Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

[wjonesIII]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

Mr. Jones, you have a million excuses for your items and a lot of stories that change every day.

So, now the players didn't all practice at the same time with Dwayne Wade, but they wore jerseys with their numbers on it when they did? Wow - I could have sworn you told us the jerseys were worn at private practices attended by the USA Team members. They came in small groups now?

The original auction description is clearly an error - Where did that error come from? Don't answer - Let Heritage Auctions answer because as Chris Ivy stated - You do not work for Heritage Auction or answer on their behalf.

Next time a questionable item you have is consigned to an auction house I would recommend letting the auction house answering the questions because your answers have led the public to understand that these jerseys are suspect.

I do not have examples of jerseys of NBA players to show you - I just can tell you have I been at autograph sessions and seen players autograph items as "Game Used" or other similar inscriptions that either were not game used or were not even game jerseys. Many players are numb to inscriptions - They sign whatever and don't ask questions because they don't care.

I know you have contact with Dwayne Wade and Derrick Rose, good for you. In the meantime, more evidence points to these USA jerseys not being what they were advertised. Time and time again, your story changes, Heritage Auctions had an error listing the item from a Las Vegas trainer - Oh they just made that up incorrectly and then the story changed when no photos matched that practice? Now Tim Glover emailed me that the whole team didn't practice there at one time so you have a new story that they came in shifts?

I asked if they were there from 2007-2008 - I gave plenty of time. The first email I only mentioned 2007, the second I asked form 2007-2008. What is the issue? We both know what the issue is - Please let Heritage Auctions handle the issue already as they appear not to be concerned with genuine concerns. Go back and read page one of this thread. Look at your posts then and look at them now - You are a great player of games, sir.

Also, attacking me about the Las Vegas trainer is a joke. I don't care if you said such in your posts here or your emails with David Archibald - The fact is clear - It still states such on the Heritage Auctions web site - "A trainer at the Las Vegas practice facilities for the US Olympic basketball team is the source for this incredible collection of worn and autographed shirts from the Team Redeem, which properly reclaimed the Gold Medal for the Americans in Beijing". It is silly that you accuse me of anything here - Your usual method of debate is to attack me over my comments.

If I were you I would stop while you have a chance and let the auction house handle the concerns like you should have from the start. Attacking the questioner - As always - A strong sign of weakness.

Joel,

I have several responses for this.

The most important thing is that you keep saying I am changing my story. That's not what is happening. I am simply passing along the info I get from the trainer, so quit blaming me. Blame the trainer. If these jerseys are ever proven to not be what I said they are, it would be because the trainer passing along the incorrect information, not me.

As far as this comment goes: "Next time a questionable item you have is consigned to an auction house I would recommend letting the auction house answering the questions because your answers have led the public to understand that these jerseys are suspect." I am not trying to hide anything, so whatever information is found out is good for us all.

"A trainer at the Las Vegas practice facilities for the US Olympic basketball team" This doesn't say the trainer works at Vegas. It was just not clearly written. The trainer was at the Las Vegas practice facilities for the US Olympic basketball players (certain ones) so it's not far off.

Below is a portion of an article online which proves Wade was enlisting help. As to why the players are said to have all came, my guess is that one of these guys helped convince the rest to come, but I wasn't there so I have to rely on the word of the trainer, and D-Wade:

Wade readying for Beijing Olympics, says rehab has 'no problems' so far

Associated Press
Updated: June 8, 2008, 3:45 PM ET

"Wade is spending much of his offseason rehabilitating in Chicago, with eyes on both getting a spot on the Beijing-bound team -- USA Basketball will finalize its Olympic roster later this month -- and ensuring that he's fully healthy when the Heat open training camp in late September.

"Just trying to get my timing back because I haven't played since March," Wade said at a promotion for the annual Zo's Summer Groove, a charity event in South Florida that Heat teammate Alonzo Mourning has asked Wade to help headline this July. "But 5-on-5 went well and I'm looking forward to next week, going back to my second week of 5-on-5 and the competition picking up more. I'm doing my job of trying to bring more competition down to Chicago."

Indeed, he's enlisted some All-Star help.

New Orleans guard Chris Paul will be in Chicago this week for the scrimmages, Wade said, and he's asked another good friend, Carmelo Anthony of the Denver Nuggets, if he's willing to come play later this month. Like Wade, both Paul and Anthony are expected to be at USA Basketball's selection minicamp in Las Vegas during the last week of June."

[jppopma]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

Wow! This is tough to follow. So what I am getting is, Dwayne Wade did some rehabilitation work at Mr. Grover's facility. While in rehab, he wanted to do some practice with other USA Olymic members. So....he went and had custom made USA basketball jerseys made for him and the other players he was practicing with so he would have the feel of a real practice. Sounds pretty simple. If that's what gets you through rehab, more power to ya.

If this is true, I guess any player can make up jerseys to wear to practice at home, back yard, gym, etc.....and then later sell them off as being practice worn. Right??????

[trsent]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

Just an update. Chris Ivy did email me telling me that Tim Glover's email didn't say that the USA Basketball Team didn't practice, just that the whole team didn't practice at once.

I find Chris Ivy to have a problem as he lives with blinders on. He responds to Tim Glover's reply that the entire team of 12 players never practiced at once at this gym, but he ignores my question that I have asked over and over again. Does Chris Ivy have a problem disclosing if a 3rd party authenticator, who authenticated other lots in his auction, looked at this lot as it was originally advertised as being authenticated by PSA/DNA?

I have since emailed him 3-4 times asking my original question which he has ignored time and time again. The question? Did PSA/DNA inspect the jerseys as originally advertised then removed from the description and if they did, did they deem the autographs unable to authenticate?

I know, many people feel PSA/DNA's opinion doesn't matter, but why if asked about it before the auction ended would you ignore a genuine concern of someone who uses and trusts PSA/DNA's opinion?

Chris Ivy can ignore the fact that all twelve players never practiced at the gym at once per the gym's owner's comments and he can believe that these jerseys, which originally were advertised as coming from a Las Vegas trainer, but then that description was changed due to an odd error, were given to guys to wear when helping Dwayne Wade practice at the gym as they made custom made Team USA jerseys for these small, secret, private practices.

Geez, Dwayne Wade even has alleged autographed a LOA for these jerseys. I guess Dwayne Wade remembers that him and the other eleven players on the Team USA Basketball team came to Tim Glover's gym and wore these jerseys for secret, private, small groups only workouts.

I have no doubt that William Jones III is friendly with Derrek Rose. He may even know Dwayne Wade. I will stand behind my comments and findings and Chris Ivy can be happy that he has potentially defrauded an honest bidder to his auction house because he thinks a LOA from Dwayne Wade means these suspect jerseys for wear and autographs means Tim Glover's stating that the whole team never practiced at his gym at the same time doesn't mean that the jerseys are not genuine, private, secret practice used with suspect autographs (as similar shoes have from the same source).

Keep dreaming, Mr. Ivy. Oh, and maybe you should answer questions that have been asked over and over again about PSA/DNA's inspection or lack of for this lot. Or will the truth hurt to admit?

[wjonesIII]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

[wjonesIII]

Joel's referenced (unable to authenticate) pair #1

[wjonesIII]

Joel's referenced (unable to authenticate) pair #2

[wjonesIII]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

[wjonesIII]

Wade Signature style #1

[trsent]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

So, your friend Dwayne Wade signed a letter for you?

When were the jerseys worn and autographed by all 12 players? Please elaborate as Tim Glover states the whole team didn't practice at the gym together.

They wore custom made jerseys at small, private practices, all twelve players? Please, please, please elaborate for us all on details. Maybe also include the ordering record for these custom made jerseys to show they were ordered prior to the Las Vegas practices.

Please, please, please keep making up stories and while you are at it, please explain how Heritage Auctions will not answer if PSA/DNA inspected the jerseys and then explain where Heritage Auctions came up with the story, in error, about how the jerseys originated from a Las Vegas trainer, but that story was changed once I started to question the jerseys.

Your new letters are worthless without the above questions being answered. I understand, Mr. Jones, you are friendly with Dwayne Wade and also Derrek Rose. That doesn't prove these jerseys were worn by all twelve members of the Team USA Basketball at Tim Glover's gym at secret, private practices and it doesn't prove all twelve autographs are genuine.

[wjonesIII]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

[wjonesIII]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

Joel,

I do not know the answer to your questions. I do know the consignor emailed Heritage and said that if PSA/DNA failed the autographs, and they did not admit that, then they should void the sale and do more research. Therefore, if they can prove the jerseys are real, the jerseys can be re-auctioned with an accurate description and all relevant information. I am not okay with the jerseys being sold with all this controversy. The consignor and I agree that if they are fake, they should not be sold. But if they are real, and it can be proven with more research, then they can be better marketed. Heritage should have replied to the PSA/DNA question, and written a better description. Until these facts are known, and bidders know beforehand if the jerseys passed PSA/DNA and/or JSA, then the auction was unfair to all parties. At the same time, the consignor is willing to let Heritage do more research on the jerseys and be up front about the PSA/DNA question.

Every auction house will have issues sometimes. Look at all the items that got berated in the auction run by this forum?

We were told that Kobe's boy "Rev" ordered the jerseys from Nike, but never asked for when, or the order number. I cannot add anymore. Heritage needs to make the decision as to what they will do.

[wjonesIII]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

So, your friend Dwayne Wade signed a letter for you?

When were the jerseys worn and autographed by all 12 players? Please elaborate as Tim Glover states the whole team didn't practice at the gym together.

They wore custom made jerseys at small, private practices, all twelve players? Please, please, please elaborate for us all on details. Maybe also include the ordering record for these custom made jerseys to show they were ordered prior to the Las Vegas practices.

Please, please, please keep making up stories and while you are at it, please explain how Heritage Auctions will not answer if PSA/DNA inspected the jerseys and then explain where Heritage Auctions came up with the story, in error, about how the jerseys originated from a Las Vegas trainer, but that story was changed once I started to question the jerseys.

Your new letters are worthless without the above questions being answered. I understand, Mr. Jones, you are friendly with Dwayne Wade and also Derrek Rose. That doesn't prove these jerseys were worn by all twelve members of the Team USA Basketball at Tim Glover's gym at secret, private practices and it doesn't prove all twelve autographs are genuine.

What will prove the autographs are genuine? What authentication must they pass for you to believe the signatures are real? Or can you not be convinced?

[wjonesIII]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

I want to know what exactly you want done, after Heritage answers your question about PSA/DNA? What is out job at this point? What information needs to be obtained in order to "prove" these are real?

What information will prove that without a doubt they are fake?

Answer those two questions.

[wjonesIII]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

I was told the winning bidder will be allowed to make the final determination as to if he or she wants the lot. What this comes down to is that when JSA authenticated the autographs, that made us and Heritage believe the jerseys were as advertised from the trainer. The autographs are what JSA has determined to be genuine, and that made us believe in the lot enough to offer it for sale. The winning bidder is aware that he or she can decide if they want the lot. If not, Heritage will mail the lot back. I was just told that Heritage will not respond to Joel at this point, as every lot comes with PSA/DNA, JSA, or both. The winning bidder was aware that James Spence Authentication was the only authenticator, so disregard my previous posts. I am sorry that I was not able to prove these jerseys are real with pictures, and am only able to rely on the word of two people who would have been at there. Chris Ivy responded to Joel's emails during the auction, but Joel did not post them. If the winning bidder is satisfied with the items, they have a legal right to own them.

[trsent]

Re: Heritage Lot 710 - 2008 USA Olympic Basketball Team Practice Worn Jerseys Lot of 12, Signed

I was told the winning bidder will be allowed to make the final determination as to if he or she wants the lot. What this comes down to is that when JSA authenticated the autographs, that made us and Heritage believe the jerseys were as advertised from the trainer. The autographs are what JSA has determined to be genuine, and that made us believe in the lot enough to offer it for sale. The winning bidder is aware that he or she can decide if they want the lot. If not, Heritage will mail the lot back. I was just told that Heritage will not respond to Joel at this point, as every lot comes with PSA/DNA, JSA, or both. The winning bidder was aware that James Spence Authentication was the only authenticator, so disregard my previous posts. I am sorry that I was not able to prove these jerseys are real with pictures, and am only able to rely on the word of two people who would have been at there. Chris Ivy responded to Joel's emails during the auction, but Joel did not post them. If the winning bidder is satisfied with the items, they have a legal right to own them.

David Archibald, why do you keep posting as William Jones III?