MEARS Authentication....

[aeneas01]

given dave grob's recent "open letter" to lou lampson i thought it might be a good time to see how well mears's past work (or, rather, mears's well-advertised approach to authenticating items) held up to lampson's work as far as game-used football helmets (my particular game-used passion!) are concerned. i believe someone mentioned that all of mears's loas are available at the mears website but that this info is reserved for paying members only. given that i am not a paying mears member and don't have access to these loas, i instead resorted to mastro's auction house archives.

anyway, the first four game-used helmets i came across that were authenticated by mears ("dave bushing & troy kinunen / mears") are listed below - unfortunately they appear to be as problematic as some of the game-used helmets i've come across with a lampson loa...


1. tony gonzalez 2000 kansas city chiefs sigend game used helmet - loas from dave bushing & troy kinunen / mears, steve grad psa / dna and james spence authentication.




problems: 1) in 2000 the chiefs wore a derrick thomas memorial decal on their helmets in recognition of his passing, this helmet does not have this decal, 2) the nfl did not sport american flags on their helmets in 2000, 3) missing warning decal, 4) gonzalez's 2000 helmet was not reconditioned (freshly painted) nor was his 2001 helmet as evidenced in the photos below (notice the visible jaw pad rivets) - the helmet appearing in this auction has been freshly painted, 5) gonzalez never wore the type of facemask pictured. note: bottom right hand photo from 2001 season to show unpainted jaw pad rivets, all other photos from 2000 season.






2. 1980s lyle blackwood miami dolphins game used helmet - loa from dave bushing & troy kinunen / mears.





problems: 1) lyle blackwood, like his teammate brother gelnn blackwood, was a "schutt/bike" man not a riddell man - the helmet in the auction is a riddell, 2) the dave overstreet memorial decal would date this helmet to 1984, the only year the dolphins featured overstreet's decal - in 1984 the dolphins also faced the niners in the super bowl, 3) following photos 1) lb's first year with the fins (1981), 2) lb playing in the 1984 super bowl against the niners, 3) the blackwood brothers leaving the field together in 1984, 4) the blackwood brothers in lyle's final season (1986) - blackwood can clearly be seen sporting a schutt/bike in all photos, not a riddell as offered in the auction.






3. 1980s jerry sisemore philadelphia eagles game used helet - loa from dave bushing & troy kinunen / mears.





problems: 1) eagles never wore white facemasks, 2) like many philadelphia eagles of this era, jerry sisemore sported a classic maxpro clearshell during the late 70s, early 80s (1978-1982), not a riddell as pictured in the auction. he wore a riddell from 1973-1977 and, most likely due to maxpro going out of business in the early 80s, his final two seasons (1983-1984), 3) the riddell helmet pictured in the auction is molded of white plastic and painted green which would suggest that it is from the very early 70s, not 80s as stated in the item description, 4) in all of the photos and film clips i have seen of sisemore wearing a riddell helmet, pre and post maxpro, he is wearing an impregnated green shell not a white one painted green, 5) photos below show sisemore sporting his classic maxpro clearshell during 1978-1982 era.







4. 1980s louis wright denver broncos game used helmet - loa from dave bushing & troy kinunen / mears.





problems: 1) like lyle blackwood mentioned above, louis wright was a "bike/schutt" man not a riddell man - the helmet pictured in the auction is a riddell, 2) did wright sport a riddell when he first entered the league as a bronco in 1975, early in his career? hard to say - but from available photos and film frames it's clear that he wore bike/schutt from at least 1978 through 1986 (his final year), the years that the advertised helmet is said to have been used by wright, 3) photos below - wright sporting his schutt/bike during the 80s.








comments:

as i mentioned earlier, given grob's recent open letter to lampson in which he pointed out the benefit of taking one's time during the authentication process versus the pressures of engaging in the rush jobs lampson eluded to during the gavel chat interview, i wanted to see if i could track down some mears loa game-used helmets to see how they stacked up to lampson's work. however, the very first helmets i came across with mears loas, listed above, have serious problems in my opinion.

i contacted mastro by phone and asked them about these lids and the loas - the guy i spoke with, who seemed very well informed, told me that some helmets in the past had incorrectly been described as having mears's loas when in fact that they should have been described as having lampson loas. he went on to say that the item descriptions on these lots had been publicly modified and corrections made. as such, he felt that the helmets i was asking about were indeed authenticated by mears. he also added that i could confirm this information on mears's website for the cost of a membership fee. given that i didn't want to shell out for this info, i called troy kinunen to see if he might confirm the loas over the phone - i got his answering service and didn't leave a message.

needless to say i was more than a little surprised to find that the entire handful helmets i looked at with a mears loa (again, listed above) had serious issues - obviously this was a fluke and had i been able to spend more time looking for additional mears helmets i'm sure i would have come across some winners. also, these lots came from the same auction which makes me wonder if they were all from the same consignor - perhaps mears felt so strongly about the consignor that they didn't feel the need to take a closer look? who knows...

it would be interesting to know if these helmets were incorrectly attributed mears - perhaps a guu forum member with a mears membership account could confirm the loas? i would also be interested to know of any proof that would confirm that these helmets are in fact authentic and as described in the auction item descriptions, info that would confirm that i missed the boat on these lids because, honestly, i would sincerely like to believe that the buyers got what they paid for.


...

[yanks12025]

How did you go back into mastro's auction house archives.

[aeneas01]

troy kinunen of mears emailed me this encouraging note in response to my post. according to kinunen it appears that mastro may have indeed incorrectly attributed mears loas to these helmets despite what i was told by mastro. whatever the case it looks as if mears will try to get to the bottom of this and are prepared to make things right.

as i mentioned to kinunen, the reason for my post on these helmets was not to attack mears but to simply show that there are problems with any authentication process, that undeserving lots do get sold as authentic, game-used despite what appears to be the best intentions and effort.

for the record i really do respect the hard work the guys at mears put into their website and very much appreciate the information they make available to collectors and the highly informative articles they manage to get out with such regularity. i also feel it's unfortunate that their "bulletin board" attracts such little activity - especially given the number of very interesting topics open for discussion. frankly, i believe that this lack of active participation undermines their hard work and reflects poorly on their website - and i can't imagine it's much fun for the mears guys to spend so much time posting interesting topics to the board under these circumstances...


---------------------------------------



----- Original Message -----
From: Troy Kinunen
To: livie@horizoncable.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 08:16
Subject: MEARS/Mastro/Helmets


Dear Robert,

I was prompted to look at your recent post on the Game Used Universe Forum about a number of football helmets from an October 2005 Mastro Auction. I am sorry I missed your call and wished you had left a voice mail. I have checked our data base and do not see these items listed. I spoke with Dave Bushing and neither he or I recall doing evaluations on these helmets. That being said, I will have to admit there is possibility, however remote, that we could have looked at these items. If we did, then there would be a letter out there signed by Dave Bushing and myself.

In our earliest days moving from SCDA to MEARS, not all of the letters were captured for archiving. On very rare occasion, we have found some of the equipment LOO's did not transfer when we switched to MEARS. I have noted your observations and am going to go back to Mastro's and ask that they contact the winners of these lots and direct them to your informative post. If they still have the items and they did come with letters signed by Dave and I (which we would need to see), then we will gladly revaluate them at no cost, and if need be, buy these items back for the full price they paid to include any buyers premium and shipping and handling fees.

This would not be the first time an item or items was attributed to MEARS in an auction description that was not in fact the case. I am not trying to shift blame or responsibility. The simple facts of the matter are we have no record or recollection of evaluating these items, but since our name is associated with them, we feel compelled to help the collectors that bought them sort it out.

Once again, sorry I missed your call and please consider leaving me a voice mail. You can always contact me as well by my e-mail address provided above.

Respectfully Yours,

Troy R. Kinunen
MEARS



....

[mvandor]

They don't get any better than Mears. Very professional response that avoided the typical defensiveness. Interested to hear the end result.

[harpt]

They don't get any better than Mears. Very professional response that avoided the typical defensiveness. Interested to hear the end result.

I couldn't agree more. This response is outstanding.

[metsbats]

I'd like Mears to comment on a Rick Aguilera 1986 NLCS orange ring Rawlings Adirondack bat which they categorized as a 85-86 regular season bat. I recently picked this bat up in the last REA auction along with a 1988 Gary Carter game used NLCS bat. The 1988 NLCS bats are stamped as such on the barrel however the 1986 orange ring NLCS bats were not. The distinguishing marks on the 1986 NLCS bats were the absence of the lot and year (ex 123 6) on the knob which was replaced by the players initials. Also a distingishing trademark of the 1986 NLCS Rawlings adirondack bats are the orange rings which were also used for the 1986 WS and 1988 NLCS issued bats

My Mears Letter of Opinion states the Orange ring Rick Aguilera which is stamped with model number 113B and RA is from the 85-86 regular season and that the Model Number Location appears on the knob with the year Code though this bat clearly has no year code.

Attached are photos of Darrly Strawberry, Mookie Wilson, Gary Carter using orange ring bats during the 86 NLCS and World Series. Also included is a photo of the Rick Aguilera (auto by Gary Carter) bat authenticated by Mears along with another same exact NLCS orange ring Aguilera bat.

Also in the photo are orange ring Dykstra, Strawberry 1986 WS bats, an Ed Hearn 86 NLCS orange bat, and a 1988 Mazilli and Carter NLCS orange ring bats.

Thanks
David Louie
metsbats86@aol.com

[aeneas01]

They don't get any better than Mears. Very professional response that avoided the typical defensiveness. Interested to hear the end result.

I couldn't agree more. This (Kinunen's / MEARS) response is outstanding.

the guu forum is often criticized by many in the industry as a place where malcontents, buyer remorse sufferers and ax grinders gather to complain and take unfair shots at auction houses and authenticators - a place where those with nothing positive to say about the hobby lay in wait, "like spiders", for the next shaky lot to appear at auction in order to pounce on it, anonymously air it out in public, scream foul and embarrass those responsible.

if nothing else this thread proves that the aforementioned notion is patently absurd and that serious game-used sports memorabilia collectors, i.e. guu forum members, want nothing more than a fair shake from auction houses and those that evaluate game-used items - they want those in the industry to be accountable for their work and responsive to their concerns.

after 400+ views not one guu member has posted a negative remark to this thread criticizing mears for missing the boat on these helmets. why? if the authenticator being discussed in this thread was lampson instead of mears, if it were lampson that had missed the boat on these lids instead of mears, i can pretty much guarantee that this thread would have taken an entirely different direction. again, why? pretty simple imo. collectors respond positively to dialog. and they are willing to extend the benefit of the doubt when dialog and accessibility is tabled as demonstrated by the obvious respect collectors at guu have for mears and the forum response to kinunen's email.

a couple of other items....

in response to this post dave grob at mears took the opportunity to write an informative piece on the process of analyzing photos of football helmets with the help of a "helmet template" that he devised. it's a good read and a good start for those interested in football helmets imo. i would only add the following - before wasting time searching for photos i would contact the auction house and ask for the helmet's manufacturing date and any manufacturing codes as this would immediately tell you if the helmet could have possibly belonged to the player in question. if the date and codes match up the next thing i would do before digging through photos is take a long look at the helmet in order to determine the manufacturer and model; if photos of the interior are not pictured in the ad i would contact the seller and ask for them as they will help confirm the helmet model type. only after determining the date, codes, manufacturer and model of the helmet would i begin the process of looking through photos. why? because the above info could immediately rule out a helmet belonging to a given player and save you the time and energy you would have spent rifling through photos.

http://www.mearsonline.com/news/newsDetail.asp?id=474


also...

dave bushing posted his thoughts regarding these helmets at the mears bulletin board. in his post he explains the practice in which an auction house would supply the buyer with an loa that included the names of all of the authenticators the house employed for the auction regardless if the authenticators named had actually looked at the lot. he goes on to say that mears recognized the problem with this practice and corrected it.

the thing is, dave seems to offer this information as an explanation as to why the helmets i posted contained the mears name - which i don't get. other than the first helmet, the gonzalez helmet, every helmet mentions only one authenticator - mears. not a group of authenticators. the gonzalez helmet mentions mears, psa/dna and spence authentication which, given that psa/dna and spence are autograph authenticators, i assume means mears authenticated the equipment/helmet.

in short, mastro included only one equipment authennticator in the item description of each of these helmets and that authenticator was mears. consequently the buyer could not have been under the impression that any other authenticator other than mears was involved in the authenticating process of these helmet at the time of purchase.

http://www.network54.com/Forum/42624...816905/LOA%27s



...

[cjmedina1]

I'd like Mears to comment on a Rick Aguilera 1986 NLCS orange ring Rawlings Adirondack bat which they categorized as a 85-86 regular season bat. I recently picked this bat up in the last REA auction along with a 1988 Gary Carter game used NLCS bat. The 1988 NLCS bats are stamped as such on the barrel however the 1986 orange ring NLCS bats were not. The distinguishing marks on the 1986 NLCS bats were the absence of the lot and year (ex 123 6) on the knob which was replaced by the players initials. Also a distingishing trademark of the 1986 NLCS Rawlings adirondack bats are the orange rings which were also used for the 1986 WS and 1988 NLCS issued bats

My Mears Letter of Opinion states the Orange ring Rick Aguilera which is stamped with model number 113B and RA is from the 85-86 regular season and that the Model Number Location appears on the knob with the year Code though this bat clearly has no year code.

Attached are photos of Darrly Strawberry, Mookie Wilson, Gary Carter using orange ring bats during the 86 NLCS and World Series. Also included is a photo of the Rick Aguilera (auto by Gary Carter) bat authenticated by Mears along with another same exact NLCS orange ring Aguilera bat.

Also in the photo are orange ring Dykstra, Strawberry 1986 WS bats, an Ed Hearn 86 NLCS orange bat, and a 1988 Mazilli and Carter NLCS orange ring bats.

Thanks
David Louie
metsbats86@aol.com

David

Not sure if know but Mears has responded to your post?

Carlie Medina III
carliemedinaiii@sbcglobal.net

[metsbats]

David

Not sure if know but Mears has responded to your post?

Carlie Medina III
carliemedinaiii@sbcglobal.net

Carlie,

I emailed this thread to them via the MEARS contact feature on their website.

Waiting to hear from them.


David

[David]

One of the common ways to compare two authentication companies is to compare the percentage of mistakes verus the percentage of mistakes (comparing the degree of error is also often used). Say one company has made 1,000 errors and the other 50. If someone in the name of comparing the companies goes into the archives and picks out three errors from the one company and three errors from the other company to compare side by side, they can give the false impression that the two companies are as bad (or as good, depending how you look at it), when this clearly is not the case.

I'm sure both John Nash (famous Princeton applied math professor and Nobel Prize winner) and Zsa Zsa Gabor both made mistakes in high school math class. If I were to dig into the archives and post side by side three Nash high school math mistakes and three Gabor high school math mistakes, that wouldn't show they had equal mathematics aptitude.

I do think examining specific examples is important, but also think pulling out a few examples to prove an overall picture is, at the least, problematic.

My personal belief is that two important ways to examine the quality of an authentication company is the percentage of errors and magnatide of the errors. The later would in particular identify errors so large and basic it cast a shadow upon the authenticator's basic knowledge. If the only error in an LOA is it says 1986 instead of 1987, that would be cataloged as a minor error and might have been a typo. If the 'authenticator' didn't know the Green Bay Packers wear Green and Gold, obviously he shouldn't be authenticating NFL jerseys.