Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

[BULBUS]

Check out this helmet:

http://www.americanmemorabilia.com/Auction_Item.asp?Auction_ID=26454

Earliest known???????? First of all, the Steiner letter states that it is a 2002 game used helmet. I know Steiner makes mistakes on the years, but Jorge did NOT wear number 20 in 1995 or 1996. He wore 41 then 55. Started using 20 in 1997. The font of the number doesnt look right either, but maybe they used different fonts sometimes? I hate to start another thread ripping AM, but they need to get their act together!

[Eric]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

While we're on the topic, can someone please post again the proper way to tell the date on an ABC batting helmet?

It was discussed on the old site, but can we re-approach it here?
Thanks
Eric

[BULBUS]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

That is a good question Eric. I always thought the year was in the center and the arrow points to the month.

[suave1477]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

I WANT TO SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THIS HELMET AND WHY AM I NOT SURPRISED AMERICAN MEMOROBILIA?

First of all i would like to say I extremely highly doubt this is a jorge posada game used helmet.

I will tell you why:
I happend to be a big fan of Jorge Posada and happen to know a bit his consistany in wearing his helmets bcuz I find it to be one of the unique things about Posada.

I have seen plenty of his helmets in person from Steiner and other sources, and his huge and main characteristic of his use is tons and i do mean tons of pine tar he puts on his helmet to the point where i think the just ship him pine tar just to smudge on his helmet. I have never seen a game used helmet of his with out aq TON ( i do mean a ton, it gets to the point where his helmet looks nasty ). He puts tons of pine tar on his bat and constantly duriong the game touches his helmet if you watch a Yankee game you will see him touch his helmet a thousand times its just a quirk of Posadas to touch, fix, push up his helmet so you see tons of pine tar on it that come from his hands.

This helmet not only does not show one drop of pine tar its actually shing in as if it was new.

Which leads me to beleive it maybe Game isseud not used. Now the letter I find a bit interesting also its (NOT AN LOA) its a letter of opinion i never heard of Steiner issuing an opinion letter, AND the letter does not have a hologram Steiner letters always have a hologram.

Something is fishy here!!!!!

[BULBUS]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

Suave, that is the "temporary" letter that Steiner was issuing for a while (without the hologram). If you return that letter to them now, they will issue a new letter with the hologram. About a month ago, I sent in 4 of those temporary LOA's for the pemanent letters. I have no idea why they did this. I asked them, they said they were working with the Yankees on a nice permanent letter. Well, the permanent LOA isnt much different??

Something is fishy here. I dont think that letter goes with that helmet. I think that Steiner knows how to read the date inside the helmet and they did not make a mistake.

[Eric]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

If I am not mistaken, those were the Steiner letters that were sent out when they first started selling items. Since last December, they have asked people to turn in these old letters for new ones which have the hologram.

The letter mentioned in the AMI listing says "The letter is internded to serve as a temporary article of authentication for the memorabilia listed below."

I had letters like this that I exchanged for the proper ones.

Here is a pic of a different Posada that Steiner was selling

Eric

[suave1477]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

Eric well that was only one of my concerns, which makes you wonder why hasn't this letter been turned in. Plus it doesn't show any game use at all it actually shines like its brand new. Lets just say hypethically Posada didnt use Pine tar, just from every day use of wear and putting it down throwing it into the cubby between innings would dull it and scuff it.

Here is something else I remembered, I dont remember the promoting company but, there was a big autogragh signing years ago in the mid 90's where the promoter actually ordered the actual game issued yankees helmets to be autographed for the show. I know he had an order for Jeter and for Posada and I believe a few others. This might have been one of those that did not get signed that surfaced.

The seller actually listed his left overs of Jeter a few months ago on ebay. These helmets are exactly like the real ones but were intended only for autographs not actual game use.

[BULBUS]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

another concern with this helmet is the fact that there is no number on the brim. has anyone ever seen a yankees game used batting helmet without a number on the brim?

[CollectGU]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

Let me put an end to all these "magic Bullet theories". I consigned the helmet and bought it at Grey Flannel's December auction, and it is as good as gold. Call Shaun Mahoney at Steiner and ask him... I am at work now and don't have time to explain but will post additional info later

[BULBUS]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

magic bullet theories?????

here are the facts:

the loa states that it is a 2002 helmet.
the auction states that it is a 1995/1996 helmet.
jorge did not wear number 20 in 1995/1996.
the helmet does not show any of jorges use characeristics.
the 20 on the back is the wrong font.
there is no 20 on the brim.

sure, the helmet came from the yankees clubhouse, but was it used by posada?

[suave1477]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

Eric for Jorge Posada i consider the picture you posted clean, his helmets normally are ten times worse. but you can definitely see on that pic the pine tar on it. As far as CollectGU you said you got this from a Grey Flannel auction who did the auction directly with Steiner then why does it have an Outdated LOA with it?

[CollectGU]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

Ok, here we go:

1. The helmet was bought out of Grey Flannel's December Yankee/Steiner auction. Feel free to confirm that with Grey Flannel
2. The wheel inside the helmet points to a manufacturing date of December 1995.
3. The LOA that Steiner produced says 2002. I alerted Shaun Mahoney of this at Steiner and he promised to look into why this is, but confirmed that it was used definitelylogged in by the Yankees as used by Posada. I personally now believe that the helmet was manufactured in 1995 and used in 1997 by Posada, I will know more when I hear back from Shaun.
4. The Yankees told Steiner it was used by Posada in 2002 and that it why they issued the paperwok that way, but I on't believe that the Yankees would use helmets 7 years after it was mnufactured..
5. I have the new LOA with the hologram , but received it after the catalogue was set for print.
6. The whole pine tar thing is silly. 1.Shaun told me that the Yankees clean the helmets 2. Go back to 95,96,97 pictures of Posada and you will see that he didn't have all that pine ar on his helmets like he does now....

[suave1477]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

First of all CollectGU the whole pine tar thing is not silly bcuz it is a huge characteristic of posada, if players characteristics are silly then half the member should sell off all there collections bcuz that is a good way to judge if the player used that item. As far as the Yankees cleaning them when did they start this? I am at Steiner sports every week in the cage and I see the batting helmets laying there every week and all of posadas helmets have heavy pine tar on them. I don't need to call some guy named shaun cuz i am there and see them for myself.

[Nathan]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

Just to play DA (and not district attorney either)....

A few of the higher-profile teams across sports have gone to more extensive cleaning of visible equipment. A case in point is the Los Angeles Kings, who have their jerseys dry cleaned after every game; the repairs and fabric tears stay, but all stick and puck marks, bloodstains, and other general wear comes out. There's also more NFL and college teams that go through and redo helmets as often as possible; I believe LSU applies a completely new set of decals every single week, while others like Tennessee and Alabama simply patch and repaint affected areas.

It's entirely possible for the Yankees to, before marketing game-used gear out into the hobby, to do an extensive cleaning to remove general filth and pine tar. The Kings' practice of dry cleaning has aggravated their collectors since it makes photomatching next to impossible, while helmet collectors looking to photomatch have also had their quest similiarily made difficult.

CollectGU, the date that helmets are manufactured doesn't necessarily have a great amount of bearing as to when it was actually used. Using that idea, a Mike Singletary Kelly helmet from Baylor could never actually exist, since the company stopped manufacturing helmets sometime in the mid-1970s and Singletary played from 1978-81. Hard to believe, but Baylor had enough sitting around that Singletary and a majority of the team were outfitted using helmets that were notorious for cracking and breaking. Teams have done strange things when it comes to equipment, and in a sport like baseball, where the condition of the helmet shell doesn't matter as much as the padding inside, anything is possible.

[Eric]

Re: Jorge Posada Helmet on AM

Ok, here we go:


2. The wheel inside the helmet points to a manufacturing date of December 1995.

Can you explain to me specifically what it means. Say I had an ABC helmet where the arrow pointed to an 8 and there was a 6 in the center of the circle- what would that mean?

Also how can you tell which way you're supposed to read it- meaning how would you know the number in the center is a 6 and not a 9?