Barry Bonds Issues

**Yankwood** · 03-21-2006, 07:10 PM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

If Barry Bonds wasn't breaking a baseball rule, does this free him from wrong? I mean, wasn't he breaking a law? Isn't taking steroids not prescribed by a doctor against the law? Maybe I misunderstand.

**33bird** · 03-21-2006, 07:15 PM

Re: cool...

Cool. No problem there then. Who cares about it being illegal in baseball-It's been ILLEGAL IN THE US since 1991. He's a cheater and liar. Just look at his numbers pre and post steroid use and there is no question that they enhanced his game immensely. It would taint the HOF if they put him in-just as if they put in Pete Rose. But gambling didn't make Rose a better player than everybody else around him, so I'll give the nod to Rose before Bonds. It's not fair to those who didn't cheat and have records. It's not fair to Aaron and Ruth and Maris, etc. Those guys didn't get better when they turned 35 years old-they got steadily worse. Put on em' steroids at age 35 and they would've have kicked ass like Bonds for another 5+years. If it wasn't illegal in baseball (which is wasn't) then why hide it and lie about it? Why not just say I'm using Roids and too bad for you? Because just as in the olympics and football and other sports where it was illegal-if everybody knew you were using you'd would be called a fraud and a cheat and a loser.The only reason it wasn't illegal in baseball is that they didn't think it would ever be a problem in their sport-and really wasn't until the mid to late 80s when Mr. Jose Canseco showed up. Bonds is a cheater and jerk in most everybody's opinion and though a great player and hof thru 1998-he ruined that by juicing from 1999 on. See ya.
G

**33bird** · 03-21-2006, 07:18 PM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

Well, in Trsent's opinion the laws of baseball supersede the laws of our own land. Whatever--I'm not trying to be rude, but I just can't fathom your reasoning at all on many of your posts.
G

**sfgiants452** · 03-21-2006, 08:30 PM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

Hi,

I am a huge Bonds fan and I have been so since I was 8. So I have to agree with trsent. Yes he did break the rules (If he did do it!!!) of the land, so punish him for that. Not in the game of baseball. They weren't illegal in the game during that time. Finally, the only way I will believe he took them is if he fails a grug test. Go Barry and go Giants!!!!

**Yankwood** · 03-21-2006, 08:38 PM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

I'm sure there's nothing in the rules about murder either so is that alright too?

**33bird** · 03-21-2006, 08:49 PM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

The only people (and they are getting fewer all the time) that defend Bonds are the Die-Hard Bond's fans that are still around. The thing is, he probably could commit murder or rape someone, and guess what? Nothing against it in the rules of baseball land, so he's still a HOF, but go ahead and put him in jail. Geez people.
G

**sfgiants452** · 03-21-2006, 09:03 PM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

You can't compare murder to steriods.

**allstarsplus** · 03-21-2006, 09:12 PM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

In the 1930's, anabolic steroids were found to increase muscle mass so these drugs didn't just appear on the scene in the past 10 to 15 years.

In 1956, Dianabol (Methandrostenolone) was first marketed in the
United States legally, clearing the way for the use of anabolics by U. S.
athletes. Steroids were the rage in the 70's amongst bodybuilders and powerlifters and were used by many football players.

We can probably say with 100% certainty that Babe Ruth wasn't on steroids.

I don't think we can say that with certainty about any other HR hitter since 1956. So for everyone that wants to point fingers, I for one never would have suspected Palmeiro given his body shape.

So lets remember innocent until proven guilty and anything else is pure speculation.

Mark McGwire hit 49 HRs as a skinny rookie. Even Canseco said he was not doing 'roids back then.

Out of all the 500 HR club, only Palmeiro ever tested Positive.

**33bird** · 03-21-2006, 09:21 PM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

That's bunk and you know it. I guess OJ was innocent? Just because they were hardly ever tested or had the know how to hide (which bonds did) the steroids from showing up in tests, doesn't mean they were innocent. I don't have a problem with Big Mac hitting 49 roid free. I do have a problem with him hitting 21 more than that on the juice. His nonconfession did him in. Sosa forgot how to speak English. Palmerio lied his A-- off. Bonds is no different. FBI documents, voice recorded tapes, friends, nonfriends, girlfriends, exteammates, 15 pounds of muscle in one summer, blah, blah, blah, blah-I could go on forever. Get your head out of the sand son. A rose is a rose is a rose. See ya.
Birdie

**trsent** · 03-22-2006, 01:45 AM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

Originally posted by Yankwood

I'm sure there's nothing in the rules about murder either so is that alright too?

How come someone always compares murder to taking steroids?

Tell me about apples and mangoes some other day, but don't make an comment stating that you want to compare drug use to taking another human life.

It's not even debatable, so stop the associations.

**trsent** · 03-22-2006, 01:47 AM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

Originally posted by 33bird

The only people (and they are getting fewer all the time) that defend Bonds are the Die-Hard Bond's fans that are still around. The thing is, he probably could commit murder or rape someone, and guess what? Nothing against it in the rules of baseball land, so he's still a HOF, but go ahead and put him in jail. Geez people.
G

Again, an absolutely idiotic comments.

YOU WANT TO COMPARE MURDER AND RAPE TO STEROIDS? GET OFF MY BACK BECAUSE YOU ARE OUT OF LINE COMPARING THEM AND MAKING IT MEAN THAT IF WE DEFEND STEROID USE WE ARE DEFENDING RAPE AND MURDER?

I can tell you, your comparisons are out of line and shut your fingers about the comparisons - That is BS and you should be ashamed at yourself you making such a stupid comment.

**trsent** · 03-22-2006, 01:58 AM

Re: cool...

Originally posted by 33bird

It's not fair to those who didn't cheat and have records. It's not fair to Aaron and Ruth and Maris, etc. Those guys didn't get better when they turned 35 years old-they got steadily worse. Put on em' steroids at age 35 and they would've have kicked ass like Bonds for another 5+years.

Aaron had his best Home Run season in 1971...at the age of 37. "Steadily worse"?

Ruth averaged 32 HRs a seasons over his career. From age 35 to when he ended he averaged 33 HRs (sort of false stat as his first 4 seasons where largely as a pitcher but I need anything to show people talk without doing homework here)

Maris hit 61 in 1961. His next best years were 39 in 1960 and 33 in 1962. In his other 10 seasons he never hit more than 28 in any year. Roger Maris was not a steady superstar such as Babe Ruth, Henry Aaron, Mickey Mantle, Joe DiMaggio and Willie Mays. He had a big year.

------------------------------------------------------

What you miss by throwing this whole debate in my face because you didn't like my comments on another topic is that i value your opinions and you should value mine. You don't have to agree, but if we didn't have debate and two political parties (that count) in this country what would be have?

I know, communism. Maybe you like that style because every comment you do not appreciate you think we should be compared to approving murder and rape.

Once again, I withdraw myself from this thread. No need to continue this conversation. If Barry Bonds did anything wrong, I hope his attorney is ready because we do have a legal system that is fair - Just ask OJ.

(No I didn't just do that, hehe)

**allstarsplus** · 03-22-2006, 08:06 AM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

This is clearly the mostly hotly debated subject in baseball today. In my Post last night, I stated the facts of how long anabolic steroids have been around. Joel Alpert gave some great facts. These players HR stats and their ages are fact. As far as I am concerned, Pandora's box is now open and I am suspicious about any post-1956 athlete.

Do I have my own opinions about Barry? Sure I do. I have met him socially many times over the years and saw his transformation. Am I suspicious? Sure. Am I 100% sure----no.

Anyone that enhances using anabolic steroids is a cheater and a liar. I would throw blood dopers into the same category.

I was cheated myself as an athlete because I know I competed against steroid freaks. It pissed me off because these guys were real cocky about it when the subject came up. This was in the 70's and Dianabol was readily available at most gyms. Arnold Schwarzenegger and Franco Columbo posters hung on the walls of gyms which replaced the old Charles Atlas posters. When 33Bird states

Originally posted by 33bird

15 pounds of muscle in one summer, blah, blah, blah, blah-I could go on forever. Get your head out of the sand son. A rose is a rose is a rose. See ya.
Birdie

with the average person you are right but you take some genetically gifted athletes that change their diets and strength train and it can be done. It's called hard work and dedication. College Seniors playing the line or linebacker do it all the time when getting ready for the NFL.

Don't take this as I am defending Barry. I am not. He can defend himself. McGwire did himself no help in front of Congress, but I will say his 49 HR Rookie Record in 1987 was amazing. These records will always seem tainted now.

**Yankwood** · 03-22-2006, 08:31 AM

Re: Barry Bonds Issues

The point is not that murder=steroids, the point is that MLB cannot make a list of everything in the world that it is against and you should be smart enough to realize it. It's just that when people defend Barry Bonds they point out that it was not against the rules in baseball. It doesn't have to be pointed out by baseball. Baseball doesn't tell me everything I can and can't do, or should and shouldn't do. Laws and common sense do and people who are making excuses for a terrible human being are not paying attention to either. They're just sucking the rear end of someoe that they root for or idolize. Face the facts, which are, he had the numbers to get to the hall but decided to cheat (he knew he was and so do you) and now his numbers are a joke and MLB probably wishes he would just go away because he's become an embarrASSment to the game. The numbers are a joke. The analogy about murder and steroids is not to say they are equal but I'll bet there is nothing in the rulebooks about adultry either. Now defend that.

Barry Bonds Issues

Barry Bonds Issues

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