Who's the tailor????

[Eric]

Here's what I'd love to know.

Who's acting as the accessory in the game used fraud being perpetrated in today's hobby?

Someone is taking clean game cut jerseys of today's star players and rookies and adding customizations which are close but not right. Teams who keep a tight hold on their equipment are now represented in every auction these days with 2005 and 2006 jerseys of the money players.

They are flooding the hobby. Items like this rejected from one auction house end up in others. It's not good.

It's not just one person involved here. Unless they happen to be a dealer and a master with a sewing machine (which I suppose is possible, but unlikely) there are other guilty parties as well.

Here are all of the steps involved in this scheme:

Someone is getting game cuts of star players (from Reebok? from the teams?) How do they get these pieces? Does Reebok/NFL/Players Association know that someone is using their product to defraud the public? Actually, I can tell you they do, but will they do something about it?

It seems that some of these game cuts either didn't have nameplates and patches (since some of the fonts on the final product are wrong AND some of the patches are in the incorrect place.)

So that means our scammers have to find false nameplates and/or patches. Patches can be found on ebay. Where can nameplates be made?

They have to have someone willing to sew on these nameplates and patches. How many places so restorations/customizations like this? Is it hard to find?

The scammers have to know what the proper customizations are supposed to look like and then order them up with their tailor.

Side by side with the real thing, you can tell the differences, but with no photo comparison, one can be fooled.

The authenticators are fooled too. You see these in many of today's high profile auction houses.

And hey- as long as your in there sewing, Mr. Tailor, how about some repairs? You see some pieces with the wrong font nameplate which has been punished with wear.

Then there are the auction houses who take these in as consignments? Are they guilty here? I'm not sure of what the answer is. If they don't know they're being had, then I'm not sure they're guilty. If they are playing dumb to get the buyer's fee, then round them up with the rest of the thieves.

What am I missing here? What do people think about all of this?
Eric

[otismalibu]

Re: Who's the tailor????

So that means our scammers have to find false nameplates and/or patches. Patches can be found on ebay. Where can nameplates be made?

There's a company that I've had customize a couple of NFL Reebok authentics for me. They'll match the numbers, match the nameplate fabric to the jersey, match the lettering for the NOB. I have no idea where they get their materials.

[34swtns]

Re: Who's the tailor????

Otis, I know of whom you speak!
Seriously. Eric, you've GOT to know that there are sporting apparel places in almost every major city who do good to great to perfect quality customizations on almost anything you bring in the door. Sometimes you might have to supply the nameplate material or the particular shade of twill, especially if you're working on an older style jersey, but the bottom line is if you need a garment altered in any way........ it's fairly easy to find someone to do it. I display several vintage game jerseys on the walls of my sports room and have had to have missing nameplates restored, repairs made, etc. It's quite easy to find the facilities who originally did team repairs on the pro jerseys for just about any respective team and they're usually more than happy to perform whatever task you need done. The difference between myself and some of the other unscrupulous individuals we encounter in this hobby is that my repaired or altered jerseys will never be for sale.

[both-teams-played-hard]

Re: Who's the tailor????

Where are all the blank "team issue" jerseys coming from? I think some are taking nameplates and numbers from authentic replicas and adding them to blank team issues. My Grandma is a whiz...she once chain-stitched the Gettysburg Address...

[ksuftballfan1]

Re: Who's the tailor????

If they have a game cut jersey i wouldn't care if they sold as a GAME CUT JERSEY, but those greedy people make their fake alterations and sell them as game WORN/USED jerseys, It's disturbing. I was in one of my local sporting goods stores and in their jersey sample room saw a game cut shaun alexander jersey without a nameplate, a game cut santonio holmes jersey without nameplate or steelers patch and a game cut lsu jersey with nike tag that read XL. The guy their said once new style jerseys are made they sell the ones in the sample room and get new samples. This could be a similar source to where other jerseys are coming from.

[ksuftballfan1]

Re: Who's the tailor????

Take a look at this website, www.exclusivepro.com , under more samples you should take a look at the shaun alexander jersey, they did a good job.

- ksuftballfan1@aol.com -

[34swtns]

Re: Who's the tailor????

Take a look at this website, www.exclusivepro.com , under more samples you should take a look at the shaun alexander jersey, they did a good job.

- ksuftballfan1@aol.com -

Yep, that's ONE of them. They're one of the better known customizers (being that they do custom jobs for the NFL, MLB, NHL, etc.) but trust me, they're one of a hundred(s).

Check your local yellow pages.

[G1X]

Re: Who's the tailor????

Gentlemen,

In observing the photos of the jerseys on the website mentioned in the previous posts, I don't see how a collector of game-used football jerseys would think that these jerseys were ever anywhere near an NFL equipment room. They are nice-looking replicas, but are not cut like gamers.

Mark Hayne
Gridiron Exchange

[otismalibu]

Re: Who's the tailor????

Mark,

I think Eric was talking about game jerseys that have been customized. If I sent EPS a blank team issued NFL jersey, I bet it would come back looking pretty good. Then I might take a few dives in the backyard to add a little "game use".

[Eric]

Re: Who's the tailor????

My theory is that a lot of the new nfl jerseys we are seeing at auction are game cut jerseys obtained from reebok. I have a theory on how, but cann't post it because i need to connect a few dots.

These game cut jerseys don't have the proper customizations or the patches added by the teams. Sometimes they are without nameplates.

That's how you see things like a customized Shaun Alexander with wear but the wrong nameplate or a blue Eli Manning from 2004 missing the 80th anniversary patch.

Eric

[allstarsplus]

Re: Who's the tailor????

you see things like a customized Shaun Alexander with wear but the wrong nameplate or a blue Eli Manning from 2004 missing the 80th anniversary patch.

Eric

So close but yet so far!!!! You would think on the Manning jersey you could find an 80th anniversary patch to really fake it up right!

[Eric]

Re: Who's the tailor????

So close but yet so far!!!! You would think on the Manning jersey you could find an 80th anniversary patch to really fake it up right!

Perhaps someone will....

[TNTtoys]

Re: Who's the tailor????

I saw Exclusive Pro mentioned in an earlier post. I have used them before, and they do excellent work customizing jerseys... their business is mainly to do lettering and numbering on team jerseys, and they do some serious volume. They also put favorite player letters and numbers on blank authentic jerseys for fans or stores that sell customized (or personalized) player jerseys... this is where I have used their services. True they are 1 of many that do this service, but they are licensed to by MLB, NHL, etc. to do this. I don't see anything here that is out of the ordinary.
Where I see the line crossed is when someone submits a jersey to them (or another company that performs the similar service) for the purpose of passing off as a game worn jersey. This person has intent to commit a crime by using an unknowing participant. This person also would probably have doctored up strip tags, flag tags, and other team identifying factors that a lettering and numbering company couldn't possibly do. And of course, they probably "add" game wear to the jersey later as well (unless they are selling the jersey as team issued to that player).
I would not put this issue on the letter and number guy, as they are in business to perform a service and are licensed by all of the proper authrities to do so.

[Utopian2630]

Re: Who's the tailor????

I saw Exclusive Pro mentioned in an earlier post. I have used them before, and they do excellent work customizing jerseys... their business is mainly to do lettering and numbering on team jerseys, and they do some serious volume. They also put favorite player letters and numbers on blank authentic jerseys for fans or stores that sell customized (or personalized) player jerseys... this is where I have used their services. True they are 1 of many that do this service, but they are licensed to by MLB, NHL, etc. to do this. I don't see anything here that is out of the ordinary.
Where I see the line crossed is when someone submits a jersey to them (or another company that performs the similar service) for the purpose of passing off as a game worn jersey. This person has intent to commit a crime by using an unknowing participant. This person also would probably have doctored up strip tags, flag tags, and other team identifying factors that a lettering and numbering company couldn't possibly do. And of course, they probably "add" game wear to the jersey later as well (unless they are selling the jersey as team issued to that player).
I would not put this issue on the letter and number guy, as they are in business to perform a service and are licensed by all of the proper authrities to do so.

I agree with TNT Toys. These places aren't really to blame, its the un-ethical people who try to pass this garbage off around the hobby. I know if/when those 'old stock' Steelers jerseys come around again, I'd probably like to buy one just to wear on gameday...not try unload as a game-worn jersey. Do you think that if someone shipped a dozen blank Colts 'game-cut jerseys' to a pro shop they'd refuse to put a dozen number 18's on them? I don't think we should fault the pro shops from doing quality work but maybe question these blanks and see where they end up.

[otismalibu]

Re: Who's the tailor????

Can't recall if EPS does it or not, but I know some places will just ship you the nameplate and you're responsible for having it sewn on.

I used to see number kits for sale on eBay as well.