Jose Reyes Batting Title

[gnishiyama]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

I have more of a problem with how the Yankess threw the last game of the year to keep the Red Sox out of the playoffs. Instead of getting one of their starters some work with many days until they would pitch in the playoffs they pitched a rookie callup who had never started a major league game for a whooping two innings and then inserted relievers who were either callups or guys who have about as much chance of pitching in the postseason as I do. They pitched Proctor for three innings at the end. They either rested or pulled all of their starters well before the end of the game. As a result of their actions the Rays got an easy W and ended up in the postseason instead of a winner take all playoff game with the Sox.

Talk about a completely baseless statement.

What's wrong with resting your starters for a meaningless game on the ROAD
with the playoffs only TWO days away? You must have only looked at the
final score since it was hardly an easy W for the Rays.

[legaleagle92481]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

Like I said before, its a bit unfair to asume what Braun might do when we know what Reyes did.
Reyes showed no class in what he did. To assume Braun would show just as little class is wrong.
We KNOW what and why Reyes did what he did.
We DON'T KNOW what Braun would do in the same situation.

To use an assumption, a hypothetical one made up in your own mind, of what Braun might do as an excuse for what Reyes did is not the best argument in my opinion. And I am suprised to read that argument at least 3 times.

Its every man for himself. He has no obligation to Braun to have stayed in. Braun could have gotten three or four more hits during the year and he would not have had to worry about what Reyes did. He didn't he lost too bad for him. I have more of a problem with how the Yankess threw the last game of the year to keep the Red Sox out of the playoffs. Instead of getting one of their starters some work with many days until they would pitch in the playoffs they pitched a rookie callup who had never started a major league game for a whooping two innings and then inserted relievers who were either callups or guys who have about as much chance of pitching in the postseason as I do. They pitched Proctor for three innings at the end. They either rested or pulled all of their starters well before the end of the game. As a result of their actions the Rays got an easy W and ended up in the postseason instead of a winner take all playoff game with the Sox.

[godwulf]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

Reyes pulling himself out like that was more than Bush League; it disrespected The Game, the fans, and his team.

On a much smaller scale than a batting title, but still noteworthy, I remember a couple of years ago when Conor Jackson of the Diamondbacks needed only a double to have hit for the cycle in a game - something a lot of good, even great, players never accomplish. In the late innings of a close game, Jackson made it to Second, and then stretched it into a triple without even slowing down. It was a close play at Third, and, because of that, few people would have blamed him for stopping at Second...but that isn't the kind of chickenshit move a real ballplayer makes. He contributes all he has until he has nothing left.

[Titans74]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

The question of going for individual titles, versus helping your team win games, is much larger than just sitting out games for batting titles. I'm old enough to remember the race between Maris and Mantle to break Ruth's HR record in 1961. Near the end of the season, Manager Ralph Houk was asked if he would consider moving Mantle or Maris up in the batting order to give them more chances to hit HR's. He replied that he was sure they'd rather break the record the legitimate way, by batting in their usual spots to help the team, or not break it at all. Of course, the Yankees were actually in a real pennant race with the Tigers.

How many times has a Manager left a pitcher in though he sees he's tiring, just to keep his shot at a no-hitter? Only when the guy nearly blows the game by giving up a big hit, does the reliever come in.

I prefer the idea that individual records should come only as a natural part of helping the team win that game. But I went through many losing Braves' seasons in the "BC" ( before Cox) era. And I recall that Braves' fans focused on individual achievments as a relief from the team's failures to win.

When I saw the Mets' Manager get choked up after the game, I think I sensed what was really going on: The Mets had had a disappointing year, and to get the club's first-ever batting title was emotional compensation.

Best post in this thread. Thank you for your insight. As a fan, I agree 100%. Reyes staying or coming out had no affect on the Mets dismal season. But, the first Met EVER to win a batting title? In this particular scenerio I was happy to see it, just the way it happened. Had the Mets been in a tight race and he pulled himself out then I could understand and agree with the bashing.

[gnishiyama]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

When I saw the Mets' Manager get choked up after the game, I think I sensed what was really going on: The Mets had had a disappointing year, and to get the club's first-ever batting title was emotional compensation.

That's deep. My heart is heavy for Terry Collins and the Mets.

[coxfan]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

The question of going for individual titles, versus helping your team win games, is much larger than just sitting out games for batting titles. I'm old enough to remember the race between Maris and Mantle to break Ruth's HR record in 1961. Near the end of the season, Manager Ralph Houk was asked if he would consider moving Mantle or Maris up in the batting order to give them more chances to hit HR's. He replied that he was sure they'd rather break the record the legitimate way, by batting in their usual spots to help the team, or not break it at all. Of course, the Yankees were actually in a real pennant race with the Tigers.

How many times has a Manager left a pitcher in though he sees he's tiring, just to keep his shot at a no-hitter? Only when the guy nearly blows the game by giving up a big hit, does the reliever come in.

I prefer the idea that individual records should come only as a natural part of helping the team win that game. But I went through many losing Braves' seasons in the "BC" ( before Cox) era. And I recall that Braves' fans focused on individual achievments as a relief from the team's failures to win.

When I saw the Mets' Manager get choked up after the game, I think I sensed what was really going on: The Mets had had a disappointing year, and to get the club's first-ever batting title was emotional compensation.

[Doodles]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

Like I said before, its a bit unfair to asume what Braun might do when we know what Reyes did.
Reyes showed no class in what he did. To assume Braun would show just as little class is wrong.
We KNOW what and why Reyes did what he did.
We DON'T KNOW what Braun would do in the same situation.

To use an assumption, a hypothetical one made up in your own mind, of what Braun might do as an excuse for what Reyes did is not the best argument in my opinion. And I am suprised to read that argument at least 3 times.

This is the said part of this whole debate...many in this country see no problem with what Reyes did...even though holding it up to standards of the past, ie. Ted Williams, it falls so far short of expectations.

Ted must be unfreezing in his grave.

[freddiefreeman5]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

.... who is to say that if Braun passed him before his game was over that he would not have wanted to been pulled?

Like I said before, its a bit unfair to asume what Braun might do when we know what Reyes did.
Reyes showed no class in what he did. To assume Braun would show just as little class is wrong.
We KNOW what and why Reyes did what he did.
We DON'T KNOW what Braun would do in the same situation.

To use an assumption, a hypothetical one made up in your own mind, of what Braun might do as an excuse for what Reyes did is not the best argument in my opinion. And I am suprised to read that argument at least 3 times.

[legaleagle92481]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

I don't think he did anything wrong. Alot of stars dont play much in last game if its meaningless. I am all for play to the end but he is a free agent and even staying in to run the bases and come out in top of next inning like some in the media have suggested risked injury. The guy has hamstring problems. Look at what happened to Brees in his last game as a Charger he stayed in game was meaningless he busted his shoulder probably cost him some money on the market. Plus the batting title is huge to use in his free agency negotiations. a batting title is a good feather to have in one's cap. Plus the Brew Crew played later that day so Braun knew what he needed to do to pass Reyes and if Reyes played the whole game and went one for five and had his average fall who is to say that if Braun passed him before his game was over that he would not have wanted to been pulled?

[MSpecht]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

My guess is that Teddy Ballgame would have said something along these lines http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdJlHnlaNT4

WARNING: Unedited adult content

Mike jackitout7@aol.com

[TNTtoys]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

It was reported that Reyes asked Collins if he can be removed from the game if he got a hit on his first AB. I think Collins even stated this at his post game press conference.

I missed the press conference... I was at Citi Field watching other Mets not named Reyes play a fantastic final game of the season.

Hey...speaking of the press conference... How much attention was given to Miguel Batista who pitched an unbelievable 2-hit shutout? I bet the Reyes thing grabbed most of the attention, sadly...

[metsbats]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

We're all assuming selfishness on the part of Jose, but did anyone think something like this may have happened... The Mets have zero batting titles in the history of the franchise. THEY pulled him once it was deemed safe and secure and that it in no way was Jose's decision. As their likelihood to resign Jose is growing dimmer and dimmer, they get a consolation prize in the end.

It was reported that Reyes asked Collins if he can be removed from the game if he got a hit on his first AB. I think Collins even stated this at his post game press conference.

[sox83cubs84]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

I fondly remember the 1976 season when one of my favorite hitters of that era, Bill Madlock, entered the final day of the season needing a miracle to repeat as the NL batting champion. Ken Griffey, Sr. was leading the NL with a .338 mark while Madlock was hitting at a .333 clip.

Cincinnati had long ago won the NL West (yes, both the Braves and Reds were in the NL West in those days), so Sparky Anderson sat Griffey for the upcoming playoffs as the finale against the Atlanta Braves was meaningless to the Reds. I will not go on record accusing the Reds of sitting Griffey to help protect his chances to win the batting title, but those of us sitting in front of the radio that sunny afternoon listening to the Braves broadcast of the game were convinced that this was the case.

The Cubs were hosting Montreal that day and their game was briskly paced lasting just under two hours. Madlock was perfect at the plate going 4-for-4 (four singles) which raised his final average to .339 and put him in the lead by a mere .001 over Griffey.

Word got back to Cincinnati and Anderson quickly called on Griffey to pinch hit for no other reason than to try to get a hit to take back the crown. There was no other reason for Griffey to come to the plate as the Reds were safely ahead of the Braves in a meaningless game.

Griffey failed, and I can remember my friends and me cheering as we felt that justice was being served. However, it wasn't quiet over as Griffey remained in the game and ended up getting one more shot as the Reds batted around in the 8th inning. Once again, Griffey was unable to smack a base hit which assured Madlock of the batting title.

On that day, I realized that the baseball gods do indeed exist!

Mark Hayne
Gridiron Exchange
gixc@verizon.net

Always looking for World Football League and Atlanta Falcons jerseys, and Willie McGee and Darren Lewis game-used equipment.

I recall that, as well, Mark. I was at the Cubs/Expos game that day.

Dave Miedema

[TNTtoys]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

What Reyes did was get his hit and leave the game verses just not playing the game at all which would have been less selfish. What he did was blatantly selfish.

We're all assuming selfishness on the part of Jose, but did anyone think something like this may have happened... The Mets have zero batting titles in the history of the franchise. THEY pulled him once it was deemed safe and secure and that it in no way was Jose's decision. As their likelihood to resign Jose is growing dimmer and dimmer, they get a consolation prize in the end.

[G1X]

Re: Jose Reyes Batting Title

I fondly remember the 1976 season when one of my favorite hitters of that era, Bill Madlock, entered the final day of the season needing a miracle to repeat as the NL batting champion. Ken Griffey, Sr. was leading the NL with a .338 mark while Madlock was hitting at a .333 clip.

Cincinnati had long ago won the NL West (yes, both the Braves and Reds were in the NL West in those days), so Sparky Anderson sat Griffey for the upcoming playoffs as the finale against the Atlanta Braves was meaningless to the Reds. I will not go on record accusing the Reds of sitting Griffey to help protect his chances to win the batting title, but those of us sitting in front of the radio that sunny afternoon listening to the Braves broadcast of the game were convinced that this was the case.

The Cubs were hosting Montreal that day and their game was briskly paced lasting just under two hours. Madlock was perfect at the plate going 4-for-4 (four singles) which raised his final average to .339 and put him in the lead by a mere .001 over Griffey.

Word got back to Cincinnati and Anderson quickly called on Griffey to pinch hit for no other reason than to try to get a hit to take back the crown. There was no other reason for Griffey to come to the plate as the Reds were safely ahead of the Braves in a meaningless game.

Griffey failed, and I can remember my friends and me cheering as we felt that justice was being served. However, it wasn't quiet over as Griffey remained in the game and ended up getting one more shot as the Reds batted around in the 8th inning. Once again, Griffey was unable to smack a base hit which assured Madlock of the batting title.

On that day, I realized that the baseball gods do indeed exist!

Mark Hayne
Gridiron Exchange
gixc@verizon.net

Always looking for World Football League and Atlanta Falcons jerseys, and Willie McGee and Darren Lewis game-used equipment.