Ebay bidding shenanigans? What do you think?

[mattmueller]

Please allow me to describe a set of facts and solicit people’s opinions. Yes, its sorta long.

Via eBay, one of the many sports memorabilia dealers who have an exclusive contract with a fast rising star has been selling autographed items of a particular star. Call the dealer XYZ Sports. Apparently in a private signing conducted with the player, XYZ had a lot of signing going on because XYZ consistently lists a new auction for one of these autographed items immediately after the prior auction ends. So at a minimum, a new auction for an autographed version of this item is started every 7 days. The item being sold can be described in a generic manner so, given the frequency of the auctions, XYZ continues to utilize the exact same description and exact photo in each auction. Note however, that given potential nuances in said players autograph, and/or the nature of the item being autographed, showing actual photos of the autographed item being offered in each auction could allow a bidder to understand if the same item has been sold before. XYZ maintains a website presence and has offered game used and autographed items of the star player before. My personal interaction with XYZ is that they are horribly slow to respond to inquiries of items for sale, sometimes not even responding to offers to buy items being offered. Further, upon review of photos provided by XYZ depicting items described as game used by the star (and from conversations with others also offered game used items by XYZ), the game use characteristics of some of the items being offered is at some times quite questionable.


So, I have an interest in acquiring one of the frequently auctioned autographed items mentioned above. But, given that they are being churned out on such a frequent basis, I wait to place a bid thinking that eventually XYZ will saturate the market and the price will drop. Four months later, the price drops a little, but not below a certain level, ~$170. This seems odd and makes me curious, so I begin to “watch” or bid on the items on ebay to be able to easily reference bidding patterns on the items auctioned.

For the two + month period I have been watching and four weeks that I have been able to have exact auction results documented or saved, a certain bidder is always present in the bidding process. We will call this bidder, Bidder X, or in eBay terms B***X. B***X has a solid 116 feedback, with 100% satisfaction. Seems like a good guy.


A bit on B***X’s attempts to win one of these items while I have been paying strict attention. At first look, it appears our friend B***X is a disciplined bidder. B***X is always bidding a day or so before the auction ends, always bidding (within a few dollars) the same price, typically using an autobid, but B***X has apparently not found the joys of sniping an auction. My initial opinion is B***X is determined to get one of those special autographed items of this rising star, he just doesn’t have enough pennies in the piggy bank to bid over $170. One time, he even bids $169.99 only to have a bid of $170.01 sit as the top bid for 36 hours. But apparently poor B***X couldn’t find $.03 to up his bid and finally win the beloved item. Bummer. B***X is almost always the underbidder, 2nd place really sucks. However, B***X’s luck finally changes on the weekend of July 4th. While others are apparently enjoying hot dogs and fireworks, B***X’s stealthy bid of ~$164 finally wins one of these items. Congratulations to B***X! But wait, in the next auction our good friend is back in the fray bidding on the item again, but is once again the underbidder at $169.


To me, B***X’s bid on the auction after he won the last auction ruined by theory of the disciplined buyer looking to score that beloved item at a good price, so I decide to check out his bid history. I was shocked to see that Bidder X is so dedicated to trying to win items from XYZ that 100% of his bids were on items sold by XYZ in the last 31 days. Perhaps, I reason, that given XYZ’s status as exclusive provider of autographed and game used items, B***X only bids on items from XYZ. B***X also has no interest in bidding on other of the star players items available on ebay, whether MLB authenticated or maybe a bubble gum card or two. Nothing doing. Its all XYZ sports or nothing.


In your opinion (feel free to make multiple selections):


a) B***X is a diligent buyer of the star player’s autographed items below $170. Loves them for less than $170, hates them over $170. B***X has trust in the XYZ LOA and relationship with the star and only bids on ebay with XYZ.

b) B***X is acting as a shill bidder for XYZ, driving the price to $170 for the item. XYZ has costs associated with having the star under contract and needs to get $170 or so for the bats to make the contract with the star worthwhile. By using the generic listing and photo, XYZ can cover their tracks in case B***X accidentally wins an auction.

c) Some other explanation I haven’t thought of

d) I have way too much free time on my hands to i) notice this is going on, ii) write this long of a post, iii) even worry about it to begin with


Thanks for reading through it all,
Matt

[spartakid]

Wow, that was long. I would say both B and D apply here. Definitely sketch if you ask me, the probably didn't count on someone like yourself, this is where the D. comes in, following their auctions over a long period of time. I would report this for sure. Sounds like some good detective work to me. Care to share who XYZ actually is? Since this all speculation and we aren't accusing anyone, hopefully that can help me avoid a CD order Just so perhaps if someone on hear decides to bid on one of their items, they can pay close attention to the bidders. Ricardo

[Jags Fan Dan]

Believe me, if it looks like shill bidding, smells like shill bidding... you get the picture. Trust your gut. It's 99.9% for sure a pant load.

[joelsabi]

Please allow me to describe a set of facts and solicit people’s opinions. Yes, its sorta long.

Via eBay, one of the many sports memorabilia dealers who have an exclusive contract with a fast rising star has been selling autographed items of a particular star. Call the dealer XYZ Sports. Apparently in a private signing conducted with the player, XYZ had a lot of signing going on because XYZ consistently lists a new auction for one of these autographed items immediately after the prior auction ends. So at a minimum, a new auction for an autographed version of this item is started every 7 days. The item being sold can be described in a generic manner so, given the frequency of the auctions, XYZ continues to utilize the exact same description and exact photo in each auction. Note however, that given potential nuances in said players autograph, and/or the nature of the item being autographed, showing actual photos of the autographed item being offered in each auction could allow a bidder to understand if the same item has been sold before. XYZ maintains a website presence and has offered game used and autographed items of the star player before. My personal interaction with XYZ is that they are horribly slow to respond to inquiries of items for sale, sometimes not even responding to offers to buy items being offered. Further, upon review of photos provided by XYZ depicting items described as game used by the star (and from conversations with others also offered game used items by XYZ), the game use characteristics of some of the items being offered is at some times quite questionable.


So, I have an interest in acquiring one of the frequently auctioned autographed items mentioned above. But, given that they are being churned out on such a frequent basis, I wait to place a bid thinking that eventually XYZ will saturate the market and the price will drop. Four months later, the price drops a little, but not below a certain level, ~$170. This seems odd and makes me curious, so I begin to “watch” or bid on the items on ebay to be able to easily reference bidding patterns on the items auctioned.

For the two + month period I have been watching and four weeks that I have been able to have exact auction results documented or saved, a certain bidder is always present in the bidding process. We will call this bidder, Bidder X, or in eBay terms B***X. B***X has a solid 116 feedback, with 100% satisfaction. Seems like a good guy.


A bit on B***X’s attempts to win one of these items while I have been paying strict attention. At first look, it appears our friend B***X is a disciplined bidder. B***X is always bidding a day or so before the auction ends, always bidding (within a few dollars) the same price, typically using an autobid, but B***X has apparently not found the joys of sniping an auction. My initial opinion is B***X is determined to get one of those special autographed items of this rising star, he just doesn’t have enough pennies in the piggy bank to bid over $170. One time, he even bids $169.99 only to have a bid of $170.01 sit as the top bid for 36 hours. But apparently poor B***X couldn’t find $.03 to up his bid and finally win the beloved item. Bummer. B***X is almost always the underbidder, 2nd place really sucks. However, B***X’s luck finally changes on the weekend of July 4th. While others are apparently enjoying hot dogs and fireworks, B***X’s stealthy bid of ~$164 finally wins one of these items. Congratulations to B***X! But wait, in the next auction our good friend is back in the fray bidding on the item again, but is once again the underbidder at $169.


To me, B***X’s bid on the auction after he won the last auction ruined by theory of the disciplined buyer looking to score that beloved item at a good price, so I decide to check out his bid history. I was shocked to see that Bidder X is so dedicated to trying to win items from XYZ that 100% of his bids were on items sold by XYZ in the last 31 days. Perhaps, I reason, that given XYZ’s status as exclusive provider of autographed and game used items, B***X only bids on items from XYZ. B***X also has no interest in bidding on other of the star players items available on ebay, whether MLB authenticated or maybe a bubble gum card or two. Nothing doing. Its all XYZ sports or nothing.


In your opinion (feel free to make multiple selections):


a) B***X is a diligent buyer of the star player’s autographed items below $170. Loves them for less than $170, hates them over $170. B***X has trust in the XYZ LOA and relationship with the star and only bids on ebay with XYZ.

b) B***X is acting as a shill bidder for XYZ, driving the price to $170 for the item. XYZ has costs associated with having the star under contract and needs to get $170 or so for the bats to make the contract with the star worthwhile. By using the generic listing and photo, XYZ can cover their tracks in case B***X accidentally wins an auction.

c) Some other explanation I haven’t thought of

d) I have way too much free time on my hands to i) notice this is going on, ii) write this long of a post, iii) even worry about it to begin with


Thanks for reading through it all,
Matt

i am looking at a similar situation but my B***X keeps winning. so maybe he just has a fascination with the item where i just want one.

[jppopma]

Looks like shill bidding to me. Another sure way to know is if the shiller keeps winning and they immediately offer the item in a second chance deal to the next in line. I've had that happen and ran the other way.

[rj_lucas]

B, take it to the bank.

Rick
rickjlucas@gmail.com

[CampWest]

sounds like you should report the buyer and seller to ebay... Though that probably doesnt help you much... they'd probably just switch to a 169.99 reserve/starting price or a higher BIN. Clearly they are not interested in selling below that price.

Sounds to me like they are using shill bidding to avoid the ebay fees related to setting a reserve, and avoid the common buyer avoidance of reserves.

How long have they been an ebay member?

[mattmueller]

As it turns out the correct answer is A, dedicated fan of the superstar who only wants authentic items at a certain price and only from XYZ. B***X bid on the identical item after already winning one because they wanted two of them. Turns out that it is not really that hard to look at the seller's history and winning bidders to decode the B***X system, find that ebayer and shoot them a quick message. Of course they could be lying, but their bids have not shown up in the most recent auction, and the price ended below $150.

Matt

[jppopma]

Hopefully they will step aside and let you win one of the items for alot less. Other than this bidder, what was the next lower amount? You should be able to land one of them for just above that.

Just remember to go with your gut! You said it well at the end of your post; the shill bidder could easily be the seller or related to the seller. Of course they would give you whatever line they could to keep you bidding.

[Mark17]

From the story, what jumps out at me is the bid of $169.99. I personally don't think someone is trying to win an item with such a bid. It makes no sense... are they thinking someone else might be bidding $169.98?