Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

[suave1477]

Eric for Jorge Posada i consider the picture you posted clean, his helmets normally are ten times worse. but you can definitely see on that pic the pine tar on it. As far as CollectGU you said you got this from a Grey Flannel auction who did the auction directly with Steiner then why does it have an Outdated LOA with it?

[CollectGU]

Ok, here we go:

1. The helmet was bought out of Grey Flannel's December Yankee/Steiner auction. Feel free to confirm that with Grey Flannel
2. The wheel inside the helmet points to a manufacturing date of December 1995.
3. The LOA that Steiner produced says 2002. I alerted Shaun Mahoney of this at Steiner and he promised to look into why this is, but confirmed that it was used definitelylogged in by the Yankees as used by Posada. I personally now believe that the helmet was manufactured in 1995 and used in 1997 by Posada, I will know more when I hear back from Shaun.
4. The Yankees told Steiner it was used by Posada in 2002 and that it why they issued the paperwok that way, but I on't believe that the Yankees would use helmets 7 years after it was mnufactured..
5. I have the new LOA with the hologram , but received it after the catalogue was set for print.
6. The whole pine tar thing is silly. 1.Shaun told me that the Yankees clean the helmets 2. Go back to 95,96,97 pictures of Posada and you will see that he didn't have all that pine ar on his helmets like he does now....

[suave1477]

First of all CollectGU the whole pine tar thing is not silly bcuz it is a huge characteristic of posada, if players characteristics are silly then half the member should sell off all there collections bcuz that is a good way to judge if the player used that item. As far as the Yankees cleaning them when did they start this? I am at Steiner sports every week in the cage and I see the batting helmets laying there every week and all of posadas helmets have heavy pine tar on them. I don't need to call some guy named shaun cuz i am there and see them for myself.

[Nathan]

Just to play DA (and not district attorney either)....

A few of the higher-profile teams across sports have gone to more extensive cleaning of visible equipment. A case in point is the Los Angeles Kings, who have their jerseys dry cleaned after every game; the repairs and fabric tears stay, but all stick and puck marks, bloodstains, and other general wear comes out. There's also more NFL and college teams that go through and redo helmets as often as possible; I believe LSU applies a completely new set of decals every single week, while others like Tennessee and Alabama simply patch and repaint affected areas.

It's entirely possible for the Yankees to, before marketing game-used gear out into the hobby, to do an extensive cleaning to remove general filth and pine tar. The Kings' practice of dry cleaning has aggravated their collectors since it makes photomatching next to impossible, while helmet collectors looking to photomatch have also had their quest similiarily made difficult.

CollectGU, the date that helmets are manufactured doesn't necessarily have a great amount of bearing as to when it was actually used. Using that idea, a Mike Singletary Kelly helmet from Baylor could never actually exist, since the company stopped manufacturing helmets sometime in the mid-1970s and Singletary played from 1978-81. Hard to believe, but Baylor had enough sitting around that Singletary and a majority of the team were outfitted using helmets that were notorious for cracking and breaking. Teams have done strange things when it comes to equipment, and in a sport like baseball, where the condition of the helmet shell doesn't matter as much as the padding inside, anything is possible.

[Eric]

Ok, here we go:


2. The wheel inside the helmet points to a manufacturing date of December 1995.

Can you explain to me specifically what it means. Say I had an ABC helmet where the arrow pointed to an 8 and there was a 6 in the center of the circle- what would that mean?

Also how can you tell which way you're supposed to read it- meaning how would you know the number in the center is a 6 and not a 9?

[suave1477]

nathan i guess you missed my post regarding im at the Steiner cage every week i know what all there equipment looks like and believe me they dont clean a thing

[GameBats]

Based on the thread, It appears to be a HUGE leap of faith mixed with some fantasy to allow this helmet to be listed as the earliest known game worn Posada helmet.

John

[BULBUS]

exactly john! i think my biggest concern besides the lack of pine tar is the font of the 20 on back and the lack of the number on the brim. can anyone find a picture of a yankees player wearing a helmet wihout the number on the brim? the font of the 20 is too thick. maybe this was a batting practice helmet?

fyi: mike stanley wore #20 in 1995 and robert eenhorn and mike aldrete wore it in 1996. could it be one of their helmets?

[Eric]

A reminder-
Just because the helmet said it was manufactured at a certain time doesn't mean it was used then. Here's a post from the old gameusedforum.com site.

reading the dial

April 18 2005 at 6:37 PMJason (Login skipcareyisfat)

Response to ABC Batting HelmetsPhil brings up a good point regarding helmets that are issued years after they were made. I have Jason Larue's rookie helmet and it was made 8 years before he finally wore it. Last year I had a chance to look at a ton of gamers the Braves were selling and some of them were actually made in the 1980s. Unfortunately, ABC clocks in 1980s gamers are, as far as I'm concerned, impossible to read. If anyone knows how to do it please let us know.

[BULBUS]

eric, i understand that, but lets say jorge used the helmet in 1997. look at this picture from 97:


jorge likes his pinetar. although this helmet isnt covered in pinetar like some of his helmets, there is definitely a good amount on his bat and his helmet. and you cant clean that crap off a helmet either. also, see the 20 on the brim, it is not present in the AM helmet.

sorry i cant answer your clock question. i guess no one can read those things