Questionable business practices (strictly an opinion) thread

[aallanson]

So, long story short, a questionable (and IMHO, that's putting it lightly) business practice was brought to my attention today by the business itself. Before I fly off the handle and possibly overreact, I would like to solicit opinions from the community. I would like to know what you all think.

Here's the story. I purchased two jerseys last week. One was a vintage "team issued" jersey, the other a vintage game used jersey. They arrived last night. I knew one was "team issued" when I purchased it. I was told by the seller that the other was game used. When I examined the jerseys, I noticed that the game used jersey exhibited no wear whatsoever. When I questioned the seller as to why the game used jersey exhibited no wear, I received the following explanation: "I don't know why there isn't much wear, but it was purchased with the name on the back along with all the other worn jerseys. The ones I mark as team issued were all originally blank with no names and we had the official printer put names on the back of those jerseys."

What do you guys think about this explanation?

To me, the jersey I purchased as game used is really "team issued," and the jersey I purchased as "team issued" is, well I don't know what to call it. When the seller purchased it, it was a blank jersey (He seems to imply that the blanks had numbers on them, but no names) that he sent to a printer to have the name added. I guess I thought the team issued jersey had the name added by the team in preparation for use by the player if needed. Maybe that was a bad assumption on my part, but this whole thing leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I paid via paypal so I am protected, but I wanted to know what you guys thought. I don't want opinions about whether I should return the jerseys (I think the answer is fairly obvious and I am leaning towards returning), rather I was looking for thoughts on what defines team issued, and whether or not what I described above constitutes some sort of fraud or shady business practice on the part of the seller, or is what the seller did something common and accepted by the game worn community.

I have done my best to describe the situation, but I can re-clarify if necessary. Thanks. Alan

[ousooner_85]

I think you pretty much nailed it on the head or I at least agree with your description or ideas of what "game used", "game issued", my least favorite and generally the most confusing and exploited "pro-cut" and then the jersey that was fabricated (not sure what to call that one either)

I've gotten to the point where he sellers description is that last thing I rely on to determine the validity of the item. The tough part on a lot of jerseys are the key factors are hard to determine until the item is in hand.

The easy photo matches are a given and the game use is obvious. The whole issued vs. pro-cut vs. whatever that was you where sold is what makes this industry/hobby the most frustrating. Being well-educated in the differences and the minor inconsistencies aren't always identifiable until the item is in hand, which is what sparks the ire of many of us.

[aallanson]

Thank you for taking the time to reply ousooner_85. I think the word you used (fabricated) is the perfect word to describe what was done. That's why it bothers me so much.

[aallanson]

Thank you for taking the time to reply ousooner_85. I think the word you used (fabricated) is the perfect word to describe what was done. That's why it bothers me so much.

Sorry, hit "submit reply" before finishing. I wanted to add that I prefer adding jerseys to my collection that, if they weren't worn in the game by the player, at least COULD HAVE been worn. The fabricated jersey I was sold could never have been worn by the player as it was fabricated after the fact.

Things become complicated, I think, when $ comes into things. I would be okay adding a team issued jersey to my collection (one I know wasn't worn by the player) as long as I know the team made the jersey with the intent of giving it to the player to wear, if necessary. I would NEVER sell (or even represent it) as game worn if I knew it was team issued. In this case, I was willing to accept a team issued jersey of an all time great player from the team I collect because finding a real game used one might be difficult, if not impossible. It was a placeholder meant for my collection. I guess the lesson I am taking from all this is: Be patient and wait for the real thing.

[ousooner_85]

So what's your take on the "Pro-Cut" jersey?

[aallanson]

So what's your take on the "Pro-Cut" jersey?

Not even sure what the term means. Could you explain?

[johnsontravis@ymail.com]

Vintage jerseys can always be really questionable for the most part. You can never really know. You can't prove that jersey wasn't just worn a couple games.

So really in my opinion it would be good business to refund you for the one you aren't happy with...but if he wants to stick to his explanation I think its wrong as a buyer to file for a refund as you can't prove it not to be used.

[johnsontravis@ymail.com]

However, I might file for a refund on the one he said was team issued if there was no mention of the altering. That is not right.

[aallanson]

To clarify, the seller has said I can return, so I don't think that's an issue.

It's obvious that the "game used" jersey didn't see any game action, but yeah, you are right, it is hard to prove a negative. I have more of an issue with the jersey I bought as "team issued" that I subsequently found out was completely fabricated.

[rufusandherschel]

To clarify, the seller has said I can return, so I don't think that's an issue.

It's obvious that the "game used" jersey didn't see any game action, but yeah, you are right, it is hard to prove a negative. I have more of an issue with the jersey I bought as "team issued" that I subsequently found out was completely fabricated.

Is there anymore that need be said? Return the jersey, and move on!