1994 Bills Throwback Question

[mchmaj]

LOLOLOL
at least we did learn something here

[G1X]

Marcus,

I've seen pictures of about 4 Bills. Of the 4 players, I noted that their sleeves appear to differ in the way they are hemmed/cut/tucked. That still leaves 42 players, so I will waste my time viewing the video.

Since many folks are able to discern sleeve stripes from grainy black & white coach's film taken from the top of the pressbox, I am sure that there will be no problem seeing if any Bills player had one or two sets of stripes in viewing the videos of the Monday Night telecast. I tend to trust what you are saying as the Bills are your team, but I would just like to be for certain before I go public with such a statement.

Mark Hayne
Gridiron Exchange
gixc@veriuzon.net

[mchmaj]

HELP YOURSELF !
you refuse to accept that i was right after all
way to go
marcus

[G1X]

Marcus,

My intent is not to refuse to accept what you have said. I think that I have made myself painfully clear, and anyone reading my numerous, exhaustive posts, clearly understands my point. As I said in my last post, I tend to trust what you are saying as the Bills are your team

If you are taking all of this personally, my apologies as that is not my intent. Feel free to contact me offline if you continue have an issue as I don't think we are answering my question about the video by going around and around on the same issues.

I am hoping that the video proves beyond any further doubt that you are absolutely right, because it seems to be very important to you to be right.

Mark Hayne
Gridiron Exchange
gixc@verizon.net

[mvandor]

HELP YOURSELF !
you refuse to accept that i was right after all
way to go
marcus

M, whatever your knowledge of Bills unis is, and it may be very substantial, it doesn't alter the fact that your people skills could use some work, my friend. Doesn't help you or the board population if you're abrasive and alienate others in making your points.

JMHO.

[mchmaj]

woodfrey got the jersey from GF,and someone sent it to GF . what i am trying to say that the jersey is originally from a guy in florida, sidenotes, he sold more than 1 kelly throwback jerseys....theres other blank kelly on back only without any numbers sold awhile ago on EBAY so whats ODD of 2 bills throwback kelly jersey with error TWO stripes on the sleeves....

The bills throwback jerseys have only one stripe sleeves with TWO STYLES that has one with screened on/painted stripes on the into loose/open sleeves and other one is the tighting band with dye colors of white red white that sewn attached to the sleeves.

the points you should look at, why would BILLS order the cloth tighting bands on the throwback jerseys ? in the past the bills worn screened/painted stripes on the sleeves, IF any players wanted to tighting their sleeves, THE BILLS reopened the screened/painted stripes on the sleeves, and added the elastic bands inside the sleeves to tight it up. BILLS practiced that for awhile

my point of that, what i think that YOU STILL THINK bills throwback jerseys have two stripes on the sleeves, am i correct ? okay, why would BILLS ordered the cloth elastic bands IF the sleeves have two stripes, the BILLS would have cut the sleeves off and reopen the sleeves and add the elastic band inside and showed only one stripe sleeves.

that what bills praticed for long time, you can look at 1990 bills team, they worn two stripes on sleeves. for example kelly cut off his sleeves to be loose sleeves and it was left only one stripe on the sleeves, some other cut off and tighting it up with elastic bands but into one stripe sleeves or two sleeves. some players left two stripes open/loose sleeves. I CAN SEE THAT THEY HAVE TAILORING SLEEVES. for the 1994 bills pictures i have provided doesnt show any tailoring sleeves.

I am historian so i study pictures and research them very well. i have primary and secondary sources that provide back up information to the jerseys i am collecting...

I am not sure if i was correct, GF got issues with their authenting the jerseys in the past ?? seem someone didnt do their homework ?

to be clear here, kelly jersey woodfrey is AUTHENTIC JERSEY, its not game nor issued jersey.
thank you

[gobills123]

back from the dead. Was a good read!!!

This has turned into my new grail. Good to know there are a 'few' out there... even if they do have the wrong sleeves....

[gobills123]

I've used this thread a few times over the years are reference. Parts are very helpful. I wish I was aware of the site over the years as there are some serious information issues - but whats in the past is in the past and we can leave it be. Just worth mentioning if someone else come along looking at this for reference.

What is odd to me is other teams seem pretty easy to acquire a 94 throwback.
The Bills on the other hand, SUPER tough. I've only ever come across a blue fina, white delvin ( incomplete ) and have found a picture of a white Fina that sold at auction. I wonder why these are so difficult to acquire? Odd. Did other teams offer them at retail? The Bills never sold them in the Bills store, or had a 'retail' authentic jersey like their normal white/blue champion did. It seems that any that got out there were still coming from someone one the equpt staff or someone of the sort.

The Fina/Devlin are all cuffed. That picture of the Reich makes it look as though the 2nd stripe is hemmed - tucked and fastened on the inside - BUT if I were to guess I'd guess they were manufactured with 1 stripe, OR because its SO LONG, the 2nd stripe was sewn under. Either way the previous owner of this Kelly said it came from a 'connect' in the locker room. The Fina came from CL and the seller said his father had a connect with the locker room as well. Both came from CL, but were 2 totally different people. Seems there were many 'connects' back then.

Where things get weird for me is this.... I'm not aware of these being sold at retail. I've seen a black box that had a Bills 35th logo on the front that was speculated might have contained a jersey.

Kelly generally wore size 42, but as he got older his size (94-96) jumped to a 44.

Here is what I think is weird. Kelly wore this jersey and to my understanding the jersey he ACTUALLY wore isnt in a collection. I've seen 1 blue in a collection thats autographed and framed.... that is a double stripe. There is one displayed in the HOF in Canton that claims to be 'game worn'.... that has a double stripe. I'd guess neither of those jerseys are the one pictured with a COA earlier in this thread - that is double striped.

Now, with white - the one Kelly wore in the game was single striped. Same idea as the Blue. Personally, I've only ever come across/seen the one that I acquired the other day and a picture on the back of a 2001 Donruss Throwback Threads card (claiming it was game worn etc and obviously wasnt) and this was double striped as well.

Heres the weird part IMO... Bills jerseys from 91-96 that are actually legit from the locker room equpt staff SHOULD and WILL have a number on the inside 100% polyester tag. This is done a certian way and its easy to tell what someone has tried to fake and whats legit. Its some sort of inventory that doesnt directly correspond with the game it was used in other than a low # will be easier to find earlier in the year.

This white Kelly, that the previous owner had for 20+ years framed is a double striped SIZE 46 and the inside tag says #16 in the correct fashion.

Now, I knew going into this that this wasnt the 'hero' jersey so to speak and it wasnt what was worn. I dont care because frankly as a Kelly collector I try and get as many 'feelers' out there as I can and after acquiring the Gamblers one - a blue or white throwback became my pipe dream and white whale/ holy grail. Used or unused, a tough get and not one I thought I'd EVER own.

That #16 though... it got me thinking.
Whats more likely? The Bills made a limited edition jersey that was made with double stripes to differentiate that was then autographed and sold - say 35? (pick a number, just using that in case that black box with the 35 logo was what they were sold in - think the same type of box you see the top of the line Nike football gloves sold it) OR when everything was done they had a couple blanks and had them made up in house as KELLY (with no regard to size, but at least getting the cut right - unlike some charity jerseys from this period where they used a cuffed micromesh blank for a KELLY).

That #16 is the curious part.
I feel like even if it was a limited edition thing I'd have seen more of these over the years rather than just the 5 (blue/white combined) not counting the actual gamers. But as these games took place in weeks 3 and 4, its a weird # for sure.

I guess it also depends the extend of the abilities the Bills had to number on site. I know back in the day blanks were shipped and a local sports store would apply numbers and letters/plates - but since these all the the Champion font - maybe the plates were all that was done in house (which makes sense because preseason and bubble players always had the old sand knit font nameplates rather than the Champion.

[gobills123]

[gobills123]

Mark, you were quite active in the 1st incarnation of this thread.
Have you since learned anything about this 94 throwbacks between now & then?
Have you seen anything similar with other teams?
Thanks for the help and time!