Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

[tella27]

I'm sure a lot of people on here have seen Celebzdirect pushing their "game used" items on eBay. Some might have noticed that Hgpdiamond on eBay is Celebzdirect business partner or "sister company" as they call it. What most don't know is their COAs are completely made up and use facsimile signature to imply the history or these sold items.

I recently noticed my coa was signed with a facsimile signature so I contacted Celebzdirect asking about it and was told that this is their practice (making the coa and using a copy of the signature) because its unrealistic to have the athletes sign the coa. I reached out to Hgpdiamond to return a game used JC Romero jersey because it shows zero use and the coa wasn't from Romero saying it was game used but from Hgpdiamond with his signature copied onto it to make it look like it was signed by him authenticating it.

I was told by Steve - president of Hgpdiamond - that CD never used copies of COAs or signatures. Once I proved it to him he became very defensive about it but would not answer my questions of why he said they don't use them but CD emailed me and told me they do or why would it even be needed if the items are genuine. I said I felt like it was something that others on sports forums would care to know as well.
He replied:

First I don't care about the sports forum I think there a joke second we've been in business for over 40 years so I don't need sports forums we have customers all over United States international and domestic that have done and do business with us daily. any threats or misuse of our company will be dealt with. again send back the jersey and we will refund you. as stated

To me this type of attitude when questioned about copies of signatures passed of as authentication to verify the items shows something isn't right and their business practices should be questioned. Everyone is free to purchase from anyone they want - I just wanted to bring to light that you should make sure if buying from either company you should ask if the coa has a genuine signature of the player authenticating the items background.

[ShaimOnYou]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

I don't know who "Steve" or this "sister" company is, but Scot Monette runs CelebzDirect.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/i-team/fraud-sports-memorabilia-dealer-bradley-wells-tells-fbi-prominent-card-companies-knew-jerseys-fakes-article-1.1159317

Without making reference to any wrongdoing on anyone's part, I simply ask, what would you expect from a guy who's ex-business partner claims it was "his idea to play home run derby" with bats to make them look game used?

"High integrity" doesn't really come to mind.

[Hoosier39]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

I was wondering about this. Also wonder if they bid up each other's stuff on EBay. I know for a fact Celebz has another EBay username.

[Hoosier39]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

Also too-- A LOT of the stuff they sell as used is actually game ready.

[tella27]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

After speaking with CelebzDirect again they said they don't have a sister company. They offered to send me a genuine signed loa from Romero even though it was purchased from Hgpdiamond and not direct from them. It looks like Hgpdiamond is trying to use CelebzDirect's name and history to sell their items. They don't appear to be anyone except a company that buys CD's items and resells them.
Here is Steve's first message to me - clearly he says they are sister companies.

Hello this is Steve president and CEO of Hollywood investment celeb is our sister company I would like to know who you spoke with within the company about the coa. we work ditect with jc romero and all items are 100 percent authentic. you should have recieved a original signature coa not a copy. again I am here with celebz and they do not repeat do not make copies. everything is original and authentic. jc signs all coa direct. as do all of our clients. please let me know who you spoke with. we do guarantee our service and products. thank you

[Hoosier39]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

So each LOA is signed by the player? Yeah, that's not true.

[Hoosier39]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

Sorry, I thought that was a Celebz response. Not all Celebz LOA's are signed by the players, a lot now are photocopied.

I'm confused. So diamond works direct with Romero and gives a Celebz LOA with the item?

[RMoody]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

Bought from them in the past, the photo copied COA started midway through last year.

Ironically I bought a bunch of Darren Woodson items, I literally got 12 hand signed COAs. I thought to myself at the time, well that's a bit much. Especially considering some of it was for like a single glove.

Sure enough my next order, had one of the photo copied Woodson COAs. Again, I actually thought well .... no wonder.

From that point on, I either haven't got them or they have been photo copied.

Sadly, one of the Culpepper jerseys I bought was not game used (it was event used) at least that I can tell. Now who's fault it is, Celebz for sending me the COA saying its game used or Dante's for actually signing "game used" on the darn thing.

[tella27]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

Sorry, I thought that was a Celebz response. Not all Celebz LOA's are signed by the players, a lot now are photocopied.

I'm confused. So diamond works direct with Romero and gives a Celebz LOA with the item?

No - diamond buys from Celebz and then resells the items but tells people they are part of Celebz

[Hoosier39]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

Hmm, something doesn't seem right.

[ShaimOnYou]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

I don't believe there is a need to state the obvious, but I'll take a shot at it anyway.

If you are a game-used memorabilia marketing company that contracts with professional players directly, you should have each piece you sell accompanied by a player-signed COA in wet ink. If you don't supply that, then at least include a picture of the athlete signing the item from an angle and point in the signing process that will easily identify the item as being one in the same.

The day you start handing out "copies" of player signatures on a COA, you have nothing in regards to authenticity, and even less in recourse.

Imagine how easy it then becomes to dirty up whatever is accompanying the pre-printed COA's and sell them without any direct player provenance? That scenario is free reign for any less-than-honest person to sell a lot of unauthentic stuff. Worse yet, God help you, is if you end up with a questionable item. Anyone who comes forward with that "copy" and is looking for a refund for an item they deem unauthentic now faces the very real possibility of the marketing company saying "That letter wasn't the letter we issued with that item. Someone made a copy of the original and is now offering it with another item."

Good luck with that in court. Demand the real deal from the start, or pass. If you choose to accept a "copied" signature of a player on a supposed COA, then you are likely not going to end up with a successful collection.

Wow, this hobby. Haven't we all been through this with these types before? Don't accept a flawed system designed to line the pockets of the ones doing the deeds, but allowing them a "back door" exit when they need one. Make them accountable.

Chris

[earlywynnfan]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

Shadiness and arrogance aside, I would have a hard time dealing with anyone who wants to be known as high-quality yet uses "Celebz" as their name.

[RMoody]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

I don't believe there is a need to state the obvious, but I'll take a shot at it anyway.

If you are a game-used memorabilia marketing company that contracts with professional players directly, you should have each piece you sell accompanied by a player-signed COA in wet ink. If you don't supply that, then at least include a picture of the athlete signing the item from an angle and point in the signing process that will easily identify the item as being one in the same.

The day you start handing out "copies" of player signatures on a COA, you have nothing in regards to authenticity, and even less in recourse.

Imagine how easy it then becomes to dirty up whatever is accompanying the pre-printed COA's and sell them without any direct player provenance? That scenario is free reign for any less-than-honest person to sell a lot of unauthentic stuff. Worse yet, God help you, is if you end up with a questionable item. Anyone who comes forward with that "copy" and is looking for a refund for an item they deem unauthentic now faces the very real possibility of the marketing company saying "That letter wasn't the letter we issued with that item. Someone made a copy of the original and is now offering it with another item."

Good luck with that in court. Demand the real deal from the start, or pass. If you choose to accept a "copied" signature of a player on a supposed COA, then you are likely not going to end up with a successful collection.

Wow, this hobby. Haven't we all been through this with these types before? Don't accept a flawed system designed to line the pockets of the ones doing the deeds, but allowing them a "back door" exit when they need one. Make them accountable.

Chris

First of all, i cant stated this whole "holier than tho" concept. Guess what, it's my collection and what I choose to accept ultimately is up to me.

The prints still describe the item as the actual ones do.

You act like a actually signed COA would be so much harder to "dirty up". Signed or not each COA still has a just as pointless hologram. Lets call a spade a spade, if somebody wants to fake or forge something they are going to do it. A real or copied COA changes nothing.

If I feel the item speaks for itself, then by all means I could care less about a COA. A copied COA for Woodson's custom Griffey cleats, signed G/U. You think I need to really bulk at the copied COA?

So the Rudi Johnson photo match cleats because exactly how much less valued with the copied Culpepper COA they have? Should I now expect these didn't come from his personal collection.

If your looking for either a player signed COA and or photo of the player with the item every time, your gonna need far more help with your collection than I will mine.

It's not about "accepting a flawed system" it's about applying some common sense. You have Woodson sell them 100 items, and expect him to personally sign 100 COAs? What happens when you spill soda on those last 25 remaining COAs, you just trash the items now?

Would it kill you to know that the guy I work with, I watch him sign every item and they come with a generic "signed in the presence of" COA?

It all comes down to the buyer, if I need a COA to tell me is real, I don't need the item.

I think the "Celebz" is the concept that they go well beyond football.

[Roady]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

Some people on here will spend thousands of dollars on a hundred dollar jersey just because a man, a proclaimed expert, says it is real and gives out a LOA with with his signature on it.
But lets not stop this witch hunt.

[jake33]

Re: Celebz Direct & Hgpdiamond Questionable business practices

A thing I take into consideration is that I will die someday and everything game used I have will get sold off at some point. So, I think being possessive about "my collection" is a little short sighted.

Here is a fact that I don't think is debatable. A scanned or copied COA is a forged document. Period. Do you want to own a forged document in your home? Someone at some point will notice that and resale value is affected by whomever will sell the item.

Having a scanned/copied COA makes me think if that worthless little piece of paper is forged, what else is? It is like if the seller isn't going to be 100% truthful with that, what else is questionable? Where did the seller draw the line with entering into that area of grey?

And if you hold on to everything until the day you die, still someone somewhere down the line will have those questions.

I am not questioning the authenticity of any item itself (that may be another thread on the forum). I just wonder why Celebz or whomever originated the copied COA would do that. Doing less could have been doing more in this instance. I think many of us would accept the seller saying "Hey, I bought X athlete's collection. I have a ton of photos from the overall signing too. I don't have a photo of the athlete signing this particular piece and I don't have a COA from him, but I can give you a COA from our company, with my name on it stating that the item was autographed/game used and was obtained from this signing on such and such of date." At least then it provides more clarity other than some degree of smoke and mirrors.