Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

[helmets]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

Roger:

All four of the clips on my White helmet are dated '86. The mask is also dated '86.

Yes, there is a rear Riddell bumper. The rear of the helmet has a factory black on white warning label on one side, a black on clear warning label on the other side of the helmet. There is also a size label "8" on the left side of the helmet. There is also dymo tape "WHITE" with the "ITE" sticking out, exposed, faded, and worn, and the "WH" is under the rear bumper and when the bumper is peeled back, that part of the dymo tape looks almost new.

I saw a program on ESPN about three months ago - "Beyond the Glory" about Reggie White. It had footage from '87 and the rear of the helmet looked the same as you could see the size label and the factory warning label. I wished I had taped the program so I could get a better look at it.

[aeneas01]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

looks like the jaworski lid sold for $1,700 less on ebay than it did at american memorabilia in 2005 (ebay - $2k, am 3.7K)....

as far as reggie's lid is concerned, here are some photos i dug up - from what i can tell it doesn't appear that he sported the rear padding flap until 1989. also, it's clear that he wore a vsr-3 from at least 1991 on. could be that he had a wd fitted with vsr-3 padding prior to that as well - not an uncommon thing to do during that era. it could also be that he added the flap when he went to vsr-3 padding in 1989 - pretty hard to be certain tho. the thing is, it appears that many eagles players wore af2 lids - as such, i find it hard to believe that every af2 that shows up with a w-h-i-t-e dymo decal is really reggie's game used lid. where are the jeff tupper, byron lee, bob landsee, etc. game used lids? do only hof lids surface? don't mind me, i'm just an annoying cynic...

btw, i have to say that reggie's use of two brands of lids (schutt & riddell) during the same season and over the course of a few years is really odd - it would be great if someone could get the story on this because, as far as i can tell, there wasn't any pattern or rhyme or reason to his switching lids....

[helmets]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

Robert:

Could your 89 photo possibly be from 87? The clear center stripe is identical to the photos that I attached? In addition the chinstrap is the same style that he wore in 87, right down to the tape on the straps.

I do have an 85 Eagles helmet from a nobody. The name escapes me at the moment, but I will check on it Monday when I return home. It is set up much like the "White" helmet, as it too is an AF2, with an NJOP mask. It has leather Riddell jawpads unlike the "White" helmet. It has very little wear on it.

I was looking forward to a comment on the stamp under the jaw pad of "F8", but you did not mention it in your post. What is your feeling on that?

My "White" helmet came from a reconditioner. To my knowledge, it has never been offered for sale prior to me purchasing it. It does not come with any LOA of any kind.

[aeneas01]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

Could your 89 photo possibly be from 87? The clear center stripe is identical to the photos that I attached? In addition the chinstrap is the same style that he wore in 87, right down to the tape on the straps.

i would say that the photo could certainly be from the '87 season - unfortunately wire photos can be hit and miss when it comes to accurate dating. the photo i posted was captioned "philadelphia eagles defensive end reggie white in 1989", no game attributed. having said that, i looked at a bunch of photos again and really can't find any that conclusively show white wearing a riddell in 1989 - but the photos i have only span about 5-6 games. he clearly wore both riddell and schutt in 1988 and 1990 but, from the photos i have, it appears that he switched to schutt towards the end of the 1988 season and switched back to riddell towards the end of the 1990 season. as such, it could very well be that white wore a schutt throughout the entire 1989 season - make sense?

I do have an 85 Eagles helmet from a nobody. The name escapes me at the moment, but I will check on it Monday when I return home. It is set up much like the "White" helmet, as it too is an AF2, with an NJOP mask. It has leather Riddell jawpads unlike the "White" helmet. It has very little wear on it.

i think i know which one you have....

I was looking forward to a comment on the stamp under the jaw pad of "F8", but you did not mention it in your post. What is your feeling on that?

that's not a manufacturing date stamp, it's a reconditioning code. if your helmet doesn't have a manufacturer's date stamp on the inside of the lid, crown area, near or underneath the inflatable crown padding, then you should be able to find it behind the lower-rear neck padding strip. to get a good look at it you will probably have to remove the padding strip by flipping back the "riddell" nape pad or removing it (very easy to do) so that you can get at the screw that secures the strip in place. you might also have to peel back the protective tape, if it reaches that far, to get at the screw. once removed, you should clearly see a "time clock" date stamp like the ones that appear on riddell suspension helmets.

[John in KY]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

looks like the jaworski lid sold for $1,700 less on ebay than it did at american memorabilia in 2005 (ebay - $2k, am 3.7K)....

as far as reggie's lid is concerned, here are some photos i dug up - from what i can tell it doesn't appear that he sported the rear padding flap until 1989. also, it's clear that he wore a vsr-3 from at least 1991 on. could be that he had a wd fitted with vsr-3 padding prior to that as well - not an uncommon thing to do during that era. it could also be that he added the flap when he went to vsr-3 padding in 1989 - pretty hard to be certain tho. the thing is, it appears that many eagles players wore af2 lids - as such, i find it hard to believe that every af2 that shows up with a w-h-i-t-e dymo decal is really reggie's game used lid. where are the jeff tupper, byron lee, bob landsee, etc. game used lids? do only hof lids surface? don't mind me, i'm just an annoying cynic...

btw, i have to say that reggie's use of two brands of lids (schutt & riddell) during the same season and over the course of a few years is really odd - it would be great if someone could get the story on this because, as far as i can tell, there wasn't any pattern or rhyme or reason to his switching lids....

aeneas01 - unless I'm going crazy every photo in this montage shows Reggie White with a Riddell helmet - the early ones are AF-2s, the later ones are a VS-3s. Regardless of chin strap position or covered/uncoverd Riddell logo I'm not seeing a Schutt in this series of photos. I don't doubt that he wore one as I vaguely remember him wearing a Schutt during that time frame, but wonder if you meant to post some additional photos.

I pretty positive he wore a Bike Air Power in college; Bike was out of Knoxville so Tennessee was an early adopter (and maybe the second school after Michigan to use them). If he didn't care for the VSR-3s at first, it wouldn't be a stretch to see him back in the Air helmets (which by then were made by Schutt).

[aeneas01]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

aeneas01 - unless I'm going crazy every photo in this montage shows Reggie White with a Riddell helmet - the early ones are AF-2s, the later ones are a VS-3s. Regardless of chin strap position or covered/uncoverd Riddell logo I'm not seeing a Schutt in this series of photos. I don't doubt that he wore one as I vaguely remember him wearing a Schutt during that time frame, but wonder if you meant to post some additional photos.

I pretty positive he wore a Bike Air Power in college; Bike was out of Knoxville so Tennessee was an early adopter (and maybe the second school after Michigan to use them). If he didn't care for the VSR-3s at first, it wouldn't be a stretch to see him back in the Air helmets (which by then were made by Schutt).

you are not going crazy - "gameusedfan" and "helmets" were asking about their reggie white riddell helmets so i posted photos of reggie wearing a riddell. white certainly did wear a schutt while in philadelphia and i posted my thoughts on that as well as follows...

"...he clearly wore both riddell and schutt in 1988 and 1990 but, from the photos i have, it appears that he switched to schutt towards the end of the 1988 season and switched back to riddell towards the end of the 1990 season. as such, it could very well be that white wore a schutt throughout the entire 1989 season - make sense?"

[John in KY]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

you are not going crazy - "gameusedfan" and "helmets" were asking about their reggie white riddell helmets so i posted photos of reggie wearing a riddell. white certainly did wear a schutt while in philadelphia and i posted my thoughts on that as well as follows...

"...he clearly wore both riddell and schutt in 1988 and 1990 but, from the photos i have, it appears that he switched to schutt towards the end of the 1988 season and switched back to riddell towards the end of the 1990 season. as such, it could very well be that white wore a schutt throughout the entire 1989 season - make sense?"

Sorry; I just misread your post and thought you were planning on posting photos of White in both types to help date the Riddells. I may have to stop reading/posting during lunch and start doing it at home .

At any rate, you're a wealth of knowledge about individual player's preferences on helmets and I enjoy learing these; my knowledge is more in the area of helmet design/engineering and approximate dates of manufacture. What I'm missing is info on the early VSR series; I have a gap between knowing the details on the the early 1980s Riddells (late PAC-3s & MicroFit HA-9xs, early WD-1s & AF-2s, and M-155s) and the current stuff (VSR-4 and Revolution).

[aeneas01]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

Sorry; I just misread your post and thought you were planning on posting photos of White in both types to help date the Riddells. I may have to stop reading/posting during lunch and start doing it at home .

At any rate, you're a wealth of knowledge about individual player's preferences on helmets and I enjoy learing these; my knowledge is more in the area of helmet design/engineering and approximate dates of manufacture. What I'm missing is info on the early VSR series; I have a gap between knowing the details on the the early 1980s Riddells (late PAC-3s & MicroFit HA-9xs, early WD-1s & AF-2s, and M-155s) and the current stuff (VSR-4 and Revolution).

no apologies necessary jiky - btw i think i might be able to help you out filling in your gaps. i have a detailed history of riddell lids, when they came to market, etc., from the rt through revolution. the only trick is finding it! my database is need of much attention as far as organization is concerned; i haven't exactly kept up with it as i've added info!

here's a look at my dbase - the "003 clearshell" folder happens to be the one selected on the left. if you look at the bottom of the image you can see that i have close to 1,000 photos of clearshell helmets in this folder. the "007 suspension" folder probably has the most images, well over 10,000....

now where did i put that riddell history file.....




pppp

[helmets]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

i think i know which one you have.....

Give me the first and last letter of the last name on the dymo tape. If you are correct I'll send ya a cookie...

[John in KY]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

no apologies necessary jiky - btw i think i might be able to help you out filling in your gaps. i have a detailed history of riddell lids, when they came to market, etc., from the rt through revolution. the only trick is finding it! my database is need of much attention as far as organization is concerned; i haven't exactly kept up with it as i've added info!

here's a look at my dbase - the "003 clearshell" folder happens to be the one selected on the left. if you look at the bottom of the image you can see that i have close to 1,000 photos of clearshell helmets in this folder. the "007 suspension" folder probably has the most images, well over 10,000....

now where did i put that riddell history file.....


pppp

Wow; that is amazing! If you ever upload it to a server I would love to see it.

[commando]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

Wow; that is amazing! If you ever upload it to a server I would love to see it.

Whatever... Give me Lou Lampson's 8,000 photograph suitcase on wheels any day...

[aeneas01]

Re: Jaworski Eagles jersey on eBay... Hmmm...

Whatever... Give me Lou Lampson's 8,000 photograph suitcase on wheels any day...

yeah, that exchange was priceless - rudy and helmets had me rolling!