Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

[Neal]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

I have been an Eagles season ticket holder for 20 years - seen alot of ups and downs. Back in 2001 (?), the Eagles needed to beat Cincy to get back into the playoffs after a few dismal seasons. They won, and then won the playoff game, only to lose to NYG. I remember thinking that with McNabb, Reid, that defense, and JJ, the Eagles will finally get to a Superbowl and win ... maybe several .... in the next 5 years.

Zilch.

McNabb is one of my favorite Eagles. Him playing "air guitar" coming out of the Dallas tunnel sums him up to a degree. He does not have what it takes. Picking up a pretend telephone on the Giants sideline, yucking it up with players during a game, and that big goofy smile he often has during gametime is annoying.

He never was able to be a leader, as a QB needs to be. Instead, he indirectly passed blame.

Is Kolb the answer? Who knows, but they have a better chance of becoming a team with him.

[skinsfan0521]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

I certainly don't think that McNabb is an all-time great like a lot of people do. He has huge numbers cuz in the Eagles offense he throws like 40-50 times a game. That's a HUGE factor. Plus, I think he crumbles under pressure (not defensive pressure, but pressure situations). Not to mention that out of the last like 5 seasons, he hasn't finished 3 or 4 of them because of injury.

But, all that being said... the 'Skins got him for a 2nd this year and a 3rd or 4th next year. That's peanuts. The 'Skins draft HORRIBLY, so they improved on the QB position (not hard to do over Campbell) for 2 picks that would've turned out terribly wrong anyway. That may sound a bit tongue-in-cheek, but I'm completely serious. And they were going to draft a QB, which would mean that they would push themselves a few more years away from doing anything in the postseason. So, with this, they have a chance to do something in the next 3 years (assuming they re-sign him of course), where if they were to draft one of the top QBs, they'd be at least 4 years away from even thinking about it.

Just my .02...

[kjjavic]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

Yeah I can see you guys getting frustrated with getting close so many times and never quite getting there, the Eagles are like the Bills of the 90's and the Vikings of the 70's that way. As a Jets fan I wish my team was that successful we make one championship game a decade and when we have a 10-6 season it is time for a parade. Out of curiosity though where would you rank McNabb? He is clearly better than anything Buffalo, Seattle, Cleveland or Oakland runs out there. And he is better than Dave Garrad, Matt Moore, Matt Leinart, Matt Cassell, Jamarcus Russell, Matt Hasselback, Vince Young, Alex Smith, Kyle Orton and Jason Campbell. Sanchez, Stafford, Freeman, Henne and Ryan all have shown flashes and had some struggles and have been playing two or less years so they have yet to establish track records. Cutler is very inconsistent. Palmer is a shell of his former self. Schuab had one good year in his late 20s.. Even if you rank Peyton, Brady, Brees, Rivers, Favre, Romo, Eli Manning, Roethlisberger and Flacco ahead of him, the last four of which are debateable McNabb would still rank tenth.

I think your rankings are pretty good --> I would probably go the following, bumping Eli and Favre down below McNabb, and but Ryan up above.
I would go Peyton, Brady, Brees, Rivers, Roethlisberger, Romo, Flacco, Ryan, McNabb.
I think your listing of all the QBs in the league reveals how pitiful the QB's in the league are in general, after the top 10 or so.
I think alot will be revealed this season about who benefitted more from the Reid/McNabb relationship. Did McNabb excell because or Reid or inspite of him, or vice versa? It will be an interesting year for sure.
One play I will never forget about Donovan, was a play at around the 8 yard line with 8 seconds left or so in the first half, with no timeouts. Reid decided to give the offense one more quick shot at the endzone before sending in Akers. McNabb dropped back, and threw a 5 yard pass to LJ Smith who got tackled at the 3 yard line, and the half ended. That play sort of summed up Donovan in some regards. When under pressure, he wilted there, and instead of throwing it out of the endzone, he panicked and dumped it off, and wasted the FG opportunity. He did that more than once unfortunately, and while he accomplished many great feats with the Birds, that play really sticks with me.

[Rob]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

Yeah I can see you guys getting frustrated with getting close so many times and never quite getting there, the Eagles are like the Bills of the 90's and the Vikings of the 70's that way. As a Jets fan I wish my team was that successful we make one championship game a decade and when we have a 10-6 season it is time for a parade. Out of curiosity though where would you rank McNabb? He is clearly better than anything Buffalo, Seattle, Cleveland or Oakland runs out there. And he is better than Dave Garrad, Matt Moore, Matt Leinart, Matt Cassell, Jamarcus Russell, Matt Hasselback, Vince Young, Alex Smith, Kyle Orton and Jason Campbell. Sanchez, Stafford, Freeman, Henne and Ryan all have shown flashes and had some struggles and have been playing two or less years so they have yet to establish track records. Cutler is very inconsistent. Palmer is a shell of his former self. Schuab had one good year in his late 20s.. Even if you rank Peyton, Brady, Brees, Rivers, Favre, Romo, Eli Manning, Roethlisberger and Flacco ahead of him, the last four of which are debateable McNabb would still rank tenth.

As an Eagles fan, I get to watch McNabb often. It is not the obvious skills that are lacking. He has great arm strength and has superior strength to get away from sacks. His speed is good but nothing like it used to be.

McNabb's faults are more subtle. Its hard to put in words. I have never seen him study pictures on the sideline like I have seen Peyton. He seems to buckle in some big game situations, throwing up in the 4th quarter of the Super Bowl for example. His biggest problem may be that he is just goofy. Its not easy to explain but I bet the Skins fans will pick up on it.

I wish him luck. I do think he can win but not in a west coast system.


Rob

[legaleagle92481]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

Well, I think the fact that the Eagles traded McNabb in division obviously tells you they don't view him as a top 6 QB, nor do I. Fact of the matter is, in 11 years, he accomplished alot, but never brought home a Superbowl, and thats the bottom line. 10 and 6 seasons are nice, but in the end, they get frustrating when you never accomplish the ultimate goal. Perhaps Kolb will be better, perhaps he'll be worse, but the Eagles had to make a decision either way with three QBs on the last year of their deal, and their rebuilding process on the OLine and defense only makes sense to go with the young QB.

Yeah I can see you guys getting frustrated with getting close so many times and never quite getting there, the Eagles are like the Bills of the 90's and the Vikings of the 70's that way. As a Jets fan I wish my team was that successful we make one championship game a decade and when we have a 10-6 season it is time for a parade. Out of curiosity though where would you rank McNabb? He is clearly better than anything Buffalo, Seattle, Cleveland or Oakland runs out there. And he is better than Dave Garrad, Matt Moore, Matt Leinart, Matt Cassell, Jamarcus Russell, Matt Hasselback, Vince Young, Alex Smith, Kyle Orton and Jason Campbell. Sanchez, Stafford, Freeman, Henne and Ryan all have shown flashes and had some struggles and have been playing two or less years so they have yet to establish track records. Cutler is very inconsistent. Palmer is a shell of his former self. Schuab had one good year in his late 20s.. Even if you rank Peyton, Brady, Brees, Rivers, Favre, Romo, Eli Manning, Roethlisberger and Flacco ahead of him, the last four of which are debateable McNabb would still rank tenth.

[legaleagle92481]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

What about Braylon Edwards now? He seemed to play very well last year and out those dropped passes in Cleveland behind him.

braylon is alright and a definte upgrade over most if not all of the guys the jets have employed but he is inconsistent and except for that one year has not really shown he can be a number one receiver. i would love to see them get brandon marshall though it won't happen.

[kjjavic]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

I love when teams try to sell their fans on the virtues of accumulating draft picks. The reality is most draft picks do not pan out and to give up a quality player for more picks to me is a terriable move. Quarterback is the most important position on the field and to sacrifice a top six one who could play another five years for the 37th and 96th best players in the draft to me is crazy. Maybe they grab a couple of defensive players but at those spots the top ones are long gone and individual defensive players will not win you anything anyway. McNabb has his flaws but the guy produces and in a tough division he has made the playoffs most years and had success once there getting to alot of NFC championship games. The Eagles also cheaped out on his supporting cast except for the brief Owens tenure and last season with Jackson he never exactely had quality receivers. Cmon Reggie Brown, Freddie Mitchell, Kevin Curtis, etal. are not exactely Marvin Harrision, Dallas Clark and Reggie Wayne or Issac Bruce and Torry Holt or even Antonio Gates, Vincent Jackson and Malcom Floyd. And Brian Westbrook was always hurt. This is just the Eagles trying to justify spending a high pick on Kolb and reminds me of the Chargers dumping Brees for Rivers and that ended up with Brees lifting the Super Bowl trophy for his next team. If Kolb turns into Jamarcus Russell this move will come back to haunt the Eagles.

Well, I think the fact that the Eagles traded McNabb in division obviously tells you they don't view him as a top 6 QB, nor do I. Fact of the matter is, in 11 years, he accomplished alot, but never brought home a Superbowl, and thats the bottom line. 10 and 6 seasons are nice, but in the end, they get frustrating when you never accomplish the ultimate goal. Perhaps Kolb will be better, perhaps he'll be worse, but the Eagles had to make a decision either way with three QBs on the last year of their deal, and their rebuilding process on the OLine and defense only makes sense to go with the young QB.

[JasonBanz]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

And they have never really replaced Keyshawn.

What about Braylon Edwards now? He seemed to play very well last year and out those dropped passes in Cleveland behind him.

[legaleagle92481]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

I can't believe I am going to agree with a Jets fan, but well said! Although you occasionally get some late draft picks that pan out very well.

Thanks. As a Jets fan I am well versed in quality player for pick trades. After all the Jets traded Keyshawn Johnson, who was my favorite player at the time to the Bucs at the height of his career and a couple of years after they were within a game of the Super Bowl for two first round picks that became Shaun Ellis and Anthony Becht. Becht was a bust and had a forgettable career and Ellis while a very solid player who has had his moments and all these years later is still on the team is far from a difference maker or a star. And they have never really replaced Keyshawn.

[allstarsplus]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

Donovan is already doing in-studio interviews here. He was at Comcast last night and when asked about the receivers he called Chris Cooley by the name Kevin Cooley. Whoops! Since they have been on the same Pro-Bowl team, I would have thought he would have had his name right, but other than that, I am optimistic but agree with Greg that a 1 year deal doesn't do much for the continuation of continuity.

[JasonBanz]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

I love when teams try to sell their fans on the virtues of accumulating draft picks. The reality is most draft picks do not pan out and to give up a quality player for more picks to me is a terriable move. Quarterback is the most important position on the field and to sacrifice a top six one who could play another five years for the 37th and 96th best players in the draft to me is crazy. Maybe they grab a couple of defensive players but at those spots the top ones are long gone and individual defensive players will not win you anything anyway. McNabb has his flaws but the guy produces and in a tough division he has made the playoffs most years and had success once there getting to alot of NFC championship games. The Eagles also cheaped out on his supporting cast except for the brief Owens tenure and last season with Jackson he never exactely had quality receivers. Cmon Reggie Brown, Freddie Mitchell, Kevin Curtis, etal. are not exactely Marvin Harrision, Dallas Clark and Reggie Wayne or Issac Bruce and Torry Holt or even Antonio Gates, Vincent Jackson and Malcom Floyd. And Brian Westbrook was always hurt. This is just the Eagles trying to justify spending a high pick on Kolb and reminds me of the Chargers dumping Brees for Rivers and that ended up with Brees lifting the Super Bowl trophy for his next team. If Kolb turns into Jamarcus Russell this move will come back to haunt the Eagles.

I can't believe I am going to agree with a Jets fan, but well said! Although you occasionally get some late draft picks that pan out very well.

[legaleagle92481]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

As an Eagles fan and Philly area resident, I like the McNabb deal, and it really doesn't bother me dealing him in division. McNabb is a very good QB, and accomplished alot with the Birds, getting to 5 NFC Championship games, but his game has some flaws. For their current wide receiver weopons, they really need a QB that can be accurate on the short slants and crossing patterns, and that was never his strength. Too many times last year, McNabb was putting the ball on DJack's back shoulder, or at his feet, whereas if he hit him is stride, it was a big-gainer in the making. He also has a tendency to hold the ball too long, looking for the perfect play rather than forcing it in. With the Eagles OLine back in the day with stud tackles Runyan and Thomas, that wasn't a big deal, but there line is shakier these days, and McNabb didn't have the time to do that anymore, as was shown in Dallas twice late last season. Obviously he is still a good QB, and improves the Redskins, but I honestly don't think it improves them enough to make them that dangerous next year, and it will make those 2 games much much more interesting. I think Kolb will be a good fit for the Eagles offense, and more importantly, the Eagles need big time defensive help, and the early 2nd round pick should help there.

I love when teams try to sell their fans on the virtues of accumulating draft picks. The reality is most draft picks do not pan out and to give up a quality player for more picks to me is a terriable move. Quarterback is the most important position on the field and to sacrifice a top six one who could play another five years for the 37th and 96th best players in the draft to me is crazy. Maybe they grab a couple of defensive players but at those spots the top ones are long gone and individual defensive players will not win you anything anyway. McNabb has his flaws but the guy produces and in a tough division he has made the playoffs most years and had success once there getting to alot of NFC championship games. The Eagles also cheaped out on his supporting cast except for the brief Owens tenure and last season with Jackson he never exactely had quality receivers. Cmon Reggie Brown, Freddie Mitchell, Kevin Curtis, etal. are not exactely Marvin Harrision, Dallas Clark and Reggie Wayne or Issac Bruce and Torry Holt or even Antonio Gates, Vincent Jackson and Malcom Floyd. And Brian Westbrook was always hurt. This is just the Eagles trying to justify spending a high pick on Kolb and reminds me of the Chargers dumping Brees for Rivers and that ended up with Brees lifting the Super Bowl trophy for his next team. If Kolb turns into Jamarcus Russell this move will come back to haunt the Eagles.

[kjjavic]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

As an Eagles fan and Philly area resident, I like the McNabb deal, and it really doesn't bother me dealing him in division. McNabb is a very good QB, and accomplished alot with the Birds, getting to 5 NFC Championship games, but his game has some flaws. For their current wide receiver weopons, they really need a QB that can be accurate on the short slants and crossing patterns, and that was never his strength. Too many times last year, McNabb was putting the ball on DJack's back shoulder, or at his feet, whereas if he hit him is stride, it was a big-gainer in the making. He also has a tendency to hold the ball too long, looking for the perfect play rather than forcing it in. With the Eagles OLine back in the day with stud tackles Runyan and Thomas, that wasn't a big deal, but there line is shakier these days, and McNabb didn't have the time to do that anymore, as was shown in Dallas twice late last season. Obviously he is still a good QB, and improves the Redskins, but I honestly don't think it improves them enough to make them that dangerous next year, and it will make those 2 games much much more interesting. I think Kolb will be a good fit for the Eagles offense, and more importantly, the Eagles need big time defensive help, and the early 2nd round pick should help there.

[skinsfan0521]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

Yeah, hopefully w/the new front office and coach, they'll be smarter and draft the stud OT from OK State (I think that's where he's from) instead of wasting a pick on a QB. As for Campbell, he's gone. He's no longer attending off season workouts and has been given permission to seek a trade up until and through the draft. If he can't find anything by then, he's staying w/the 'Skins.

[JasonBanz]

Re: Mcnabb Trade Thoughts

I like the move for McNabb. He didn't want to go to Oakland or Buffalo, and who can blame him. He will definitely be starting over Jason Campbell who has proven nothing over the past couple years. Plus with this draft not being exactly "QB strong"(I know you got Bradford, Claussen, McCoy, and Tebow, but I don't put much stock in the big name QB's coming out of college i.e. Ryan Leaf and JaMarcus Russell) it work for the Skins and gives them a chance to wait a year or two in drafting a QB.

For the fans in Philly(I know how they can be, I used to live there) I feel sorry because I know I would be upset if the Fins traded Marino to the Pat, Bills, or Jets. It normally doesn't work out well for the former team. Sonny Jergunsen even said, "The Eagles will never learn!"