What is your favorite addition to your collection in 2008?

[yanks12025]

Chris
Here are acouple threads about him.

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_f...lemente+helmet

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_f...lemente+helmet

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_f...lemente+helmet

[xpress34]

Yanks -

Thanks for the info.

Just so you know - I did do my research on Yankees Gamers and KM Pro hats from that era before buying.

Like I said earlier, I did not buy the hat on any preconceived notice that it is actually a GU Mantle (one could hope though!) but rather simply based on the info I could find that it is a GU Yankees hat from the late 60's to early 70's - no cracks in the bill but good 'sweat staining' around the band as is usual with wool caps.

Just for transparency sake, I only put around $200 into it and the Angels 'Halo' cap - and from what I could find from various auction sites prior sales (Hunt, Lelands, etc) that was way cheaper than what they have sold any GU Yankees caps or even 'Issued/non game used' caps from that era.

Again, I am very grateful to both you and NDevil for all of the info about Lin. As far as sending it to MEARS, I have already written Troy and Dave, and my only intention is to hopefully get it certified as a GU Yankees Cap from the day. I am hoping they will let me send some pics firts for a 'quick opinion' before going through the full blown process...

All the best -

Chris

[suicide_squeeze]

Yanks -

Thanks for the info.

Just so you know - I did do my research on Yankees Gamers and KM Pro hats from that era before buying.

Like I said earlier, I did not buy the hat on any preconceived notice that it is actually a GU Mantle (one could hope though!) but rather simply based on the info I could find that it is a GU Yankees hat from the late 60's to early 70's - no cracks in the bill but good 'sweat staining' around the band as is usual with wool caps.

Just for transparency sake, I only put around $200 into it and the Angels 'Halo' cap - and from what I could find from various auction sites prior sales (Hunt, Lelands, etc) that was way cheaper than what they have sold any GU Yankees caps or even 'Issued/non game used' caps from that era.

Again, I am very grateful to both you and NDevil for all of the info about Lin. As far as sending it to MEARS, I have already written Troy and Dave, and my only intention is to hopefully get it certified as a GU Yankees Cap from the day. I am hoping they will let me send some pics firts for a 'quick opinion' before going through the full blown process...

All the best -

Chris

Chris,

Dude. Listen......

You're taking the old addage "Grasping at straws" to a whole new dimension.

We have all made mistakes, my friend. But c'mon. I'll be the bad guy here. The other members are loaded with class, and don't want to do anything other than state the obvious while letting you make up your own mind.

What you have is a fabricated piece of junk from a criminal who continues to put out items that, while under observation, may pass the basic "time frame" question, but fail miserably from that moment on.

Are you actually telling yourself that another player, who wore that cap as an active player, would NOT have placed a marking on it to identify the cap as his? And if NOT (which is silly to even consider), are you telling yourself that they would wear a cap that had Mantle's number on it??

And, if the number was "added" at a later date......how could the piece of junk REALLY be considered to be a game used item when there are no other identifiers on it PRIOR to the "7" being added?

Nothing personal, and I mean that........but this criminal lives off of people who don't know better. I KNOW you said you bought it with the understanding of what it is, but I think you let your guard down just a bit, because what it is is a fraudulent piece of garbage, IMO.

Just have solace in the fact you didn't pay a lot for it.

Regards,

Steve

[bigtruck260]

Chris,

Dude. Listen......

You're taking the old addage "Grasping at straws" to a whole new dimension.

We have all made mistakes, my friend. But c'mon. I'll be the bad guy here. The other members are loaded with class, and don't want to do anything other than state the obvious while letting you make up your own mind.

What you have is a fabricated piece of junk from a criminal who continues to put out items that, while under observation, may pass the basic "time frame" question, but fail miserably from that moment on.

Are you actually telling yourself that another player, who wore that cap as an active player, would NOT have placed a marking on it to identify the cap as his? And if NOT (which is silly to even consider), are you telling yourself that they would wear a cap that had Mantle's number on it??

And, if the number was "added" at a later date......how could the piece of junk REALLY be considered to be a game used item when there are no other identifiers on it PRIOR to the "7" being added?

Nothing personal, and I mean that........but this criminal lives off of people who don't know better. I KNOW you said you bought it with the understanding of what it is, but I think you let your guard down just a bit, because what it is is a fraudulent piece of garbage, IMO.

Just have solace in the fact you didn't pay a lot for it.

Regards,

Steve

Steve hit it on the head.

This guy has had NUMEROUS things listed with this veil of "Well, I didn't say he actually used it in my description...."

His plan has been since the get go to "acquire" these pieces from sellers that apparently have no clue about the size of the memorabilia market all over the world. He 'stumbled' onto a 'vintage Pirates batting helmet' that looked to have CLEMENTE's number under the brim. CLEMENTE...not Dave Parker or Willie Stargell - Roberto Clemente. He put a few cards of Clemente up for comparison purposes, but never really said that the helmet was used by the man himself. His idea was to let the REAL collectors of the world determine its value. A little research would have shown a beginning collector that it was a fake - ut someone bought it anyway.

Onto the Mantle hat...

It was discussed in this forum while it was active on eBay. Nate has done a great job of calling these things to our attention. If there is a vendetta there, so be it. It is important for other members to bring up something as significant as a supposed Mantle hat.

Another thinly veiled listing. He put up a few Mantle cards and did everything but place in on the Mick's head in 1968. If it was in fact a legit item, something tells me that you would not need a MEARS opinion as they would probably own it themselves if they thought it was legit (just a hunch) - especially at that price. If not MEARS, than certainly another enterprising auctioneer or big time dealer.

I am all in favor of buyers knowing exactly what they are buying - that's awsome. If you wanted a late 60's Yanks hat - and that's what it is, I am very happy for you.

[xpress34]

I am all in favor of buyers knowing exactly what they are buying - that's awsome. If you wanted a late 60's Yanks hat - and that's what it is, I am very happy for you.

Steve and Dave -

Again, I very much appreciate your input. And as you stated above Dave -and as I told Yanks and NDevlin - I am under no perception that it is actually Mantle's hat... in fact I agree with you that all of the known Mantle's are probably in MEARS or another big collector's/auction house's hands.

I bought the item from the view point that regardless of what Lin said/didn't say, the hat is none the less a legimate Vintage KM Pro (unless someone thinks Lin stitched in the headband and tagging... ) and from that point of view alone - and based on research of previous Auction House auctions of KM Pro Yankees hats of this era, $200 was a steal - especially since I was able to get him to toss in the Angels 'Halo' hat - just to have a Vintage piece in my collection.

I may not have made it clear in my previous wording, but my only real goal in having MEARS review it is to determine if they believe it is an actual GU hat (not necessarily Mantle's) from the era as that alone adds exponentially to the value versus simply being a Vintage KM Pro. (The cheapest Yankees Gamer I have found at auction from a non-star sold for nearly $3,000 last year)

Now, if anyone here has info showing that KM Pro made 'Stadium' or 'Fan' hats like New Era does today, I would be interested in reading those articles... however, everything I have been able to find about KM Pro points to them only making 'GAME' hats exclusively for the Yankees, Red Sox, etc as well as having been a 'Private Labeler' for Tim McAuliffe after New Era stopped their 'Private Label' operations for McAuliffe, Spalding and Wilson.

That said, it is possible - and probable that this cap is 'club house' issue that never saw game use but was given to an employee or friend of a player, etc. Even if that is the case, it still doesn't constitute the item being called a 'worthless piece of junk' because (again) it still comes form the lineage of being produced by the one time exclusive manufacturer of the Yankees hats and can be dated to within a 10 year (or so) time frame.

And as stated earlier, I don't have a lot invested in the piece - and as I'm sure some of you have done over the years, sometimes you have to take a risk (in my personal experience it levels out the rare lucky finds - and I have had a few over the years) and see what develops.

I'm still ahead of the game on three pieces that have fallen into my lap over the years (one is gone now due to my 1st wife and our divorce):

Kren's Special Frankie Frisch Game Bat (could not verify GU) - I bought this for $3 at a flea market and during the divorce one of the largest Vintage Memorabila guys in Denver checked it out and reviewed it and paid me close to $3k for it... (that's the one that's gone)

When my dad died a few years ago while in Tucson we went to the Flea Market - I picked up a 1925-27 Official AL Ball (some partial sigs on it - the varnish has flaked off and taken most of the sigs with it) for $2

Last year at the 'Super Duper' Garage Sale in Longmont,CO I picked a piece I have only seen drawings of (I'll post pics later) - an 1800's Spalding 'inside out' or 'seamless' baseball for $8

So, I'm pretty comfortable with a $200 investment ( two local Yankees collector's - who also know this probably isn't Mantle's hat) have aready made offers that would be profitable to me just to have a Vintage hat in their collections.

It's items like this that keep me engaged in the hobby as well - good discussions, and hopefully some good education and knowledge come from those discussions.

All the best -

Chris

[xpress34]

What you have is a fabricated piece of junk...

Sorry, I misquoted in my previous post - not 'worthless' but 'fabricated'...

Just wanted to make sure I didn't misquote what was written.