the business. I was just stating what I thought were some obviuos facts that I think often get forgotten on a regular basis 1)It's physically impossible to sign your name picture perfect when you sign 1000-2000 items at a time, Not even for Pete Rose 2)Signatures look different if you are a)Sittting down b)you're not tired c)you're not talking to someone d)you're not running through an airport to catch a plane. etc....

I can't tell you how many times I have gone to the bank with a million things on my mind and printed my name instead of signing it on the back of a check I'm depositing.

-PJK