Bats that don't match factory records

[MSpecht]

Re: Bats that don't match factory records

Hi Sammy --

The majority of post-1943 H & B bats without model numbers on the knob (through 1979) or on the barrel (post-1979) are found as individual player post-1975 World Series and All-Star bats. Another large group of numberless H & B professional bats were produced during a factory strike in 1974 (with otherwise appropriate 1973-1975 labeling.)

Many collectors are uncomfortable collecting an H & B pro model bat without a number. The bat could be a a commemorative or souvenir bat,a retail bat (possibly with a sanded knob), or, yes, a pro bat that 'missed' quality control.

Are you able to match the bat to a known H & B model, then to the factory records of the player whose name is stamped on the barrel? If so, remember that model numbers, although a key item in professional model bats, are still only one factor by which authenticity may be judged. Do the use characteristics match a known pattern of use for the specific player? I would be more concerned about a superstar or HOF bat with no model number, as the potential for 'alteration' is much greater.

Good Luck. Any additional information or pictures would be helpful to the forum.

Mike Jackitout7@aol.com

[jboosted92]

Re: Bats that don't match factory records

Hi Sammy --

The majority of post-1943 H & B bats without model numbers on the knob (through 1979) or on the barrel (post-1979) are found as individual player post-1975 World Series and All-Star bats. Another large group of numberless H & B professional bats were produced during a factory strike in 1974 (with otherwise appropriate 1973-1975 labeling.)

Many collectors are uncomfortable collecting an H & B pro model bat without a number. The bat could be a a commemorative or souvenir bat,a retail bat (possibly with a sanded knob), or, yes, a pro bat that 'missed' quality control.

Are you able to match the bat to a known H & B model, then to the factory records of the player whose name is stamped on the barrel? If so, remember that model numbers, although a key item in professional model bats, are still only one factor by which authenticity may be judged. Do the use characteristics match a known pattern of use for the specific player? I would be more concerned about a superstar or HOF bat with no model number, as the potential for 'alteration' is much greater.

Good Luck. Any additional information or pictures would be helpful to the forum.

Mike Jackitout7@aol.com

I think the alteration peice is key, if the can be deemed "unaltered", your probably ok.

A follow-up question (related/unrelated).. Could Pro-players order LS bats anywhere else, other than DIRECTLY through Hillerich&Bradsby L.S.

Meaning, a local sports shop, that would order them FOR the player... (thinking pre-1940s)

[scottanservitz]

Re: Bats that don't match factory records

I've been reading all the posts on this topic and mulling over the excellent information that everyone has been adding. To me, the matching factory records are the first step to me in buying a true gamer. The next steps are what Jim lists as his "musts" to be comfortable in a bat to buy. Are there instances where a bat may have been used that don't match factory specs.? Sure. But when you are talking about a HOF bat, I really can't be comfortable unless the bat does match. Losing sleep has been mentioned, even in jest, but I have lost sleep because I had in my bat case bats that weren't what I thought they were. I wasn't happy about it, but I learned from it. I corrected the problems at a monetary loss. But when it was all said and done, I felt much more comfortable with my collection. This site has done wonders for me personally in my collecting endeavors. Without it and the information it has made available to all of us I probably wouldn't be in this hobby. Would anybody buy a classic automobile that has a replacement motor? Sure, but the true collector would want an original motor. I see that same scenario here. If you just want to have a bat with that HOF name on the barrel, that is fine. But if you want a HOF bat that the name on the barrel probably used, then it should match the records in my opinion. Thanks for listening.
Scott

[jboosted92]

Re: Bats that don't match factory records

do you guys consider "photos" documented gamers?

for instance if there was a pic of Ruth with a Spalding bat? And you have a ruth spalding pro-model bat?

this can be argumentative...just curious on YOUR guys opinoin

[DGRROSEN]

Re: Bats that don't match factory records

I found all of the information in this thread to be very useful. I recently got Mo Vaughn's LS bat records and proceeded to try to match my bats to the bat records. 11 of the 12 bats matched. The last bat was labled from the 1986-1989 period. Mo was in the minor leagues from 1989 to 1991. The records did not have any orders in 1989 that matched the specs of the 12th bat and I concluded that it was ommitted from the records. Later on I was reviewing info from Vince's "Bats" book about bats labled from the 1986-1989 period. The book stated that bats from the 1986-1989 period were used by players on some minor league teams until 1994. I checked the orders for 1991 and found that the Red Sox AAA team had ordered bats for Mo with specs that matched the 12th bat.

[nate]

Re: Bats that don't match factory records

Mike,

I feel your pain. I also lost out on the Musial.....tried placing a higher bid....auction ended.....ugh.

Nate

[Birdbats]

Re: Bats that don't match factory records

Mike,

I feel your pain. I also lost out on the Musial.....tried placing a higher bid....auction ended.....ugh.

Nate

Nate,

Don't feel bad... that bat dated to the 1964 season, a year after Musial retired. You can tell by the version of "Powerized," which debuted during the 1964 season. According to his records, Stan ordered 51 bats from 1964-66. All were 34.5". His three orders in 1964 (30 bats) were 31 ounces, identical to his gamers. So, while it was a perfect match to factory records, it would not be considered a true gamer since it was produced after Stan retired.

Jeff

http://www.birdbats.com