Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jersey

[trsent]

From eBay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=221283205038

Title: "Kobe Bryant Signed Game Worn 1996-1997 Rookie Jersey! D.C. Sports LOA!!"

"You are looking at the holy grail of Kobe Bryant jerseys! This is his game worn 1996-1997 home rookie Los Angeles Lakers jersey! It is a size 44 body length plus 4 inches! Kobe only wore champion manufactured jerseys his rookie year! The front of the jersey has the proper gold NBA logo and has some signatures of some of the LA Lakers from that season including Shaquille O'Neal. The signatures are faded but not a big deal, the main thing is this is a True Kobe Bryant Rookie Game Worn Jersey!"

So, I see this jersey, which you can see the pictures of the listed eBay jersey below:













I cropped the D. C. Sports Letter of Authenticity from the original listing so it is easy to read. As you can see in this letter, Dan Ceniceros states:

"The above mentioned jersey shows accurate wear and was obtained by an impeccable source inside the NBA who has access to player before, during and after games."

Later the letter reads: "The jersey is concurrent with the examples we have in our library and it is our belief that this jersey is a one hundred percent authentic Los Angeles Lakers Kobe Bryant 1996-1997 Signed Game Worn Rookie Home Jersey."

The letter of authenticity is then signed by Dan Ceniceros, Owner of D. C. Sports Collectibles.

Looks like a pretty neat jersey with faded autographed by various Los Angeles Lakers on the front of the jersey. It also has a nice autograph that appears to be Kobe Bryant's autograph on the #8 on the back of the jersey.

Now, let's take a look at another eBay listing that was ended early by the seller - eBay Item #271252678611 - http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=271252678611


The title: "Kobe Bryant 1996/97 ROOKIE Los Angeles Lakers Un-Used Pro-Cut Game Issued Jersey"

The description:

"Kobe Bryant #8 1996/1997 Los Angeles Lakers ROOKIE SEASON Pro-Cut / Un-Used/Worn Game Issued Home Jersey. Champion Jersey. Size 44. "Designed & Tailored Exclusively for Los Angeles Lakers BODY LENGTH +4" tag. 1996/1997 NBAS 50th Anniversary gold logo. MADE IN USA. 100% NYLON. All letters and numbers are sewn on. NOT GAME-USED. Like NEW condition. This was a blank Los Angeles game issued jersey that was purchased and lettered to the exact specifications of the NBA team as "BRYANT 8". This jersey was autographed by several members of the 1996/1997 Los Angeles Lakers and have faded off over time, I can make out Shaquille O'Neal and Robert Horry. They are very faint but can still be seen. Jersey measures 22 inches from armpit to armpit, and 35 inches from top of back of neck to bottom."

Take a look at the text I enlarged and highlighted in red in the original eBay description.

I will continue this discussion in the next post as I need to add more pictures from the original eBay listing which will begin the next post in this discussion.

[trsent]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jers



















All images from original eBay Listing #271252678611.

So, I contact the seller from the game used jersey on eBay with the following question: "Dear jerseyking55,

Are you sure this is a true rookie Kobe game worn jersey? It looks identical to the Kobe jersey sold two months ago in eBay item #271252678611 that was sold as a blank pro-cut that was professionally lettered."

I receive the following reply shortly after: "Yes, The jersey is sourced from DC Sports as you can see from the LOA"

So, the seller of this jersey doesn't believe the jersey to be altered or that the jersey listed original in eBay Listing #271252678611 is the same jersey. I tell you what - It is 100% the same exact jersey with the faded autographs on the front and the air-holes match perfectly if you match the two jerseys up from each listing.

Then I submit the autograph on the back of the jersey to PSA/DNA for a Quick Opinion and it comes back not authentic!

Finally, I communicate with the original seller of the jersey selling it as a pro-cut and he told me that he sold the jersey to Mark Montero in August and Mark told him that he sold the jersey to Ryan Covell of Florida as a pro-cut jersey. The seller of the game used jersey on eBay is located in Orlando, FL.

There is a lot of explaining to do here about this jersey as how it has a letter stating it is a game used Kobe Bryant Rookie game worn jersey now with a questionable autograph is a major concern for the integrity of the industry and the hobby as a whole.

I hope these questions are addressed and answered on this forum.

[trsent]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with DC Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jersey

So a time frame is set, the original auction selling this jersey as a pro-cut was ended on eBay August 4th, 2013 while the jersey was listed as a game used autographed jersey with a letter of authenticity on September 14th, 2013.

That means in about a 40 day time frame this jersey went from Milwaukee, who states they shipped it to Louisiana, to where they state it was shipped to Florida and somewhere during this time the jersey was supposedly autographed by Kobe Bryant and it was authenticated as game used by an authenticator in California.

[sportscentury]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jers

Thanks for sharing -- very interesting. Dan, Mark and Ryan are all registered GUU members, so perhaps they can chime in here and offer their thoughts/insights.

[mickeymbz]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jers

The seller of the rook on ebay, i believe ,was not trying to pull a fast one. he truly believed it was the real mccoy,,, the shady part lies in mark montero aka mmontes.,,,, he knowing traded the bogus rook as a game worn to ryan for a genuine 95-96 bulls rodman shirt. He is the purchaser from MSauctions cuz he lives in Louisiana. This aint the first time this clown has pulled a fast one,,, in fact thats 2 now in a month thats been posted on this site. will you still gotta love his dream team jordan with tackle twill numbers..after all he did "pay a lot for it".

[mickeymbz]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jers

Montero comes off as some kinda expert on NBA stuff,, and he uses whatever stature he thinks he has from this site,,, others have been banned for knowingly selling and altering items as game used when they are not,,, time this bozo goes before more collectors are scammed.

[trsent]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jers

The seller of the rook on ebay, i believe ,was not trying to pull a fast one. he truly believed it was the real mccoy,,, the shady part lies in mark montero aka mmontes.,,,, he knowing traded the bogus rook as a game worn to ryan for a genuine 95-96 bulls rodman shirt. He is the purchaser from MSauctions cuz he lives in Louisiana. This aint the first time this clown has pulled a fast one,,, in fact thats 2 now in a month thats been posted on this site. will you still gotta love his dream team jordan with tackle twill numbers..after all he did "pay a lot for it".

Montero comes off as some kinda expert on NBA stuff,, and he uses whatever stature he thinks he has from this site,,, others have been banned for knowingly selling and altering items as game used when they are not,,, time this bozo goes before more collectors are scammed.

I think you are making an assumption here and that isn't fair.

I do not know for fact who made the decision to add a questionable autograph and have the jersey certified as game used. Rumblings I have overheard seem to lead in a different direction but I am not posting on anyone else's behalf - All three people who were mentioned in my original posts are members of this forum, and they should log in and comment on the situation that is a black eye for the industry.

Mark is mmonte4 and he has over 250 posts on this forum the last being late in September this year.

Ryan is ryanjerseyb and he has never posted but he is shown as a registered member for about a year now.

Dan is DConLA and he has over 150 posts on here the last being at the end of August this year.

All three are active members and I assume all three are aware of this discussion. The listing was ended on eBay by the seller early Friday morning just hours after this discussion was started.

It would be nice to hear from these three to help save some face of the situation.

[mickeymbz]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jers

250 posts so..? lotta collectors with great collections don't post. .. you yourself tracked the movement.. from ms to LA... I know ryan,, he got scammed. assumption, maybe... but a damn good one

[mickeymbz]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jers

yeah agreed,.,, let em speak.

[trsent]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jers

250 posts so..? lotta collectors with great collections don't post. .. you yourself tracked the movement.. from ms to LA... I know ryan,, he got scammed. assumption, maybe... but a damn good one

I post how many posts they have made to show they have been active on the forum so there is no excuse not to join in and explain.

As for your aassumptions that is not fair to anyone in this discussion. I wonder if Ryan is the innocent victim here why he wouldn't look at the original listing that I emailed him and understand there is something wrong and he should investigate it and not try to stand behind a letter for a jersey that undoubtedly is not what he was advertising selling.

[mickeymbz]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jers

[quote=trsent;337321]I post how many posts they have made to show they have been active on the forum so there is no excuse not to join in and explain.

As for your aassumptions that is not fair to anyone in this discussion. I wonder if Ryan is the innocent victim here why he wouldn't look at the original listing that I emailed him and understand there is something wrong and he should investigate it and not try to stand behind a letter for a jersey that undoubtedly is not what he was advertising selling

it has a letter from a respected authenticator.. so he assumed its authentic. the doosh with 250+ posts bought it as an issue..trading it as used.. so who's assuming now?

[trsent]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jers

it has a letter from a respected authenticator.. so he assumed its authentic. the doosh with 250+ posts bought it as an issue..trading it as used.. so who's assuming now?

Mick Wong, you are friends with Ryan, why don't you contact him and ask him for details. How do you know Mark traded it as used? Where do you get that information? I don't know how Mark sold it and neither do you. Please do not make speculations - Let's have the parties involved comment on the situation.

As for having a letter from a respected authenticator- That is no excuse - I emailed him an eBay listing for the same identical jersey being sold as a customized pro-cut. Instead of standing behind a letter he should have taken the time to look at what I presented to him and then make a decision. Instead he used a letter to defend his item as authentic even though I clearly showed it to him as not being authentic.

You mentioned a Rodman jersey before which makes me think you are posting using information from talking to someone - Maybe your friend Ryan? No where was a Rodman jersey mentioned in these threads. Please tell us how you know what trade was made and please do not post for other people unless you disclose such.

This is a very serious situation and you making assumptions without all the facts is going to hurt the concerns of a game used industry.

Before you continue, please advise about the Rodman jersey - Sure looks like you are posting for your friend, Ryan. That is an assumption I can make from your comments about a trade.

[mickeymbz]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with D. C. Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jers

Mick Wong, you are friends with Ryan, why don't you contact him and ask him for details. How do you know Mark traded it as used? Where do you get that information? I don't know how Mark sold it and neither do you. Please do not make speculations - Let's have the parties involved comment on the situation.

As for having a letter from a respected authenticator- That is no excuse - I emailed him an eBay listing for the same identical jersey being sold as a customized pro-cut. Instead of standing behind a letter he should have taken the time to look at what I presented to him and then make a decision. Instead he used a letter to defend his item as authentic even though I clearly showed it to him as not being authentic.

You mentioned a Rodman jersey before which makes me think you are posting using information from talking to someone - Maybe your friend Ryan? No where was a Rodman jersey mentioned in these threads. Please tell us how you know what trade was made and please do not post for other people unless you disclose such.

This is a very serious situation and you making assumptions without all the facts is going to hurt the concerns of a game used industry.

Before you continue, please advise about the Rodman jersey - Sure looks like you are posting for your friend, Ryan. That is an assumption I can make from your comments about a trade.

JOE alpert...your use of first and last name is condescending and annoying as posted by many in the past... your ASSumption that we are friends is an assumption,,when you just posted not to assume ..he is an acquaintance whose contacted me in the past with questions.

mick wong
President/ owner of another dude that sells stuff on eBay

[trsent]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with DC Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jersey

250 posts so..? lotta collectors with great collections don't post. .. you yourself tracked the movement.. from ms to LA... I know ryan,, he got scammed. assumption, maybe... but a damn good one

JOE alpert...your use of first and last name is condescending and annoying as posted by many in the past... your ASSumption that we are friends is an assumption,,when you just posted not to assume ..he is an acquaintance whose contacted me in the past with questions.

mick wong
President/ owner of another dude that sells stuff on eBay

I sign my name to every post so people know who is posting - I don't hide behind a user name. Sorry if you don't like that I use my name in every post so everyone clearly sees who is making a post.

In the first post I highlighted above you stated that you know Ryan - So, if you wish to continue to speculate in this thread, why don't you explain how you know someone traded a Rodman jersey as you clearly stated above?

That would help clear up your motives accusing Mark of fraud when there is no proof of this. Otherwise, please do not contribute until you explain yourself of how you know what items were traded for in this deal.

It makes it look as if you have information that has not been revealed in this thread so you really need to disclose how you know this information otherwise it appears you have an agenda that isn't for the best of the industry.

[mickeymbz]

Re: Altered Kobe Bryant Pro-Cut Jersey Being Advertised on eBay with DC Sports LOA as Game Used Rookie Jersey

I sign my name to every post so people know who is posting - I don't hide behind a user name. Sorry if you don't like that I use my name in every post so everyone clearly sees who is making a post.

In the first post I highlighted above you stated that you know Ryan - So, if you wish to continue to speculate in this thread, why don't you explain how you know someone traded a Rodman jersey as you clearly stated above?

That would help clear up your motives accusing Mark of fraud when there is no proof of this. Otherwise, please do not contribute until you explain yourself of how you know what items were traded for in this deal.

It makes it look as if you have information that has not been revealed in this thread so you really need to disclose how you know this information otherwise it appears you have an agenda that isn't for the best of the industry.

so use your own first (joe) and last (alpert) name. your trend, as past post show, that when you get anally uptight about something you go that direction of first and last name.does that make u feel like you have authority and an expert?? so use your own name JOE alpert.... I don't give u permission to use mine.. as for loa's ..it seems you take another direction when it comes to another specific company that you, Joe alpert, are an unofficial dealer of. also 250+ posts doesn't make one more knowledgable than others,,,youve got double that...have you posted anything from YOUR collection??? do you have a collection??? seems you are just a seller and a profiter ,,no more no less... that's your part in the industry. your friend mark has another post about shill bidding less than a month ago.
mick president/owner just another dude that sells on eBay