What would you do - mislabeled jersey purchased through charity auction

[gingi79]

This is exactly why this hobby needs a set-in-stone list of definitions of what each item actually is. Preseason/Spring Training isn't as desirable/valuable/the same as actual season used game worn. Worn while watching on the bench/dugout isn't the same as worn during participation in an actual game. Issued to the team as a backup with team mods isn't "pro model with similar mods".

I'd settle for using Game Worn/Used being used EXCLUSIVELY for regular/post season worn while actually playing the game and leaving everything else made to team/player specs, worn on the bench, worn as a backup as "issued" while leaving all other versions as "replica".

Everyone from auction houses to the average person posting on Craigslist has impunity to call any old item whatever they wish because our hobby has no guidelines or criteria for terminology. We are actively contributing to the muddling of and depreciation therefore of our items. Consider as well, the perception that everything in our hobby and the autograph hobby are fake.

Due to the fact the only time average folks hear about our hobbies is a 60 Minutes expose on Operation Bullpen or the recent bust and indictment of what they deemed "impeccable sources of game used memorabilia" at the National, I cannot be alone in understanding our hobby requires stringent guidelines to help police and classify items.

[johnsontravis@ymail.com]

If the player was active and in the dugout by MLB Authentication guidelines the jersey was in fact "game used". Whether or not you agree with that wording it is what it is.

The problem I see in this situation is the fact the authentication number says issued. At that point it should be sold as that...That is what happens in every other case so the integrity of the program is upheld. It was wrong to call it game used.

[Roady]

I always thought of "game used" as the player actually "played" in the game, not watch everyone else from the dugout.
I think I will continue to believe that.

[paul457]

The problem I see in this situation is the fact the authentication number says issued. At that point it should be sold as that...That is what happens in every other case so the integrity of the program is upheld. It was wrong to call it game used.

Exactly. There are a few side discussions in this thread - a) what is game used and what isn't, and b) do your homework before you purchase, neither of which were really the focus when creating this thread.

The story I got from the team was: The team / charity listed all of the jerseys for that game as 'game used', all were signed. All of the players were present for the game, some played and some didn't. This particular player didn't play, and left early, so also didn't sign his jersey that day (everyone else did). So the actual signature and authentication for this jersey was done almost two weeks after the rest of the batch (and after the auction ended). The authenticator could not confirm that the jersey was worn in the dugout that day, so they authenticated the signature, and listed the jersey as game issued on the COA. The team has been in touch with the authenticator and they are not willing to change the COA. I feel comfortable with this story and in some ways respect the authenticator for NOT changing the COA.

Still doesn't change the fact that the listing was incorrect and I likely paid more for this jersey than I would have if it was listed correctly as an issued jersey. It is what it is, the charity and team have been in contact with me and are being helpful, so I have no beef with them. I can't stand the thought of taking money back from a charity, so I'm leaving it alone. Sounds like an honest mistake.

The real point of this thread was to seek advice / feedback on how others would handle this situation. TwinLakesPark hit it on the head - if anyone here did this, they would be berated and thrashed into submission, and no questions asked people would be returning the jersey. But there's a charity twist to this specific situation, so that really throws a wrench into the standard approach as a refund is taking money away from a charity...

Just thought it was an interesting twist to a common issue here, but it seems to have gotten lost within the "you're stupid, do your homework!" and the "that's not game used!" side discussions.

[Phil316]

Hopefully you took something away from this experience you had bidfing on MLB auctions

[TwinLakesPark]

Hopefully you took something away from this experience you had bidfing on MLB auctions

Is this a joke?

BTW, MLB Auctions is a program that provides a platform for MLB teams to sell merchandise in a central location. This experience was with a single baseball team with very poor executive leadership and customer service. The Authentics is just another way to connect with your fan base and enhance their experience, not a profiteering engine. It is unfortunate that some teams place this program in the hands of low level employees without much oversight.

That's my takeaway...

[emann]

Exactly. There are a few side discussions in this thread - a) what is game used and what isn't, and b) do your homework before you purchase, neither of which were really the focus when creating this thread.

The story I got from the team was: The team / charity listed all of the jerseys for that game as 'game used', all were signed. All of the players were present for the game, some played and some didn't. This particular player didn't play, and left early, so also didn't sign his jersey that day (everyone else did). So the actual signature and authentication for this jersey was done almost two weeks after the rest of the batch (and after the auction ended). The authenticator could not confirm that the jersey was worn in the dugout that day, so they authenticated the signature, and listed the jersey as game issued on the COA. The team has been in touch with the authenticator and they are not willing to change the COA. I feel comfortable with this story and in some ways respect the authenticator for NOT changing the COA.

Still doesn't change the fact that the listing was incorrect and I likely paid more for this jersey than I would have if it was listed correctly as an issued jersey. It is what it is, the charity and team have been in contact with me and are being helpful, so I have no beef with them. I can't stand the thought of taking money back from a charity, so I'm leaving it alone. Sounds like an honest mistake.

The real point of this thread was to seek advice / feedback on how others would handle this situation. TwinLakesPark hit it on the head - if anyone here did this, they would be berated and thrashed into submission, and no questions asked people would be returning the jersey. But there's a charity twist to this specific situation, so that really throws a wrench into the standard approach as a refund is taking money away from a charity...

Just thought it was an interesting twist to a common issue here, but it seems to have gotten lost within the "you're stupid, do your homework!" and the "that's not game used!" side discussions.

For the record, I don't think any of us called you "stupid." I certainly don't think you're stupid, you just didn't Google a boxscore before putting a high bid on an item. When I finally started posting on this forum after years of reading it, the one main tenet from the educated, respected, and longtime collectors (most of whom stopped posting before you or TwinLakes joined) was "do your homework." As Phil said, it doesn't matter the source . . . A few seconds of research would have spared you this issue entirely. Sorry to be the one who points this out, don't kill the messenger.

After I looked at the listing, as I said, I agree with your main argument: the team's listing was incorrect. This was not out of malice (I know who the authenticator is that is involved, it was an oversight), the truth is they don't know/care sometimes and mistakes are made.

This is an entirely different scenario that what TwinLakes is ranting about: this is clearly not someone taking advantage or trying to swindle you (and certainly I don't think you are accusing the team of doing this). Therefore nobody is rushing this thread trying to expose the fraud, etc. This is not a seller who takes a pro cut jersey and tried to pass it off as a gamer. The team screwed up the listing, you bid on it and it sounds like they'd take it back if that is what you desired.

As for people derailing your thread. This is an internet forum: not everyone will agree with you. Differing opinions are what make this forum helpful.

[emann]

Is this a joke?

BTW, MLB Auctions is a program that provides a platform for MLB teams to sell merchandise in a central location. This experience was with a single baseball team with very poor executive leadership and customer service. The Authentics is just another way to connect with your fan base and enhance their experience, not a profiteering engine. It is unfortunate that some teams place this program in the hands of low level employees without much oversight.

The team in question has a bad track record of tagging "gamers" which can cut both ways if you're a collector . . . I've picked up some great items that are gamer worn that were tagged "issued" or not at all.

All the MLB Authenticators are ex-law enforcement to some degree, so they're not low level employees with no training or ability to think for themselves. I think the main problem with the authentication program is they just don't have enough of them to clear the volume of items that every team churns out on an almost daily basis. The fact that the big market team the OP has issues with has ONE authenticator assigned to them shows the problem.

[Phil316]

emann thank you for understanding my point. I don't think the original poster is stupid at all and hopefully it did not come off that way.

[paul457]

I don't think the original poster is stupid at all and hopefully it did not come off that way.

No no, I don't think that you were accusing me of being stupid. Just reading the replies and side conversations I broke them up into two general themes and added a little flair.

I've bought tons of GU and issued items from this team and the charity through MLB Auctions over the years, and everything has always checked out 100%. Given the explanation I was given, and the fact that these jerseys were listed prior to authentication, I can see how this particular jersey slipped through the cracks. This was an honest mistake, and it doesn't change my view of MLB Authentication or the team's GU items.