Game Used Favre Story in SCD

[harpt]

I know there are some here who don't like SCD, but I definately find this story by Chris is interesting.

http://www.sportscollectorsdigest.com/upload/images/PDF/favre.pdf

[indyred]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

Very interesting read. Would like to hear Favre take on this. Have any of his Jets game used jerseys hit the market yet?

[allstarsplus]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

Great story by Chris Nerat and I will re-read it as I can't believe some of the assertions in there. Some of those Rick Radtke jerseys have me scratching my head as Rick has Posted on here before.

Does Favre wear more than 1 jersey for the 1st and half and another for the 2nd half?

[harpt]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

Does Favre wear more than 1 jersey for the 1st and half and another for the 2nd half?

I am not an expert in this area, but I think convention tells us that he changed out at halftime. He could certainly have games where he wore several though...who knows?

That's the great thing about Hankel's examination. He understands all of the possibilities (jersey changes, mislabeled getty images, etc), and does not rely on superficial "evidence." Instead he watches video...the whole video...and examines from all angles, etc.

[allstarsplus]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

I am not an expert in this area, but I think convention tells us that he changed out at halftime. He could certainly have games where he wore several though...who knows?

That's the great thing about Hankel's examination. He understands all of the possibilities (jersey changes, mislabeled getty images, etc), and does not rely on superficial "evidence." Instead he watches video...the whole video...and examines from all angles, etc.

Since football players generally only go in the Locker Room at halftime barring an injury, I would think 2 would be the max amount of jerseys these guys would wear in a game.

The fact that they measured out to a 54 or 56 instead of the tagged 52 is downright scary.

I went through archives of Rick Radtke posts:

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/search.php?searchid=267887&pp=25

Simply amazing!!!!

[allstarsplus]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

After reading the story again, there is no conclusion on where the fakes originated from.

It seems Rick Radtke did the right thing and refunded the money.

My own history with Rick is all positive. He helped me in a Brett Favre art project and Rick and Brett were both very professional.

I wish Rick the best and hope this investigation is fair and impartial and gets to the bottom of this problem.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

look you guys, radtke received these jerseys with photos of favre holding them. it's like he said; what else was there to do? check out game photos? actually measure the jerseys? check out the stitching? psh. that's for amateurs who don't have photos of athletes holding their jerseys! i don't think anyone's ever seen a single case of athlete provenance going awry.

seriously though, fantastic article by nerat. who knew he had it in him? chris, does this mean the end of stories about kobe jumping cars and excessive ebay listing fees? if SCD was filled with articles like that in every issue then they'd see subscription numbers soar. higher numbers would mean higher ad rates. certainly a better strategy than pandering to advertisers by refusing to write about anything of substance. anyway chris, really that was a terrific article. i don't even collect or watch football and i really enjoyed the article. just superb. keep it up. there's plenty of garbage out there so you've certainly got no lack of future material.

i love this garbage you hear from people when they get caught with crap and they say "but i got it straight from the athlete! what else was i supposed to do?! there were no photos during the 90s! nobody ever taped any games! we had no books or magazines! we didn't even have a system of measurement for me to be able to measure the @!#&* jersey!". there's no excuse for any of this stuff. sloppy and lazy. people expect to make thousands peddling items but refuse to do any work to actually check things out.

rudy.

[allstarsplus]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

i love this garbage you hear from people when they get caught with crap and they say "but i got it straight from the athlete!

rudy.

Actually as we see now, the only person who could say it came straight from the athlete appears to be David Thomason.

I was thinking over the handoff of these jerseys from Brett Favre to Thomason to Radtke to the collector.

The article doesn't really give Rick Radtke's in depth persepective of this. It almost seems conclusive that the jerseys are bad with no conclusion on who is telling the truth.

A suggestion to Chris Nerat is to ask Thomason, Radtke and the collector to voluntarily submit to a polygraph.

This is cutting edge investigative reporting that Chris Nerat deserves a lot of credit for his work on this, but again I could come up with 4 whodunits and maybe 5 if you can blame the "mysterious" person from the backroom who switched them out. Just watch an episode of CSI-NY and you will see more twists and turns than your favorite rollercoaster so coming to a conclusion is far from certain.

If those are real Brett Favre autographs/inscriptions on the #4 of these jerseys, then how did that auto/inscription end up on a bogus jersey?

[mvandor]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

Really comes down to investigating controls involved at the source. Thomason indicated he got all from Batty or Favre. Is Brett a real organized guy? Or is it possible he just stuffs em into a bag and takes em home where God knows what they'd get mixed up with before turnover to Thomason. Does Favre keep authentics at home for giveaways to charities, etc.?

All kinds of possibilities that don't go to dishonesty but just poor "chain of custody" allowing some bad ones to get mixed in inadvertently.

Hope Nerat follows up to get the results of Thomason's investigation. Class article by Nerat.

[aeneas01]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

i'm thinking this hankel guy is just another rabble-rouser and yet one more example of what's bad for the hobby. and i'm getting sick and tired of guys like hankel that recklessly state an item is intentionally altered, that an item is fake and/or misrepresented - as if some might indulge in a concerted effort to bilk collectors out of their game used cash. news flash - people make honest mistakes. as hard as they try to bring us only the most authentic items available, they are only human and not immune to an occasional error. frankly i'm very surprised nerat would even waste his time on such nonsense...

...

[gwh11]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD


--Guy

[mvandor]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

i'm thinking this hankel guy is just another rabble-rouser and yet one more example of what's bad for the hobby. and i'm getting sick and tired of guys like hankel that recklessly state an item is intentionally altered, that an item is fake and/or misrepresented - as if some might indulge in a concerted effort to bilk collectors out of their game used cash. news flash - people make honest mistakes. as hard as they try to bring us only the most authentic items available, they are only human and not immune to an occasional error. frankly i'm very surprised nerat would even waste his time on such nonsense...

...

You're not letting that one go, huh?

[aeneas01]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

You're not letting that one go, huh?

thanks for reminding me - you're another one of those rabble-rousers! i just wish you, kj, hankel and the rest of your lot would simply let the hobby heal. it's a new dawn, there's new hope in the world - breathe it in my friend!

...

[kingjammy24]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

according to the article and hankel's opinion, these weren't simply procuts that got mixed in. they were deliberately altered for the purpose of being passed off as legit gamers. the alarming part is that they were signed as gamers by favre. you could easily say that the letters were forged or swapped with bad jerseys. forget the letters for a minute though. the jerseys themselves were signed as gamers. either the inscriptions are forgeries or they're legit. if they're legit then what? was someone making these up and getting favre to sign them after the fact? radtke received them already signed. i'm sure when brett was signing them he wasn't looking at photos and whipping out the measuring tape. perhaps he just signed them all quickly because he trusted the person who was handing them to him to be signed. i don't think favre is the mastermind of a big conspiracy behind producing his fraudulent jerseys. however, IF the inscriptions are legit then what other conclusions can there be? if favre was unknowingly signing bad jerseys, then the person who put them before favre had obtained the bad jerseys. was that person thomason? there aren't too many suspects here. i don't think red batty made them. if he did, he could probably do a much better job. favre didn't make them. bus cook doesn't seem to have a clue or interest in favre's extracurricular memorabilia activities. radtke received them with favre's inscription already on them (if the inscriptions are legit). so who else is left other than thomason?

rudy.

[allstarsplus]

Re: Game Used Favre Story in SCD

Rudy - I can hear the other conspiracy theory now that the #4 with the real sig and inscription was removed from the real jersey and sewn to a fake one.

I don't know this Hankel guy so maybe he is wrong about the authenticity but those photos that Chris Nerat used showed those weren't the correct jersey used in those particular games.