Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

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  • frikativ54
    Senior Member
    • Dec 2007
    • 3612

    Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

    In mid-January, I posted a thread about Chris Boyd's selling a bat that he bought as game-model as a "game-used" bat. The seller was Scott Brosius, and obviously, a MLB player can tell the difference between a game-model bat and one that has actual use. The thread can be found here - http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_f...sticky+residue. The way it was left off was that Chris Boyd would send me the Bagwell bat in question, and I would let forum members know that Boyd was being honest in his description of the bat. I also brought up that he ripped me off for a Bagwell jersey, by selling me a $1495 jersey for $3275, with misleading provenance and a faded autograph. He told me he did not give refunds on ethics.

    Immediately after this happened, Boyd started taunting me over email that he had finally bought a pair of cleats that he had previously told me he had bought on my behalf. After the incident, he implied that he was going to send me pictures of the item. He then told me that he had lost the heart for selling, and that he would stick to his lucrative job in the oil industry. He furthermore told me that I would be the first to know when he decided to sell more Bagwell items. He also told me helpful information about the guy who was sending me the nasty emails.

    In the past he has allowed me to post pictures of items he has. I get a note from him not to post his pictures. I asked him about the cleats he told me he would sell to me, and he said he wouldn't sell them. Meanwhile, I never got the Bagwell bat - which I told him to keep and simply to follow through with his word about the cleats, and the bat is now off his website. That means, the bat has likely been sold under false pretenses. When I suggested going to the Better Business Bureau on Chris, he said the BBB can't tell him who and who not to do business with. He also said that it was really wrong what I did to him, though I made the decision based on ethics - and I have prevented sellers from buying misdescribed stuff.

    I have posted complains both with the BBB and with RipoffReport.com. I am hoping to get my money back for the jersey. Please be aware that when you do business with Chris Boyd, that you may not get what he had told you you were getting. I remember when he told me that he was selling me the "best pair of Jeff Bagwell batting gloves he'd seen", and I bought them for $1000. After I bought them from him, he said that there was light to moderate use on them. Some - best batting gloves he had ever seen. With Chris Boyd - caveat emptor.
    Les Zukor
    bagwellgameused@gmail.com
    Collecting Jeff Bagwell Cleats, Jerseys, & Other Items

    http://www.bagwellgameused.com
    (617) 682-0408
  • Rob L
    Senior Member
    • Nov 2005
    • 1237

    #2
    Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

    Geez, I hope you meant $100 for batting gloves and not $1000. The jersey is way overpriced also. Buyer beware?
    Rob L
    loefflerrd@cox.net

    Always On the Look Out for Troy Percival & Randy Johnson Gamers

    Rob L's Baseball Memorabilia website: GU Troy Percival, GU Randy Johnson, GU Angels, GU Baseball, 19th Century Baseball and Autographs. Also a huge Game Used Resource page and Game Used Collectors Page: www.loefflerrd.webs.com

    Comment

    • frikativ54
      Senior Member
      • Dec 2007
      • 3612

      #3
      Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

      Originally posted by Rob L
      Geez, I hope you meant $100 for batting gloves and not $1000. The jersey is way overpriced also. Buyer beware?
      No - I meant $1000. Live and learn, I guess. Dishonesty at every level. It just makes me not want to be involved in game-used collecting. Hopefully, there are some nice people out there. Yes - buyer beware. Buyers need to be forewarned when they are doing business with someone who is fundamentally dishonest.
      Les Zukor
      bagwellgameused@gmail.com
      Collecting Jeff Bagwell Cleats, Jerseys, & Other Items

      http://www.bagwellgameused.com
      (617) 682-0408

      Comment

      • b.heagy
        Senior Member
        • May 2006
        • 1263

        #4
        Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

        Frik,
        Did you research any past auctions of game used Bagwell items or previous sales of players of similar talent before purchasing those items? Where did those figures come from? $1k for batting gloves of a modern era star is absurd in my opinion.
        Bill Heagy
        heagysports.com
        Go Phillies !

        Comment

        • frikativ54
          Senior Member
          • Dec 2007
          • 3612

          #5
          Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

          Originally posted by b.heagy
          Frik,
          Did you research any past auctions of game used Bagwell items or previous sales of players of similar talent before purchasing those items? Where did those figures come from? $1k for batting gloves of a modern era star is absurd in my opinion.
          I didn't know where to research them. I should have asked publically on Game Used Universe, but regardless of that, I was ripped off. Dealers should be more honest, and I am never going to do business with anyone who treats me like this again. It's not worth it. I've learned a very valuable lesson. But I stll think I am owed my money back, because I was led to believe that I was getting a jersey directly from Bagwell's friend with a perfect autograph at fair market value.
          Les Zukor
          bagwellgameused@gmail.com
          Collecting Jeff Bagwell Cleats, Jerseys, & Other Items

          http://www.bagwellgameused.com
          (617) 682-0408

          Comment

          • grenda12
            Senior Member
            • Oct 2008
            • 649

            #6
            Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

            Ive read the forms and the rip off site and was just amazed. I do really feel for you. It does sound like you've been ripped off. I always try to do research before I buy something game used.

            Thanks Les, for watching out for people.

            Comment

            • jkalathas
              Senior Member
              • Dec 2007
              • 198

              #7
              Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

              Frik- "fair market value"... what does this even mean? All these game used items (and yes I spend my money on it also) are worth only what we are willing to pay for it. Those batting gloves don't carry a fair market value. Last time I checked used batting gloves are not a commodity. They carry probably a suggested retail price of $25.00, before they are used. If you paid $1,000 and you feel you overpaid, be pissed off at yourself and not who sold them to you.

              Comment

              • frikativ54
                Senior Member
                • Dec 2007
                • 3612

                #8
                Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

                Originally posted by grenda12
                Ive read the forms and the rip off site and was just amazed. I do really feel for you. It does sound like you've been ripped off. I always try to do research before I buy something game used.

                Thanks Les, for watching out for people.
                I appreciate your support. Hopefully, through these forums, we can make sure that dealers are held accountable for their actions. I will do more research in the future. All I can hope is that I have opened collectors eyes to the mendacity of some in the collecting world. Maybe the BBB will do something.
                Les Zukor
                bagwellgameused@gmail.com
                Collecting Jeff Bagwell Cleats, Jerseys, & Other Items

                http://www.bagwellgameused.com
                (617) 682-0408

                Comment

                • cigarman44
                  Senior Member
                  • Aug 2007
                  • 621

                  #9
                  Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

                  Originally posted by jkalathas
                  Frik- "fair market value"... what does this even mean? All these game used items (and yes I spend my money on it also) are worth only what we are willing to pay for it. Those batting gloves don't carry a fair market value. Last time I checked used batting gloves are not a commodity. They carry probably a suggested retail price of $25.00, before they are used. If you paid $1,000 and you feel you overpaid, be pissed off at yourself and not who sold them to you.
                  I think with game used "fair market value" is whatever someone is willing to pay for it. Sure Chris has done some unethical things in the past but if you agreed to pay those prices, the only one you can fault is yourself. Trust me Ive overpaid for stuff like all of us have. But I can only fault myself and if I didn't want it that bad I wouldn't have paid it.

                  Comment

                  • BoneRubbedBat
                    Senior Member
                    • Jul 2005
                    • 484

                    #10
                    Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

                    fwiw, Bagwell gloves are one of the toughest items of Bagwell to obtain. A pair of his custom padded gloves with the hard plastic guard usually go for well over $500 here in Houston.
                    sigpic

                    Always looking for vintage game used bats of Houston Buffs and Colt .45's players.

                    Comment

                    • frikativ54
                      Senior Member
                      • Dec 2007
                      • 3612

                      #11
                      Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

                      Originally posted by cigarman44
                      I think with game used "fair market value" is whatever someone is willing to pay for it. Sure Chris has done some unethical things in the past but if you agreed to pay those prices, the only one you can fault is yourself. Trust me Ive overpaid for stuff like all of us have. But I can only fault myself and if I didn't want it that bad I wouldn't have paid it.
                      I was naive and was misled. It won't happen again. But I just want to make other collectors aware of what Boyd's MO is so that they won't be ripped off too. Next time, I will do more research. I am not the only one who is unhappy. I have heard from no fewer than five collectors that are equally as unhappy. Yet - I can't feel angry at myself for being naive. I can only have compassion with myself and know that I made mistakes just like everybody else does.

                      -Frik
                      Les Zukor
                      bagwellgameused@gmail.com
                      Collecting Jeff Bagwell Cleats, Jerseys, & Other Items

                      http://www.bagwellgameused.com
                      (617) 682-0408

                      Comment

                      • Vintagedeputy
                        Senior Member
                        • Oct 2005
                        • 3172

                        #12
                        Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

                        For $1000, I would have first asked for some photos of these well used, dipped in gold, diamond encrusted batting gloves.

                        Comment

                        • frikativ54
                          Senior Member
                          • Dec 2007
                          • 3612

                          #13
                          Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

                          Now, the only way Chris Boyd will refund the money is if it is done through the legal system. He says that fair market value for the jersey is $1200. And I paid $3275. He refuses to refund the money. What a fraud. He's now telling me that the jersey was from a friend of Jeff's in California, even though I have pictures from the guy in Colorado showing that those jerseys never came from a friend of Jeff's. I am blocking all of Chris's email addresses. I am not sure I even want to remain a member of game-used forums.
                          Les Zukor
                          bagwellgameused@gmail.com
                          Collecting Jeff Bagwell Cleats, Jerseys, & Other Items

                          http://www.bagwellgameused.com
                          (617) 682-0408

                          Comment

                          • Mr.3000

                            #14
                            Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

                            Originally posted by frikativ54
                            Now, the only way Chris Boyd will refund the money is if it is done through the legal system. He says that fair market value for the jersey is $1200. And I paid $3275. He refuses to refund the money. What a fraud. He's now telling me that the jersey was from a friend of Jeff's in California, even though I have pictures from the guy in Colorado showing that those jerseys never came from a friend of Jeff's. I am blocking all of Chris's email addresses. I am not sure I even want to remain a member of game-used forums.
                            I think I am confused. Please help me here.

                            You paid $3275. for a jersey. The seller then admits that it's only valued at $1200. then you pay $1000 for a pair of batting gloves that you now feel are only worth $250 or so.....and you now want a refund?

                            If that is in deed the correct trail of events, why is your overpaying his problem?

                            I don't think I am seeing the logic here.

                            While I agree that some of the sellers documented practices are less than ethical and I personally would never buy from him....I don't see how your over paying for a jersey and a pair of batting gloves constitutes thievery by the seller (i.e several times you claimed you were ripped off).

                            It seems to me, now this is just my take on the situation, you feel you were duped and made a few overzealous, hasty purchases. While you have every right to be angry I think your anger is misplaced.

                            This falls under the "live and learn" category. I would chalk it up to an expensive lesson learned.

                            Comment

                            • frikativ54
                              Senior Member
                              • Dec 2007
                              • 3612

                              #15
                              Re: Chris Boyd's Business Practices - Part Deux

                              Originally posted by Mr.3000
                              I think I am confused. Please help me here.

                              You paid $3275. for a jersey. The seller then admits that it's only valued at $1200. then you pay $1000 for a pair of batting gloves that you now feel are only worth $250 or so.....and you now want a refund?

                              If that is in deed the correct trail of events, why is your overpaying his problem?

                              I don't think I am seeing the logic here.

                              While I agree that some of the sellers documented practices are less than ethical and I personally would never buy from him....I don't see how your over paying for a jersey and a pair of batting gloves constitutes thievery by the seller (i.e several times you claimed you were ripped off).

                              It seems to me, now this is just my take on the situation, you feel you were duped and made a few overzealous, hasty purchases. While you have every right to be angry I think your anger is misplaced.

                              This falls under the "live and learn" category. I would chalk it up to an expensive lesson learned.
                              So - if someone lies to you about fair market value - they can just get away with it? He first told me that fair market value was what I was buying it for. Now he tells me if I send it back I will only get $1200. Yet in his COA it says it's from an Astros clubhouse source. It's from a dealer in Colorado.
                              Les Zukor
                              bagwellgameused@gmail.com
                              Collecting Jeff Bagwell Cleats, Jerseys, & Other Items

                              http://www.bagwellgameused.com
                              (617) 682-0408

                              Comment

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