Why is LeBron getting so much hate?

[Nathan]

I have a few issues with this.

"The whole thing was a poorly concocted charade of unprofessional garbage, that's why. And it offends me on several levels.

It offends me as a coach. I have a few years of coaching experience, and this basically says "The hell with loyalty, the hell with sticking it out. Just go somewhere with better players and you'll get what you really deserve." Great example for the kids. IF HE HAD GOTTEN INTO AN ACCIDENT ON JUNE 30th AND WAS UNABLE TO PLAY AGAIN WOULD THE CAVS OR ANY TEAM BEEN LOYAL TO HIM? OR IF IN A FEW YEARS HIS SKILLS DECLINED AND THE CAVS HAD CHANCE TO DEAL HIM FOR PLAYERS THEY FELT BETTER HELPED THEIR TEAM WOULD THEY? IT IS A BUSINESS.

Apples to giraffes to a ceiling fan, my friend.
- Although Mike Brown's firing was a foregone conclusion, Dan Gilbert waited 11 days before making a move. Why? Because it meant that Brown would collect his entire 2010-11 salary while being unemployed. I have a difficult time imagining that someone who shows that loyalty to someone who's being shown the door wouldn't be shown to someone as popular as LeBron.
- If a player is in the decline phase of his career, very few people would have an issue with him being moved in order to get a last best shot at being a part of a championship team. No one faults Ray Bourque, who had put in 20 years with the Boston Bruins, for being moved to Colorado for a last kick. And it's really not tough to sell it so there are no hard feelings toward the player. Bernie Kosar was moved, not by his choice, and ended up winning a Super Bowl with Dallas as a backup that same year. He's still the most popular athlete in Cleveland.

It offends me as a competitor. Who exactly sits up and says "You know what I'd like to do? Join 'em rather than beat 'em. If I can't win in the playoffs in a relatively short period of time, then I'll find a way to stack the deck." WADE AND BOSH ARE NOT THE GUYS HE HAS TO BEAT: KOBE AND THE LAKERS ARE, THEY AND NOT THE HEAT ARE THE CHAMPS. THE CELTS AND MAGIC HE HAS TOO BEAT ALSO.

Exactly, the Celtics and Magic. Rather than continue going head-to-head against those teams with his Cavaliers, he bailed out and stacked the deck.

It offends me as an Ohioan. Of all people, a player in Cleveland who grew up in Akron should be extremely mindful of the history of sports in northeast Ohio, and even more mindful of exactly how much the teams mean to a region that has had so much adversity (outside the world of sports) and taken so much crap over the last 50 years. HE FELT HE TOOK THE TEAM AS FAR AS HE COULD IF HE RETIRED RINGLESS BECAUSE HE STAYED A CAV, IT IS HIS LEGACY THAT IS HURT WITH PEOPLE SAYING HE NEVER WON LIKE MARINO or STOCKTON.

Stockton and Marino hung around their teams as long as they could for whatever reason. So did Jeff Bagwell and Craig Biggio. So has Todd Helton. When you've played 15 years and have no team awards to show for it, you're past the "villain" point if you decide to move on. 7 years is not 15 years.

Let me ask you this. If Peyton Manning sat up after the 2004 season and said "I've put in 7 years with Indy, we can't get past New England, so I'm going to the Patriots as a backup", what would the reaction be? I know exactly what it would be, and it's pretty much exactly what we've seen with LeBron for obvious reasons.

It offends me as a courteous individual. If I leave a job, as I have before, you'd better believe I'm giving notice no matter how acrimonious it may be. If I have issues with my wife, you'd better believe I'm talking about them with her rather than emptying out the house and disappearing while she's off at work. HIS CONTRACT WAS UP HE WAS FREE TO GO WHERE HE WANTED.

It doesn't make it right. He made up his mind months ago and didn't have the courtesy to say "I'm moving on after the year, so do what you can to improve the team without me being around." No, he waited until after several free agents had already signed and yet kept Cleveland hanging on the line.

To use my prior examples, I'm legally allowed to do a lot of things. It doesn't make them right; it would make me a jackass.

Baseball does have a different system my point is just now that AROD won noone is like well the way he went about it is not good enough as they are doing to Lebron. I don't feel sorry for the Cavs, I feel sorry for their fans. The NBA system rewards epic failure. The Cavs spent years making horrible picks i.e. Trajan Langdon, Diop, etc. and bad trades i.e. dealing Andre Miller for Darius Miles and lost year after year and finally won the lottery and did not screw it up only because they had the first pick and the guy the world agreed was going to be special was available. But Cavs fans are not alone. I live in New York we are the biggest market and the Knicks have stunk for a decade and besides now Amare have had noone worth watching for almost that entire time as those running the team have made bad move after bad move.

Yeah, New York has it pretty rough. It's been eight months since their last World Series win! (And 30 months since their last Super Bowl)

What you don't get in northeast Ohio are fans who split up several different ways. There aren't large numbers of people who support the Cavs, Indians, and Steelers; or the Browns, Indians, and Pacers. It's an entire area rooted in misery. There's been no titles since 1964, there's been an NFL team swiped away, an NHL team merged with another, and an owner so bad that the NBA had to create rules to prevent him from trading every first-rounder from 1979 to 2065. The idea of "the tortured New Yorkers" because of the Knicks is so laughable that I don't know where to begin with it.

[BostonSportsFan]

It would have been virually impossible for the Cavs to get under the cap, they have too many long term contracts held by players who noone else wants at those rates. Yes, a sign and trade is possible but truth be told how many free agents want to go to the Cavs even if Lebron was on the team. Twenty something, wealthy young men do not want to play in any city where there is limited nightlife. It is no coincidence that they picked Miami. Besides each other they get no State income tax and the premier nightlife scene in the USA.

The Heat roster is far from scrubs besides the big three. Haslem, Chamlers and Mike Miller are far from scrubs. Most rosters have roster filler once you get past the top seven or eight players anyway. It should be enough to get the Heat into the Finals although I do not think they have enough to beat the Lakers and Lebron will be able to watch Kobe get one for the other hand up close.

The way they handled the decision was unprofessional but his advisors are his childhood friends and young men in their mid 20s make decisions without thinking of stuff like that. David Falk or Arn Tellem would never have let a client behave that way so I think his downfall is he needs to be surrounded by more professional, experienced older advisors.

That is simply not true, check your current NBA contracts, currently Jamario Moon, Anthony Parker have expiring contracts in 2011 worth a total of 12 million, Delonte West contract expires in 2011 worth 12.5 million, JJ Hickson has a team option in 2011 worth 6.5 million. That alone puts the team at 30 million in lower salary plus they have several minimum contracts expiring in 2011. As of right now, according to an NBA cap expert, the Cavs if they did not resign all these players would have only 23 million committed in salary next season. Even if LeBron had reupped depending on the contract structure, they would have been at a minimum based on the current cap, been at least 20 million under the cap next year but as it stands they will be 35 million under.

I don't care what anyone says, even the experts agree that if you throw enough money at a player, they will go anywhere. Maybe not all will but some of them will. Gilbert seems to have very deep pockets and is willing to spend and go over the cap.

The mathmatics that are simply being tossed around are not correct, LeBron took what he felt was the easiest way out instead of giving the team another year or two to make continued strides forward simple as that.

[BostonSportsFan]

It would have been virually impossible for the Cavs to get under the cap, they have too many long term contracts held by players who noone else wants at those rates. Yes, a sign and trade is possible but truth be told how many free agents want to go to the Cavs even if Lebron was on the team. Twenty something, wealthy young men do not want to play in any city where there is limited nightlife. It is no coincidence that they picked Miami. Besides each other they get no State income tax and the premier nightlife scene in the USA.

The Heat roster is far from scrubs besides the big three. Haslem, Chamlers and Mike Miller are far from scrubs. Most rosters have roster filler once you get past the top seven or eight players anyway. It should be enough to get the Heat into the Finals although I do not think they have enough to beat the Lakers and Lebron will be able to watch Kobe get one for the other hand up close.

The way they handled the decision was unprofessional but his advisors are his childhood friends and young men in their mid 20s make decisions without thinking of stuff like that. David Falk or Arn Tellem would never have let a client behave that way so I think his downfall is he needs to be surrounded by more professional, experienced older advisors.

The other factor is that Chalmers is a complete scrub, Haslem is a barely servicable player would not start anywhere else, and Miller is a one trick pony, keep a hand in his face and he is done.

[legaleagle92481]

That is simply not true, check your current NBA contracts, currently Jamario Moon, Anthony Parker have expiring contracts in 2011 worth a total of 12 million, Delonte West contract expires in 2011 worth 12.5 million, JJ Hickson has a team option in 2011 worth 6.5 million. That alone puts the team at 30 million in lower salary plus they have several minimum contracts expiring in 2011. As of right now, according to an NBA cap expert, the Cavs if they did not resign all these players would have only 23 million committed in salary next season. Even if LeBron had reupped depending on the contract structure, they would have been at a minimum based on the current cap, been at least 20 million under the cap next year but as it stands they will be 35 million under.

I don't care what anyone says, even the experts agree that if you throw enough money at a player, they will go anywhere. Maybe not all will but some of them will. Gilbert seems to have very deep pockets and is willing to spend and go over the cap.

The mathmatics that are simply being tossed around are not correct, LeBron took what he felt was the easiest way out instead of giving the team another year or two to make continued strides forward simple as that.

Your figures are off. This upcoming season they have 49 million committed. Next year without Hickson they have 36 for only four guys. Lebron would have gotten the max which I believe for him would have been 16 something which would have put them at 65 million this year and 52 million next year with having to add several players just to meet the roster minimum. The cap this year is 58 million next year it will probably be like 60 million. The Cavs would have had no room to add anyone in either year off the open market. People said Lebron should have resigned for three years and right there two would have been spent with a roster unable to be improved much. The pay enough go anywhere idea does not work in the NBA because there is a max salary and contract length.

[legaleagle92481]

Apples to giraffes to a ceiling fan, my friend.
- Although Mike Brown's firing was a foregone conclusion, Dan Gilbert waited 11 days before making a move. Why? Because it meant that Brown would collect his entire 2010-11 salary while being unemployed. I have a difficult time imagining that someone who shows that loyalty to someone who's being shown the door wouldn't be shown to someone as popular as LeBron.
- If a player is in the decline phase of his career, very few people would have an issue with him being moved in order to get a last best shot at being a part of a championship team. No one faults Ray Bourque, who had put in 20 years with the Boston Bruins, for being moved to Colorado for a last kick. And it's really not tough to sell it so there are no hard feelings toward the player. Bernie Kosar was moved, not by his choice, and ended up winning a Super Bowl with Dallas as a backup that same year. He's still the most popular athlete in Cleveland.



Exactly, the Celtics and Magic. Rather than continue going head-to-head against those teams with his Cavaliers, he bailed out and stacked the deck.



Stockton and Marino hung around their teams as long as they could for whatever reason. So did Jeff Bagwell and Craig Biggio. So has Todd Helton. When you've played 15 years and have no team awards to show for it, you're past the "villain" point if you decide to move on. 7 years is not 15 years.

Let me ask you this. If Peyton Manning sat up after the 2004 season and said "I've put in 7 years with Indy, we can't get past New England, so I'm going to the Patriots as a backup", what would the reaction be? I know exactly what it would be, and it's pretty much exactly what we've seen with LeBron for obvious reasons.



It doesn't make it right. He made up his mind months ago and didn't have the courtesy to say "I'm moving on after the year, so do what you can to improve the team without me being around." No, he waited until after several free agents had already signed and yet kept Cleveland hanging on the line.

To use my prior examples, I'm legally allowed to do a lot of things. It doesn't make them right; it would make me a jackass.



Yeah, New York has it pretty rough. It's been eight months since their last World Series win! (And 30 months since their last Super Bowl)

What you don't get in northeast Ohio are fans who split up several different ways. There aren't large numbers of people who support the Cavs, Indians, and Steelers; or the Browns, Indians, and Pacers. It's an entire area rooted in misery. There's been no titles since 1964, there's been an NFL team swiped away, an NHL team merged with another, and an owner so bad that the NBA had to create rules to prevent him from trading every first-rounder from 1979 to 2065. The idea of "the tortured New Yorkers" because of the Knicks is so laughable that I don't know where to begin with it.

My point was not them sending him somewhere to win a ring but because he was not the same player he has been and they just felt it was time to dump him and his contract. Players decline fast in the NBA look at Penny, Francis, T Mac, Grant Hill and on and on.

The outcome of going head to head with those teams was never going to change. The Cavs simply were not as good as the Magic, Celts or Lakers barring an injury to Howard, Garnett or Kobe. The postseason results bare that out.

Peyton going to the Pats as a backup is different. The backup QB seldom plays on a Super Bowl team. Only one QB can play at a time. Lebron is starting on the Heat.

You guys have had it rough no doubt. But look around the Country. Yeah New York has the Yanks but many New Yorkers myself included do not root for them because it is like rooting for Microsoft or Apple or any major business. They in many ways buy rings. The other teams stink. The Jets and Giants moved out of State on us, so the Super Bowl belongs to NJ not NY. The Islanders, Rangers, Knicks and Mets are all medicore or terrible for years now without any real stars save David Wright and we are getting the Nets who won 12 games last year.

Other cities have similar issues. Atlanta has the Falcons, Thrashers and Hawks who have never won a title. The Thrashers lost their biggest star last year because he would not take 100 million to stay there. They also have the Braves that won 1 title in 14 straight postseasons and choked constantly.

Seattle lost their NBA team to Oklahoma of all places. They have an NFL and MLB team that has never won anything. The Mariners also lost Arod, Griffey and the Unit in a two year span and got little in return.

Washington DC has a hockey team that flops every year. A last place baseball team and a football team that has stunk for going on twenty years.

San Diego has no NBA team and a baseball and football team that have never won anything and let HOfers go i.e. Brees and soon Adrian Gonzalez.

[Nathan]

My point was not them sending him somewhere to win a ring but because he was not the same player he has been and they just felt it was time to dump him and his contract. Players decline fast in the NBA look at Penny, Francis, T Mac, Grant Hill and on and on.

The third-most reviled person in Cleveland is Bill Belichick. It's not because he's a slimeball or a cheater, it's because he dumped Bernie Kosar. There is nothing in sports more cold and callous than NFL football, and it didn't matter that Kosar was obviously on the decline. Belichick did the unforgivable: he unloaded the most popular and best player for non-injury and non-off-field reasons.

The outcome of going head to head with those teams was never going to change. The Cavs simply were not as good as the Magic, Celts or Lakers barring an injury to Howard, Garnett or Kobe. The postseason results bare that out.

Why, because as of 2010, the Cavs couldn't get past those teams? The Celtics are on the decline as their core ages and retires, the Magic are a toss-up, and the Lakers will be losing Phil Jackson soon. And given the crapshoot that the playoffs largely are, I have a real difficult time buying into the idea that "The Cavs had peaked, and that's that."

Here's the other side of that coin. Other teams had their top players recruiting free agents. Where was LeBron in all of this over the last three or four years?

Peyton going to the Pats as a backup is different. The backup QB seldom plays on a Super Bowl team. Only one QB can play at a time. Lebron is starting on the Heat.

If LeBron had been asked to come off the bench in Cleveland, he'd have gone ballistic. If he were asked to come off the bench for the Heat, would the reaction be the same? Apparently, living it up in South Beach was the real goal to be pursued (remember what he said: "I'm taking my talents to South Beach", even though the team offices are in Miami, the team is called "Miami", and the arena is in Miami).

You guys have had it rough no doubt. But look around the Country. Yeah New York has the Yanks but many New Yorkers myself included do not root for them because it is like rooting for Microsoft or Apple or any major business. They in many ways buy rings. The other teams stink. The Jets and Giants moved out of State on us, so the Super Bowl belongs to NJ not NY. The Islanders, Rangers, Knicks and Mets are all medicore or terrible for years now without any real stars save David Wright and we are getting the Nets who won 12 games last year.

Other cities have similar issues. Atlanta has the Falcons, Thrashers and Hawks who have never won a title. The Thrashers lost their biggest star last year because he would not take 100 million to stay there. They also have the Braves that won 1 title in 14 straight postseasons and choked constantly.

Seattle lost their NBA team to Oklahoma of all places. They have an NFL and MLB team that has never won anything. The Mariners also lost Arod, Griffey and the Unit in a two year span and got little in return.

Washington DC has a hockey team that flops every year. A last place baseball team and a football team that has stunk for going on twenty years.

San Diego has no NBA team and a baseball and football team that have never won anything and let HOfers go i.e. Brees and soon Adrian Gonzalez.

Every other city that has been devastated over the last 40 years by a shrinking manufacturing base, had the school system taken over, seen numerous higher-up government officials imprisoned for corruption and misconduct, had a river ignite, and be tagged nationally with a name that uses the word "mistake", come to the front of the line.

Only Detroit comes close, and that's only for non-sports issues. And they've had a recent NBA title with the Pistons, the Tigers rising up from the dead, the Red Wings winning four times in the last 13 years, and...the Lions. And Detroit did not had a native son elevate the Tigers from the depths to contention, then bail out because "it's too boring here" or whatever stupid reason could be concocted.

(Also, San Diego had the 1963 Chargers, which is one of the great teams in history that did win an AFL title.)

[BostonSportsFan]

Your figures are off. This upcoming season they have 49 million committed. Next year without Hickson they have 36 for only four guys. Lebron would have gotten the max which I believe for him would have been 16 something which would have put them at 65 million this year and 52 million next year with having to add several players just to meet the roster minimum. The cap this year is 58 million next year it will probably be like 60 million. The Cavs would have had no room to add anyone in either year off the open market. People said Lebron should have resigned for three years and right there two would have been spent with a roster unable to be improved much. The pay enough go anywhere idea does not work in the NBA because there is a max salary and contract length.

[BostonSportsFan]

I am not sure where you are getting your figures but they are way off. I will post links to several sources that were updated after the LeBron move. Your figures are not even close to what is available

[legaleagle92481]

I am not sure where you are getting your figures but they are way off. I will post links to several sources that were updated after the LeBron move. Your figures are not even close to what is available

This year:
Salary cap is 58 million. Currently under contract is:

Jamison 13.3 Million
Mo Williams 9.3 Mil
Varejo-7 Mil
Gibson-4 mil.
Moon-3 mil
Parker-2.8 mil.
Telfair-2.7 mil
Hickson-1.5 Mil.
Powe-915,000
Williams-1 mil.

Non guarenteed
West-4.5 mil.-500k guarenteed if cut.
Green-762,000

Next year
Jamison-15 mil.
Mo Williams 8.5 mil.
Varejo-7.7 Mil.
Gibson 4.4 mil.

[legaleagle92481]

The third-most reviled person in Cleveland is Bill Belichick. It's not because he's a slimeball or a cheater, it's because he dumped Bernie Kosar. There is nothing in sports more cold and callous than NFL football, and it didn't matter that Kosar was obviously on the decline. Belichick did the unforgivable: he unloaded the most popular and best player for non-injury and non-off-field reasons.



Why, because as of 2010, the Cavs couldn't get past those teams? The Celtics are on the decline as their core ages and retires, the Magic are a toss-up, and the Lakers will be losing Phil Jackson soon. And given the crapshoot that the playoffs largely are, I have a real difficult time buying into the idea that "The Cavs had peaked, and that's that."

Here's the other side of that coin. Other teams had their top players recruiting free agents. Where was LeBron in all of this over the last three or four years?



If LeBron had been asked to come off the bench in Cleveland, he'd have gone ballistic. If he were asked to come off the bench for the Heat, would the reaction be the same? Apparently, living it up in South Beach was the real goal to be pursued (remember what he said: "I'm taking my talents to South Beach", even though the team offices are in Miami, the team is called "Miami", and the arena is in Miami).



Every other city that has been devastated over the last 40 years by a shrinking manufacturing base, had the school system taken over, seen numerous higher-up government officials imprisoned for corruption and misconduct, had a river ignite, and be tagged nationally with a name that uses the word "mistake", come to the front of the line.

Only Detroit comes close, and that's only for non-sports issues. And they've had a recent NBA title with the Pistons, the Tigers rising up from the dead, the Red Wings winning four times in the last 13 years, and...the Lions. And Detroit did not had a native son elevate the Tigers from the depths to contention, then bail out because "it's too boring here" or whatever stupid reason could be concocted.

(Also, San Diego had the 1963 Chargers, which is one of the great teams in history that did win an AFL title.)

In the past couple of years what major free agent has hit the market before this summer that Lebron could have recruited? By my count no major free agent has switched teams in the past three-four years before this summer.

The other cities I mentioned all have their own major non-sports issues as well.

The Browns had a more recent title than the Chargers as they won in 1964 and best NFL player ever in Jim Brown.

Buffalo is another example. The Bills lost four straight super bowls and a stanley cup final. They had Scott Norwood, the Hull goal that beat the Sabres in the Finals. The City has never won a title and the Bills play some of their home games in Canada.

And New York fans have endured alot of sports heartache as well. The Dodgers and Giants left us. The Jets and football Giants left us. O'Malley the man responsible for the Dodgers leaving made the HOF at least Moddell has not yet made it. The Mets traded Tom Seaver in his prime and Nolan Ryan before his prime. The Nets when they were here traded Dr. J in his prime.