Big Mac staying home in 2007?

[sportscentury]

The only way I see a voter not voting him in is if theres hard core evidence that proves he infact did take steriods.

Carlie,

I know you're a big McGwire fan, but you should know that many (not just a few) of the baseball writers who have votes have already gone on the record stating that they will never vote for McGwire. I'll be blown away (absolutely flabbergasted) if he gets in this year ... and I would not be too surprised if he does not get in at all (though I'll bet he gets in eventually). I'm not trying to argue with you; but you should prepare yourself for a long road.

Reid

[cjmedina1]

Reid
Thanks.I have a feeling its going to be a real long road.Sign me up for your emails that you send out.Thanks again Reid chat later.
Carlie Medina III
carliemedinaiii@sbcglobal.net

[sportscentury]

Reid
Thanks.I have a feeling its going to be a real long road.Sign me up for your emails that you send out.Thanks again Reid chat later.
Carlie Medina III
carliemedinaiii@sbcglobal.net

Carlie,

Thanks. These days, I don't send out my list unless someone requests it. I'll be happy to forward it to you. I have been planning to post the list on GUF for a while, but I haven't gotten around to it. It is substantially different from when I first posted it several months back.

Best,
Reid

[metsbats]

I had the "great honor" of meeting McGwire in 1997 spring training and was hoping to get his auto . Didn't even come close to getting his signature , McGwire was a joke , all he would do is walk around and grunt like a cave man . You could see and feel his anger built up inside himself . Not to mention the acne scars on his face , which is usually a tell tale sign of steroids use. Maybe he was having a bad day ????

I read that "anger" is a side effect of steroids.

"Rage, anger, flying off the handle, uncontrollable, unconsolable, and weight gain. "

Perhaps that would explain the grunting like a cave man too.

-David

[Nathan]

I can only hope that with the amount of information on steroids available everywhere that people can do a bit more research before posting here.

First off, acne scars are NOT a telltale sign of anything except that someone once had acne (probably as a teenager) and was impatient in getting rid of it. The three guys I know with the worst acne scars are hardly on steroids; one had a hormonal imbalance that caused an unusual amount of acne, the other would use a straight-edge razor to cut acne off his face (gross, I know), and the third has a skin condition in which heat can cause the re-emergence of faded acne scars.

Acne in unusual places and concentrations is a better sign. Most men suffer sizable drops in the amount of testosterone between age 25-35, which is why so few men of that age or older have anything resembling acne. Believe me, I've seen quite a few heavy steroid users (as in I actually know they use them)...we're talking men in their late 30s and older who have enormous patches of acne in strange places (back of the shoulders are a good place, but far from the only place).

Rage and anger hardly are telltale signs of steroid use. Bizarre mood swings in the absence of other mental issues (i.e. Mike Tyson) are a better indicator, but just take a look at some of the people involved in road rage incidents and think "Oh yeah, that guy's probably hanging out with Ben Johnson".

Mr. Smachetti,

Anabolic steroids are synthetic testosterone, but the BALCO investigation has focused on much more than simply steroids. Anyone want to take a guess as to where Clomid comes from? (HINT: it's pretty bizarre, and if anyone using it knew where it came from they'd never do it again)

[camarokids]

Did you all have a bad day ? Trying to bite off my ass here or what , some of you out there need to lighten up ! I do believe I said "usually a tell tale sign" ! I am referring to muscle bound people here ! I was merely making a comment on my observation of watching the over-paid idiot for two hours , wasn't claiming to know a lot about steroids , nor care to ! Anger , rage , moody or mad , who cares , no matter how you describe it , he did not look HAPPY ! Why don't you completely read someone's post and research it word for word before posting around here !!!!! Have you ever lifted a weight before or even been inside a gym . At the gym's I have been to and frequently worked out at over the years , I have seen quite a few muscle bound guys with scars on their backs and face . Acne scars can be from teenage years , NO SH*T , but when you see a lot of these guys with their shirts off and theres the scars , I think thats where I got the USUALLY from . I have even had friends who admitted to have taken the crap and have seen their backs . So quit trying to act all smart and trying to put someone else down , go kick your dog .

[mr.miracle]

Unless some type of significant evidence comes out one way or the other prior to the deadline at the end of the year for HOF voter ballots, it appears clear based on current writer informal poll results that Big Mac won't need to pack his bags for a trip to Cooperstown this year if at all. Reid is right, it appears fairly obvious that voters will not vote for him perhaps to make a statement who knows. My problem despite the fact that virtually everyone believes that McGwire took some type of PED's at some point in his career is that we simply have no proof that he took anything that was illegal at the time either outlawed by MLB or the Federal Government or both. As I stated in an earlier post, how can we use that type of logic on McGwire and keep him out of Cooperstown when there are certainly other players that used PED's during the past 15 plus years that we also have suspicions about? Do we keep them all out because we have our suspicions? Simply on numbers alone it sounds completely absurd that we would even consider not voting for Barry Bonds with 7 MVP's and 720 plus homers. If no conclusive proof is ever found that Bonds took PED's then how can he not be voted into the HOF simply due to someone's suspicions.

This is just a very, very slippery slope. Is anyone ultimately safe if somebody decides to name an athlete in a book or to a reporter etc. as being a possible steroid/HGH user then is that players career irreparabibly ruined due to this happening?

I agree that if anyone is found conclusively to have taken steroids or PED's of some sort, then they should not be voted into the HOF and most likely never will be. However going on suspicions alone probably will not cut it. Johnny Bench was on ESPN radio last week and was asked directly about this issue. Unlike the vast majority of current HOF members who seem pretty adament about not having any cheaters in the HOF, Bench echoed these sentiments that unless someone is conclusively proven to have used PED's of some sort, it is simply irresponsible to not vote for that person on suspicions alone.

While I too agree that players like Ripken and Gwynn who are absolutely class acts should probably have the stage by themselves next year and certainly not have a complete circus atmosphere in Cooperstown if McGwire is elected due to the steroid questions and allegations that are bound to be present, at this point, I am just not sure how you cannot vote McGwire into the HOF at some point unless more conslusive evidence comes to light.

As a previous poster said, McGwire had 49 homers his rookie year in 1987 and looked more like Dave Kingman in terms of build at that point. Unless he was juicing in 87 which is highly unlikely due to his build at that point, it is not much of a stretch to suggest that going from 49 homers as a rookie to 70 at some point in ones career is possible. McGwire never had this hugh spike in homers as he averaged 50 plus in the years leading up to 70. Meanwhile, Bonds went from low to mid 40's up to 73 in one season which seems more than a little odd. Of course what is more odd than Brady Anderson going from 16 to 50 homers in one season and never having more than 24 total in a season after that? Makes one question those couple of years as well. There are just too many unanswered questions for the past 15 plus years. I will be very, very curious what will happen as players like Bonds, Sosa, Palmeiro, Giambi, McGwire all come up for consideration over the next year to 6 or 7 years down the road.

Brett

[Nathan]

Did you all have a bad day ? Trying to bite off my ass here or what , some of you out there need to lighten up ! I do believe I said "usually a tell tale sign" ! I am referring to muscle bound people here ! I was merely making a comment on my observation of watching the over-paid idiot for two hours , wasn't claiming to know a lot about steroids , nor care to ! Anger , rage , moody or mad , who cares , no matter how you describe it , he did not look HAPPY ! Why don't you completely read someone's post and research it word for word before posting around here !!!!! Have you ever lifted a weight before or even been inside a gym . At the gym's I have been to and frequently worked out at over the years , I have seen quite a few muscle bound guys with scars on their backs and face . Acne scars can be from teenage years , NO SH*T , but when you see a lot of these guys with their shirts off and theres the scars , I think thats where I got the USUALLY from . I have even had friends who admitted to have taken the crap and have seen their backs . So quit trying to act all smart and trying to put someone else down , go kick your dog .

No, I didn't have a bad day. Why do you ask?

I need to lighten up...yet reading your response I can practically see steam pouring from your ears. Are you the pot or the kettle?

McGwire doesn't look happy, and that's evidence for steroid use....reading your response (which indicates anger), I therefore can infer your own excessive steroid use, right?

Not to mention the acne scars on his face , which is usually a tell tale sign of steroids use.

Silly me, I must have missed that place where you "obviously" only referred to back acne scars being a sign of steroid use. Maybe I can re-read that and find it....nope, still can't. How about now? Hang on....nope, not there. Silly me, I must be going blind.

Let's see here...I played varsity sports and worked out with Division 1 athletes in college, and my field of study is exercise science. Nope, I've never lifted weights and never been inside a gym before. Please tell me more about this mysterious place I'm completely unfamiliar with.

I'll quit trying to act all smart when I have no clue what I'm talking about. And as for my dog, he's laying at my feet resting calmly. I think you could learn a lesson from him.

[earlywynnfan]

Am I the only one who doesn't consider him a true HOFer WITHOUT even counting the steriods/supplements issues???

I mean, sure, he hit a lot of home runs, but what else did he do? I know '98 was exciting, but '91 was painful!

Perhaps I'm the only one who wants more than just one dimension from a HOF player?

Ken

[JimCaravello]

Ken - I agree with you 100%. I would put Santo, Oliva, Hodges, Dawson and even Mattingly in before McGwire ever even sniffed the place.........Jim