Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

[mvandor]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

Hate to be cynical, but how about this hypothetical scenario...UDA contacts PM and asks for his GU Helmet...PM asks the Equipment Manager for one of his helmets and one is made up and given to PM that wasn't actually worn by PM, while the Equipment Manager keeps the real one and from a Colts equipment accountability standpoint, everything adds up. PM and UDA have the understanding that it’s worn and document it as such, but in actuality, it wasn't....

Still doesn't explain the lack of the blue front bumper, you'd think ANY lid coming from the Colts locker room woulda had one, regardless of who used it (helmet shows some use).

That's the baffling part to me.

[kingjammy24]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

Hate to be cynical, but how about this hypothetical scenario...UDA contacts PM and asks for his GU Helmet...PM asks the Equipment Manager for one of his helmets and one is made up and given to PM that wasn't actually worn by PM, while the Equipment Manager keeps the real one and from a Colts equipment accountability standpoint, everything adds up. PM and UDA have the understanding that it’s worn and document it as such, but in actuality, it wasn't....

the assumption being that upper deck acquired the helmet directly from manning? that in itself may be a stretch. in acquiring game used items for its trading cards, upper deck purchases from the secondary market; dealers and auction houses. they may witness their autographs first hand but apparently when it comes to procuring game used items, the secondary market suits them fine. perhaps this helmet came from a dealer or auction house.

the upper deck letter states that the item "was legally procured according to the regular procedures instituted by Upper Deck for obtaining such items in the regular course of business. UPPER DECK MAKES NO OTHER REPRESENTATIONS OR WARRANTIES AND DISCLAIMS ANY IMPLIED WARRANTIES". a whole bunch of legalese that doesn't say much of anything other than the helmet wasn't stolen and was legally obtained. they make no mention of their "regular procedures" are in obtaining these items.

could be some dealer took upper deck for a ride. certainly wouldn't be the first time it's happened.

rudy.

[mvandor]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

BTW, I've learned to carefully read descriptions, the UD site lists this lid as:

This helmet used during the NFL season was autographed by Peyton Manning. Manning’s signature was witnessed by an Upper Deck Authenticated representative as part of UDA’s patented 5-step authentication process.This item is not limited.

Doesn't say used by Manning himself does it? Also, same wording in the print COA.

[suicide_squeeze]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

BTW, I've learned to carefully read descriptions, the UD site lists this lid as:

This helmet used during the NFL season was autographed by Peyton Manning. Manning’s signature was witnessed by an Upper Deck Authenticated representative as part of UDA’s patented 5-step authentication process.This item is not limited.

Doesn't say used by Manning himself does it? Also, same wording in the print COA.

Yes,

It was used by little Johnny in a touch football game in the neighborhood. When his dad came home and found his Upper Deck Authenticated signed Peyton Manning retail helmet missing from it's plexi-glass display case.......well, Johnny is still grounded!

[helmets]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

Helmets...I think this is what you're referring to. I took this pic from a helmet I own, and you can see that the older style Riddell rear bumper decal was cut and fitted to the Revolution style rear bumper. As you stated, the Revolution style rear bumpers were not made available until a year or two after...


[ATTACH]24861[/ATTACH]

Yes, that is what I was referring to.

Sorry Vandor, I meant "rear" not "read"
Yes, the front bumper should have the royal Riddell decal.

[suicide_squeeze]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

I just read the "Letter of Authenticity" that accompanies it from Upper Deck.

It states the following:


"Shawn Wilbur, an authorized representative of The Upper Deck Company, LLC ("Upper Deck") hereby certifies that the enclosed item, Peyton Manning Helmet used in an NFL game or practice is genuine and authentic to the best of his knowledge and belief; that the item was legally procurred according to the regular procedures instituted by Upper Deck for obtaining such items in the regular course of business. UPPER DECK MAKES NO OTHER REPRESENTATIONS OR WARRANTIES AND DISCLAIMS ANY IMPLIED WARRANTIES."


Um....I'm no attorney, but that can't be good.

First off, they are saying it could be from a practice (which would qualify it for the "during the NFL season". Not what you'd want to be paying a few thousand bucks for I gather.

Then that upper case last statement.....wow. All I can make out of that is that, whatever your thinking they are representing it as, it may or may not be, so if you find is isn't what you thought it was, tuff luck.

I wouldn't buy it because it doesn't appear to be what it's representing itself to be, and I would say shame on Upper Deck. They are better than that.

[beantown]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

If you don't like this one, there's always this one...

http://cgi.ebay.com/PEYTON-MANNING-GAME-USED-WORN-HELMET-UPPER-DECK-COA_W0QQitemZ130307189124QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item1e56e9e984&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A0%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

[helmets]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

If you don't like this one, there's always this one...

http://cgi.ebay.com/PEYTON-MANNING-G...3A1%7C294%3A50

This one is worse...

[TriplexXxSports]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

If you don't like this one, there's always this one...

http://cgi.ebay.com/PEYTON-MANNING-G...3A1%7C294%3A50

I like the legs behind the facemask shot. Think this was used as a selling boost for this proline?

[mvandor]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

This one is worse...

Why plse.

[jhunt28]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

What makes this helmet worse than the other one?? I'd like to hear the experts take...because to me, with a little wear and tear on the chinstrap lettering, I could be convinced that this was his. At least this has the correct facemask, front and back bumpers, shockblocker clips, and he did start wearing a blue "Riddell" on his low hookup Adams cup chinstrap in 2001. Obviously the 2003 part of the description is wrong, but I included a pic from November of 2001 (after Sept 2001, so the flag would be on the helmet). I find this helmet more believable than the previous Manning auction.

[TriplexXxSports]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

What makes this helmet worse than the other one?? I'd like to hear the experts take...because to me, with a little wear and tear on the chinstrap lettering, I could be convinced that this was his. At least this has the correct facemask, front and back bumpers, shockblocker clips, and he did start wearing a blue "Riddell" on his low hookup Adams cup chinstrap in 2001. Obviously the 2003 part of the description is wrong, but I included a pic from November of 2001 (after Sept 2001, so the flag would be on the helmet). I find this helmet more believable than the previous Manning auction.

The chinstrap on the auction helmet looks awfully 'new' to be a game worn.

This brings up a couple of questions...

1) If it was an actual Manning Gamer, then why did someone go through the trouble of putting the straps back in their 'retail' position?

2) Say someone did move the strap location, shouldn't there be evidence of where the straps were during its use by Manning?

Another thing that I noticed on the auction helmet is the location of the logo in relation to the earhole, as well as the white dot locations inside of the logo. I illustrated both of these points in the picture

IMO, Proline with add-on's to 'resemble' Manning's gamer...

[TriplexXxSports]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

Here is a better shot illustrating the logo placement......

[jhunt28]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

I'm not saying this is his helmet...but what I said was that this helmet is more believable to me than the first one. And I said "because to me, with a little wear and tear on the chinstrap lettering, I could be convinced that this was his". What I was trying to say is that in the right hands, you can easily get the chin strap in the right position, rub off the lettering a bit...Trust me, I am in total agreement with you with regards to the helmet. My only point was that I disagree that this helmet is less believable than the first one in this thread.

[helmets]

Re: Game Worn Peyton Manning Helmet?

Triple is on with the decal placement, but it is easier than drawing lines and alignment.

The Colts wear their decals - in most cases - with the bottom of the horseshoe touching the outside ridge of the earhole. Same with the positioning of the Steelers logo - in most cases.

You look at this "Manning" gamer and where the decals are positioned, and they are too high. Same with the "Bettis" helmet that suddenly got mixed up with another "Bettis" helmet, and then was not a "Bettis" helmet.

Look at the photos of Manning that XXX has posted and then look at the position of the decals on this "Gamer." When you look at a Proline, the deals are up where this UDA "gamer" has it's decals. Same with Proline Steelers.

When we customize helmets, we do not remove and relocate the decals. We simply add the different components to the helmet.

XXX is also correct on the buckle placement of the chinstrap. The placement of those buckles is from the Adams factory, and have never been adjusted. That chinstrap has not been worn, even by a player with a long chin like Manning...

No internal identifiers. No velcro for the communication. I thought the Riddell top clips were a problem, but I see that he did wear them on his helmet in 2001.

Facemask is from 2000. The flag was not worn on the helmet until 2001.
In 2002 Manning sported a Revolution "lid". In 2001 Manning finished the year I believe with the "injury style" custom facemask. So, was this an extra helmet from 2001 with poor decal placement, and the other mentioned problems that the equipment manager provided to Upper Deck? Or, does the owner have the original "gamer" and had a custom helmet made from an internet supplier with access to Adams chinstraps with Riddell printing, thin jawpads, decals, shockblockers and a JOP-SW in Seattle Blue.

If I had to guess, and I was not 100% sure, I'd save my money...