6 charged with fraud

[cubbs1232]

So now we've resorted to making fun of other posters who are merely stating their opinion. Even if you don't like what the other poster has said it is that of an opinion which is entitled to everyone on this board. We are all collectors on all different levels, with all different views on things. Just because someone else's opinion doesn't match yours, doesn't give you the right to make fun.

Just my 2 cents ...

Where exactly did I make fun of someone?

[masp3392]

Where exactly did I make fun of someone?

your message was obviously geared towards those who regardless of what happens will stick with buying JO jerseys and/or care about photomatching being the standard that everyone should follow regardless or price or reputation.

just interpreting what I read, if it isn't your intention, i apologize but definitly sounded like your poking fun at others who feel differently

[Jules9]

I understand everyone saying I found a photo match so I know the jersey is good but what if some of the wear on the matched jersey has been manufactured or "enhanced" on the jersey to make it stand out better. If you question wear from a jersey to a photo you can always say that it looks different because of the lighting differences of when the photo was taken.

Also if there is wear on a jersey that can't be photo matched but other marks can be matched, how do you know if it is legit wear.

If all these allegations turn out to be true, then you truly have to question any JO jersey whether it's photo matched or not.

Do I think they may have added wear to every jersey, no, but it does cast some doubt onto their jerseys if true.

Now let me go inspect my JO jersey a little better.

[xpress34]

Gotta love how words get twisted and turned on here from the other side...
So know where comparing this to a standard jacket ran off an assembly line? LOL, to all the jacket collectors out there good luck. And by the way there are small inconsistencies in tags and design when you compare a real piece compared to a fake piece, whether it be sunglasses,watch,designer accessories like that, so in actuality yeah its basically the same concept to photo matching, you are comparing real to fake by seeing it in person next to each other or pics of know legit samples compared to Asian knock offs. Wow you people like to go in circles, and the results are still the same... No actual proof or knowledge of what,when and where happened, but are still willing to be the corner stone of being part of the group that tries to bring an innocent until proven guilty company to its knees! I hope you will all be able to sleep at night on your pillow of doubt??? Know one here know the truth accept J.O, so until that comes out from him or the court, why don't we stop ASS-uming and wait to see what happens instead of speculating and hurting this companies rep... Deer eating popcorn! whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty?

Pale -

Apparently you either don't understand or are closing your eyes to the fact that JO was charged with a Criminal Information.

That means that instead of making the Prosecutor take him to a Grand Jury and prove that he did something wrong, he IS making a Plea Agreement with the Prosecution because he has already admitted to them that they have more than enough to get an Indictment in front of a Grand Jury.

Innocent until proven Guilty has NO bearing here. They have ADMITTED some type of wrong doing to the Prosecutors based on the information at hand.

This isn't 'twisting' anything... this is a statement of FACT based on the information that has been published if you actually cared to read it.

And as far as an assembly line? How do you think even game worn jerseys are made? Do you think they are each hand sewn and such?

No, they make the jerseys in bulk to the player specs.

But I digress.

All I know is JO and others (4 of the 6) are making pleas. Only 2 of the 6 are forcing a Grand Jury hearing meaning those 2 (and JO is NOT one of them) don't believe the prosecutors have enough to get an Indictment.

- Smitty

P.S. As a Disabled Vet and former Loss Prevention Officer, I sleep MUCH better at night when I know that frauds and crooks are getting busted. The fact they are making a plea leaves NO DOUBT in my mind. This is a Federal Charge, not someone on GUU claiming they are getting screwed.

[xpress34]

And as far as an assembly line? How do you think even game worn jerseys are made? Do you think they are each hand sewn and such?

No, they make the jerseys in bulk to the player specs.

But I digress.

Oh, BTW - for those that think I don't know what I'm talking about here, I also use to work for both NIKE and RAWLINGS and I'm pretty certain that Uniform Manufacturing hasn't changed much since 2007.

Smitty

[solarlottry]

This post is also off-topic but it seems as if the thread is moving into the Love-JO/Hate-JO realm rather than focusing on the matter at hand.

I agree with Mark 100%.

I have been trying to match some of my older 49er gamers and it is NOT EASY! Even with knowing what game the shirt was worn, having the shirt in hand and watching the dvd, it still is tough to come up with a match on some shirts.

Take, for instance, the 1994 William Floyd rookie gamer I have that was worn vs the Raiders. It was his first regular season game and he only had 2 carries for 8 yards and no catches. He did play on special teams though but obtaining a clear image of him during the game that will allow me to photo-match his jersey is tough. Plus with the lack of snaps the jersey is fairly clean. A style match is not tough though.

Knowing these facts should I not purchase the jersey because it lacks a definitive photo-match? It has an authentic team letter, is style matched and has the equipment managers tape on the nameplate. For me that is more than enough to be comfortable with the purchase. Obviously a definitive photo-match would be great on my entire collection but it is not realistic.

If I had to have a photo-match for all of the vintage 49er gamers in my collection I would not own many of the ones I have. I think taking into account all of the factors that Mark mentioned surrounding a jersey, should help make or break a purchase.

With regards to the original thread I think it is problematic that JO is caught up in all of this. To me it makes no difference when the alleged acts occurred and whether or not their team items are authentic or not. It is the fact that he allowed himself and his reputation to get caught up in something like this that is troubling. Jarod knows this business well so one would hope that he knows who he is dealing with and what they are selling.

With team and player deals in place it is Jarod's duty to be absolutely transparent as any discretion can tarnish his reputation and put the deals at risk. Evidently he may not have done this although once the facts are made public, this may change.

Whenever I dealt with JO I dealt with Robert and he has always done right by me so i will reserve any other comments until Jarod's statement and the investigation is complete.

Always buying 49er gamers!
Paul
garciajones@yahoo.com

[dcgreg25]

The dialogue in this thread is critically important and of interest to just about every one of the members of GUU. However, I would ask that everyone try to limit their posts to comments that could be construed as helpful/useful to others.

I think the majority of the regular members have chimed in with an opinion and some very compelling points have been made on various sides of the issue, many of which I had not considered.

Unfortunately, some of the recent posts have veered towards arguing for the sake of arguing. As a collector, and a moderator, I am interested in useful content not who is right or wrong in an arguement. I have no problems with disagreement that brings new insight to a situation. However, further posts made to just "stir things up" will be deleted as they are not helpful to anyone.

[David]

Those collectors who chose to buy from dealers they know to have cheated or faked shall thus lose the right to complain in the future about all the crooked sellers in the hobby. Because it is they, those collectors, who keep the crooked dealers in business. They are financial enablers.

[David]

I also don't understand the logic, rather morals, of collectors who buy from dealers who they know cheat others, "as long as they don't cheat me." Do you call 911 when you see a someone burglarizing your neighbor's house, or do you save the phone call for only when yours is broken into?

Lastly, if you buy from a company you know has cheated and you know the hobby knows has cheated. do you disclose this provenance at sale or do you suppress it? Is hiding this provenance to preserve your sell price ethical? Is it legal?

[masp3392]

I also don't understand the logic, rather morals, of collectors who buy from dealers who they know cheat others, "as long as they don't cheat me." Do you call 911 when you see a someone burglarizing your neighbor's house, or do you save the phone call for only when yours is broken into?

Lastly, if you buy from a company you know has cheated and you know the hobby knows has cheated. do you disclose this provenance at sale or do you suppress it? Is hiding this provenance to preserve your sell price ethical? Is it legal?

Im personally not saying im ok with JO cheating other people. My position is yes, i'll continue to buy from JO because I myself have purchased items that are photomatched and ive done my homework on, and im 100% satisfactory in these purchases. The point is regardless of reputation wether its good or bad, people need to do there homework as a safety net.

1) yes i agree, when you pay that much money for something you should not have to sweat wether its legit or not.

2) yes i agree, that a company who does remotely any fraudulant business is in fact immoral and should be punished to the extent of the law. (Lets wait and see what comes out first to judge)

3) I still maintain that w/e purchase should be examined if you have any doubts about it whatsoever. If i get a eerie sense on any jersey not being up to par, i simply dont spend the $$$, i dont take it a chance on it.