Lebron jersey - A5

[nyjetsfan14]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

I recently purchased a 1994 NY Jets preseason jersey accompanied by a MEARS LOO and worksheet. I originally owned the jersey, sold it, it somehow ended up with MEARS, then to another dealer before I re-purchased it off e-Bay. The MEARS worksheet indicates an A5 grade but the LOO indicates an A4. The grades are supposed to match up. The jersey has had the anniversary patch removed (there is evidence of such), the Champion sleeve identifiers removed from the sleeve stripe and resewn above the sleeve stripes, and the NOB is atypical of what the Jets wore in the early 90's on their non throwback jerseys. All of these are points I made in my original item description when I sold the jersey and to me are very explainable/justifiable - actually lending to the legitimacy of the piece. However, there is no mention at all of any of those very visible and important issues on either the worksheet or LOO even though the LOO indicates a photo style match. I e-mailed MEARS and they were nice enough to respond admitting more effort could/should have been put forth and that they could reissue new documentation to include the issues I brought forth - which I politely declined as I do all my own write ups. This information is not to disparage MEARS or anyone else but rather to reinforce the number one rule we always hammer on this forum - DO YOUR OWN HOMEWORK and seek assistance from fellow members. Do not depend on any authenticator/auction house no matter how fancy a COA or worksheet they have. Posts like Rudy's, Robert's, Howard's, etc... go a loooong way in helping the collecting community arm themselves with information. Helping one another and sharing information is the primary purpose of the forum and I personally do not feel either constitutes smearing but rather participating in good faith and keeping in the spirit of the hobby. Happy collecting to all!

[sportscentury]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

I do think MEARS authenticates as well as anyone in the industry, with the exception of MeiGray.

I agree. If a buyer wants/needs third-party authentication, I recommend MEARS.

As for MeiGray, they only authenticate an outside item if they have first photomatched it. Let me tell you, this exclusionary criterion quickly filters out a lot of crap!

As for your Garnett, if it shows good wear, you may want MeiGray to photomatch it. A photomatched Garnett T-Wolves jersey would be a gem. I have passed on a few Garnett T-Wolves jerseys with team letters recently because they have shown no real wear (and I think some extras may have been sold with team letters, which is, in part, why they do not command much money on the secondary market any longer) ... but it sounds like you picked up one of the jerseys he actually wore. It sounds like a great shirt.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

..what do the MEARS haters want?

joel i have 1 question for you. it's a yes/no question so it's pretty simple.

troy said that one of the criteria to garner an A5 is that mears makes "..sure the jersey was the proper size to be issued to that player". those were his words, not mine.

here is my question to you: in regards to the jersey in question, did mears "make sure the jersey was the proper size to be issued" to lebron james?

rudy.

[reed1216]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

Reid- Thanks for the suggestion about sending the jersey to MeiGray to see if they can photomatch it. I might just do that.

.

[sportscentury]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

Reid- Thanks for the suggestion about sending the jersey to MeiGray to see if they can photomatch it. I might just do that.

.

Reed - if you do, and it is matched, please post the pics so that we can all check it out.

[reed1216]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

Will do, Reid.

[trsent]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

joel i have 1 question for you. it's a yes/no question so it's pretty simple.

troy said that one of the criteria to garner an A5 is that mears makes "..sure the jersey was the proper size to be issued to that player". those were his words, not mine.

here is my question to you: in regards to the jersey in question, did mears "make sure the jersey was the proper size to be issued" to lebron james?

rudy.

I would guess they approved the size if they wrote the letter.

You showed him wearing another size in a few photos but that doesn't mean he never wore the size you showed, does it?

You want Troy to prove something to you that he doesn't have to - You have to prove it to him and stop the slander until you do.

He owes you nothing - He replied to your email, you didn't like the reply and you think he has to prove the size to you - Why? What do you offer to MEARS except for attack after attack even when Troy shows responsibility for errors proved against him?

Their system is amazing and they have a history of working with the industry like few others, but you want to harp on an issue you cannot even 100% is in error because you like the bad press for MEARS. Prove your point, don't just offer speculation and then I can tell you I agree with you on this one.

Or maybe you should waste your time personally attacking me.

Finally, Sammy, why the picture of me and Warren? Was there a point to this?

[mvandor]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

I would guess they approved the size if they wrote the letter.

You showed him wearing another size in a few photos but that doesn't mean he never wore the size you showed, does it?

You want Troy to prove something to you that he doesn't have to - You have to prove it to him and stop the slander until you do.

He owes you nothing - He replied to your email, you didn't like the reply and you think he has to prove the size to you - Why? What do you offer to MEARS except for attack after attack even when Troy shows responsibility for errors proved against him?

Their system is amazing and they have a history of working with the industry like few others, but you want to harp on an issue you cannot even 100% is in error because you like the bad press for MEARS. Prove your point, don't just offer speculation and then I can tell you I agree with you on this one.

Or maybe you should waste your time personally attacking me.

Finally, Sammy, why the picture of me and Warren? Was there a point to this?

Joel, it is obviously impossible to prove a negative. Further, it is the AUTHENTICATOR'S professional responsibility to demonstrate, PER THEIR OWN STANDARDS, that the size is consistent with known evidence. I'm sure Troy and company themselves wouldn't argue that. Either they have evidence or they don't and let this one slip through, by mistake.

Or I'm truly misreading their A5 grade description.

[jdr3]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

mvandor-beautifully said!

[trsent]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

Joel, it is obviously impossible to prove a negative. Further, it is the AUTHENTICATOR'S professional responsibility to demonstrate, PER THEIR OWN STANDARDS, that the size is consistent with known evidence. I'm sure Troy and company themselves wouldn't argue that. Either they have evidence or they don't and let this one slip through, by mistake.

Or I'm truly misreading their A5 grade description.

Sir, you are wrong here - Troy found the jersey to be consistent with LeBron sizes - If Rudy feels it is the wrong size, get solid proof to prove otherwise. Some samples does not make a wrong, does it?

Troy don't owe Rudy anything but a lawsuit for slander. Rudy doesn't think the size is correct? Get records to prove it.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

"I would guess they approved the size if they wrote the letter."

i didn't ask if MEARS approved the size. read the question joel. slowly if you have to. here it is once again: "did troy make sure that a size 52+4 was issued to lebron james?".

"You showed him wearing another size in a few photos but that doesn't mean he never wore the size you showed, does it?"

no it doesn't. i never said lebron never wore a 52+4. troy stated the size is correct and i questioned how he came to that conclusion. when i asked him, he had no answer other than that the MEARS A5 definition allows him size variances.

anyway, your logic is phenomenal. by your school of thought, a correct size can be any size that can't be disproven. amazing. so i guess a size 100 is correct too right? after all, you can't prove he never wore a size 100!

"You have to prove it to him"

i have proven it; i've proven MEARS has no evidence for them to say that a 52+4 is correct. comically, you keep saying "but is it incorrect?". it may not be incorrect, but the point joel is that it's unknown. neither i nor MEARS knows if a 52+4 is incorrect. yet MEARS states it's correct. you seem to think that the only options are "correct" or "incorrect". the third option is "unknown" and that's the basis of my issue; that MEARS says they perform tasks (such as size verification and stylematching) that they don't. if they don't know if a size is correct, they should put "unknown". grade it an A4 or A3 or whatever. point being, if MEARS doesn't know something, they shouldn't say they do know it.

"you think he has to prove the size to you - Why?"

because MEARS' own definition of the A5 states that they verify correct sizes. i'm just holding MEARS to their own policies. apparently you feel that constitutes "slander".

"Prove your point"

i have. MEARS doesn't verify sizes even though they say they do.

rudy.

[Mac670]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

I was looking again at Kobe game used jerseys and found that a buy it now 2004-2005 white alternative jersey size 50 + 4 with Mears paperwork graded A5. Now Its been said by Dan that Kobe never wore that size with Reebok. It appears many unsuspecting collectors would definately think that jersey was worn by Kobe, we here at GU would know better. I always assumed a grade A5 from Mears was at least correct when it came to sizes of a particular player used or issued. It makes me think otherwise when I see Mears paperwork.

Anthony

[trsent]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

"I would guess they approved the size if they wrote the letter."

i didn't ask if MEARS approved the size. read the question joel. slowly if you have to. here it is once again: "did troy make sure that a size 52+4 was issued to lebron james?".

"You showed him wearing another size in a few photos but that doesn't mean he never wore the size you showed, does it?"

no it doesn't. i never said lebron never wore a 52+4. troy stated the size is correct and i questioned how he came to that conclusion. when i asked him, he had no answer other than that the MEARS A5 definition allows him size variances.

anyway, your logic is phenomenal. by your school of thought, a correct size can be any size that can't be disproven. amazing. so i guess a size 100 is correct too right? after all, you can't prove he never wore a size 100!

"You have to prove it to him"

i have proven it; i've proven MEARS has no evidence for them to say that a 52+4 is correct. comically, you keep saying "but is it incorrect?". it may not be incorrect, but the point joel is that it's unknown. neither i nor MEARS knows if a 52+4 is incorrect. yet MEARS states it's correct. you seem to think that the only options are "correct" or "incorrect". the third option is "unknown" and that's the basis of my issue; that MEARS says they perform tasks (such as size verification and stylematching) that they don't. if they don't know if a size is correct, they should put "unknown". grade it an A4 or A3 or whatever. point being, if MEARS doesn't know something, they shouldn't say they do know it.

"you think he has to prove the size to you - Why?"

because MEARS' own definition of the A5 states that they verify correct sizes. i'm just holding MEARS to their own policies. apparently you feel that constitutes "slander".

"Prove your point"

i have. MEARS doesn't verify sizes even though they say they do.

rudy.

Rudy, great work!

Almost as great as your personal attack against me making fun of my email habits.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

joel: let's say there was a jersey on ebay; a 1998 cardinals jersey, size 42, with "BIG MAC ATTAK!" as the NOB and a 69 as the number on the back. would this be a correct 1998 regular season mcgwire game-worn jersey? according to your logic it would be correct because you can't prove he never wore it!

mac670/anthony:

"I was looking again at Kobe game used jerseys and found that a buy it now 2004-2005 white alternative jersey size 50 + 4 with Mears paperwork graded A5. Now Its been said by Dan that Kobe never wore that size with Reebok. It appears many unsuspecting collectors would definately think that jersey was worn by Kobe, we here at GU would know better. I always assumed a grade A5 from Mears was at least correct when it came to sizes of a particular player used or issued. It makes me think otherwise when I see Mears paperwork."

exactly my point. when MEARS says that a jersey must be the correct size in order to garner a certain grade, then people expect the jersey to be the correct size and "correct size" is not a euphemism for a range of sizes ("variances"). when i simply asked troy how MEARS knew a 52+4 was correct, as the corresponding A5 grade state, they had no evidence. they didn't know. if you don't know something, don't say you do. over and over again MEARS has purported to know things they don't. if you don't evaluate a certain aspect of a jersey or don't perform a certain service, don't say you have! it's really very simple. what would i have done if i'd been in troy's shoes on this lebron jersey? i simply would've stated that i have no idea if the size is correct or not, rather than mislead people into thinking i know something i don't.

it's a pretty serious thing when an authenticator says they've verified something that they haven't. it gives a false impression to MEARS clients and hinders their ability to accurately evaluate a piece.

rudy.

[trsent]

Re: Lebron jersey - A5

joel: let's say there was a jersey on ebay; a 1998 cardinals jersey, size 42, with "BIG MAC ATTAK!" as the NOB and a 69 as the number on the back. would this be a correct 1998 regular season mcgwire game-worn jersey? according to your logic it would be correct because you can't prove he never wore it!

with this sort of logic, i'm starting to think howard wolf's image in this thread might've been taken from actual medical files.

mac670/anthony:

"I was looking again at Kobe game used jerseys and found that a buy it now 2004-2005 white alternative jersey size 50 + 4 with Mears paperwork graded A5. Now Its been said by Dan that Kobe never wore that size with Reebok. It appears many unsuspecting collectors would definately think that jersey was worn by Kobe, we here at GU would know better. I always assumed a grade A5 from Mears was at least correct when it came to sizes of a particular player used or issued. It makes me think otherwise when I see Mears paperwork."

exactly my point. when MEARS says that a jersey must be the correct size in order to garner a certain grade, then people expect the jersey to be the correct size and "correct size" is not a euphemism for a range of sizes ("variances"). when i simply asked troy how MEARS knew a 52+4 was correct, as the corresponding A5 grade state, they had no evidence. they didn't know. if you don't know something, don't say you do. over and over again MEARS has purported to know things they don't. if you don't evaluate a certain aspect of a jersey or don't perform a certain service, don't say you have! it's really very simple. what would i have done if i'd been in troy's shoes on this lebron jersey? i simply would've stated that i have no idea if the size is correct or not, rather than mislead people into thinking i know something i don't.

it's a pretty serious thing when an authenticator says they've verified something that they haven't. it gives a false impression to MEARS clients and hinders their ability to accurately evaluate a piece.

rudy.

Rudy - Due to your personal attacks and new signature attacking me once again I will no longer respond to you personally because you are just a bully as I stated before.

Thanks for attacking me, I appreciate the defense that you should attack someone who speaks the voice of reason.