A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

[earlywynnfan]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

By the way, Robert, Joel would like you to cease and desist posts like this one:

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=25400

Dragging up old auctions and showing what's wrong with them will only lead to the companies' archives being removed, and that hurts all of us. This, of course, far outweighs any good seeing such crap identified can bring.

Ken
earlywynnfan5@hotmail.com

[trsent]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

Regardless of how anyone feels about Mr. Koschal, it was due to his and Ron Keurajian's efforts that the letter was pulled from the REA auction, thus saving some other unlucky bidder the same fate as the consignor, who purchased the letter from Hunt auctions for 29,900.00.

It was not due to the efforts of PSA/DNA or JSA, who both originally authenticated the letter as genuine.

On the last day of the auction, Mr. Lifson sent an email to Steve Koschal indicating “the Delahanty letter has been withdrawn from the auction....”


Mr. Lifson continued (referring to a response he received from James Spence): “...is no longer comfortable with their previous authentication, and believes the letter appears to be a vintage secretarial version.

I do not understand, you want us to tell you we approve of what you say they did now?

How about this example?





Why was this great error not listed on the web site?

I have more, but I have work to do so I will post more later today if necessary. Pretty funny. Guy owns an authentication service, and you say he single handedly had a suspect lot removed and now we have to appreciate his attacking web site?

Sorry, it doesn't work that way.

[sammy]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

Regardless of how anyone feels about Mr. Koschal, it was due to his and Ron Keurajian's efforts that the letter was pulled from the REA auction, thus saving some other unlucky bidder the same fate as the consignor, who purchased the letter from Hunt auctions for 29,900.00.

It was not due to the efforts of PSA/DNA or JSA, who both originally authenticated the letter as genuine.

On the last day of the auction, Mr. Lifson sent an email to Steve Koschal indicating “the Delahanty letter has been withdrawn from the auction....”


Mr. Lifson continued (referring to a response he received from James Spence): “...is no longer comfortable with their previous authentication, and believes the letter appears to be a vintage secretarial version.

[aeneas01]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

Have you ever heard the saying "consider the source?"

great adage, love it, words to live by. on the other hand "dismiss the source" doesn't quite have the same ring, doesn't quite impart the same sage advice - probably the reason it hasn't enjoyed similar success.

if i stumbled across an anonymously authored blog filled with accusations concerning those that deal in vintage football helmets, those that authenticate vintage football helmets, i wouldn't immediately backspace and move on. i would, as always, "consider the source" and read on. and what i read would have merit or it wouldn't. if i later discovered that the author was the one responsible for doctoring many of the vintage helmets currently in circulation, it would most likely have little impact on what i had read at his site. why? because i had already "considered the source" - i had not taken what he had written as gospel, i had independently verified or rejected his claims and had already drawn my own conclusions.

...

[jdr3]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

It's got nothing to do with being right or wrong. It has to do with professionalism.

[fromcooperstowntohollywood]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

[quote=jdr3;139127]You would never find ----------quote]

Whether you like his argument or not, Joel is correct on this one. Perhaps you should ask Steve Koschal about the Babe Ruth autograph authentication opinion that was sent to him last month concerning a Babe Ruth autographed ball that is currently listed on ebay (STAT authenticated.) If you know STAT, then you know where it came from. If you know where it came from, you know it is no good. Yet Mr. Koschal deemed the ball authentic. I guess Mr. Koschal did not realize he lived in a glass house.
His website slams every authenticator because HE wants that business. He hides behind the website, attempting to drive PSA and JSA out of business.
As for DelEhanty, there are several KNOWN autographs out there that MIRROR the one that was in the REA auction (no-I don't own it, have nothing to do with it.)
RK principle

[jdr3]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

You would never find a business owner/representative like Barry Meisel, Mark Hayne or Josh Wulkan coming on to this forum and using terms such as "------" and engaging in the bevy of insults and petty arguements . All should learn from their example and deport in a manner of class and professionalism.

[sammy]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

In regard to the site you mention above, I will use your quotes.

"They post so many twists and lies it is unbelievable."



" Ok, so they should have a mysterious site, attacking their competition, not signing their post or their site and hiding as if they are honest, reputable people when they are not willing to even put their name on their web site."

"If you want to expose anyone in this industry - Be a man and sign your name to your findings. Otherwise, without attributing, their findings are WORTHLESS because they do not have the balls to take credit for their work because they are hiding a hidden agenda."

"So, once again, we see support for a mysterious company attacking their competition and not signing their work."

---------------------------------------------------------------------

[trsent]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

Robert, have you Googled "Steve Koschal"? Have you ever heard the saying "consider the source?"

http://www.autographdealernews.com/Articles.aspx?article=20

I do not know who Autograph Dealer News is (a Las Vegas company) but I see they have a few stories on this link about Steve Koschal.

I do not mind if people bring attention to authentication issues in the industry if they are doing it honestly without an extra agenda.

For instance, I praise Robert and Rudy for work they have done on this site time and time again. I do not believe they can be looking to profit off their work like the folks at Autograph Alert can be accused of doing.

I am often confused why items from online auction catalogs from 3-5 years ago are now being read and old questionable items are being show up years and years after the original sale. This may lead us to see the online archives of some of these auction houses to disappear from their web site which doesn't help anyone.

[mvandor]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

Robert, have you Googled "Steve Koschal"? Have you ever heard the saying "consider the source?"

[trsent]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

so let's see if i've got this straight - all credibility is lost if the one pointing out issues not only chooses to post anonymously but also happens to be engaged in the same sort of business as the accused? is that right? can pretty much toss out anything such a person has to say? in fact, such folks are "scumbags"? is that what i'm hearing?

if i removed my name from my sig and began to deal in vintage football helmets, would everything i subsequently posted at the forum regarding bunk helmets appearing at auction be meaningless, lacking in credibility and merit? if i decided to write my own letters of opinion on the vintage helmets i sold, yet at the forum continued to point out issues i found with other letters of opinion that accompanied bunk helmets, would those posts represent nothing more than a transparent, hidden agenda?

lots of dealers/sellers on this very forum, guf members, who post regularly about issues they've found with game used items sold at auction. extremely informative posts detailing why they consider the items bunk - and many of these members choose not to share their identities. do they all have hidden agendas? is what they share meaningless, lacking in credibility? are they "scumbags"?

hey, i don't know the people from autographalert any more than i know vince lombardi, but like most adults i feel that i'm capable of deciding what to believe and what not to believe when it comes to items i read. further, i would imagine if autographalert was the baseless hit job some think it to be, it would have been shut down long ago instead of pumping out pieces as recently as this month. speaking of baseless hit jobs, joel had me rolling when he punctuated his condemnation of autographalert by offering the following: "They can keep selling opinions on eBay for $7.00 each..." - of course psa/dna sells opinions for $10 on their site...

...

Robert, your work on helmets is amazing, but don't give credit or praise anyone with a hidden agenda of attacking their competition and say everything they post is correct.

They post so many twists and lies it is unbelievable. Give them praise for attacking their competition.

eBay choose PSA/DNA to offer a quick opinion. I believe the charge is $7.99, but who cares? PSA/DNA doesn't have a hidden web site attacking other authenticators errors.

They all make errors in judgment, every one of them. While some people admit to their mistakes, I do not see Steve Korshal's name mentioned for his errors on this web site.

Odd, he has made so many mistakes over the years I figured he would be mentioned for his mistakes on this web site.

Oh wait - He owns the web site - Why should he reveal his errors - Just any other he can find.

you want to clean up the hobby but then you attack those who have been linked to more questionable dealings in the industry because you think their hidden agenda web site is credible.

Robert, keep up the great work you offer because it is really revolutionary, but think twice before you praise common criminals.

[aeneas01]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

so let's see if i've got this straight - all credibility is lost if the one pointing out issues not only chooses to post anonymously but also happens to be engaged in the same sort of business as the accused? is that right? can pretty much toss out anything such a person has to say? in fact, such folks are "scumbags"? is that what i'm hearing?

if i removed my name from my sig and began to deal in vintage football helmets, would everything i subsequently posted at the forum regarding bunk helmets appearing at auction be meaningless, lacking in credibility and merit? if i decided to write my own letters of opinion on the vintage helmets i sold, yet at the forum continued to point out issues i found with other letters of opinion that accompanied bunk helmets, would those posts represent nothing more than a transparent, hidden agenda?

lots of dealers/sellers on this very forum, guf members, who post regularly about issues they've found with game used items sold at auction. extremely informative posts detailing why they consider the items bunk - and many of these members choose not to share their identities. do they all have hidden agendas? is what they share meaningless, lacking in credibility? are they "scumbags"?

hey, i don't know the people from autographalert any more than i know vince lombardi, but like most adults i feel that i'm capable of deciding what to believe and what not to believe when it comes to items i read. further, i would imagine if autographalert was the baseless hit job some think it to be, it would have been shut down long ago instead of pumping out pieces as recently as this month. speaking of baseless hit jobs, joel had me rolling when he punctuated his condemnation of autographalert by offering the following: "They can keep selling opinions on eBay for $7.00 each..." - of course psa/dna sells opinions for $10 on their site...

...

[mvandor]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

Sir, I do not understand - They expose items that others have already supposedly exposed. They have no credibility and from contact I have received their past is suspect in the autograph industry.



Get over it - The Truth Hurts.

We've had our differences, Joel, but in this case we agree. I won't refute the mistakes they publish, but to ignore their motivation and agenda is simply being blind.

[trsent]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

[quote=sammy;138974]Joel,

If they were to sign their names for you, would it make any difference in regard to the items they expose?

A fake is a fake, and a forgery is a forgery.

quote]

They expose items that others have already supposedly exposed. They have no credibility and from contact I have received their past is suspect in the autograph industry.

They are scumbags with a hidden agenda I am here to reveal an honest case of bad apples playing games with their competition.

- The Truth Hurts.

[sammy]

Re: A 29.900.00 Worthless Piece Of Paper

Joel,

If they were to sign their names for you, would it make any difference in regard to the items they expose?

A fake is a fake, and a forgery is a forgery.