Probably a touchy subject...

[dscards]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

Really good question Dave.

For me, I would try and sign whenever I was approached politely and I had the time. As someone who has 'graphed since I was a kid, I know how a scribbled signature from a ballplayer can make someone's day. In the extra ten minutes it takes me to get home at night because I stopped to sign outside the park, I could make a lot of people happy. Also as a 'grapher, I know that adults autograph seekers aren't usually the scum of the earth like they're made out to be. Many are genuine fans who appreciate the autograph much more than a kid sticking a sharpie in the face of anyone in a uniform. (That said, I would absolutely make an effort to make sure every kid who wanted one left with an autograph.) I think I'm pretty good at picking out dealers and wouldn't mind saying "only one" to someone who gave me that vibe. I'd make sure all fan mail requests got signed, though I could see myself being one of the players who waited until the off-season to do the majority of it.
Would I have days when I'm not in a good mood/poor performance/life when I wouldn't feel like dealing with hordes of people? I'm sure. To say that I'd sign in every situation would be foolish. But, my general rule would be that if a fan was polite and respectful to me, I would be the same back and try to accommodate their autograph request.

[sox83cubs84]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

It's always an interesting exercise to try and figure out: if YOU were in the players' shoes, what would YOUR signing policies be? Most young people and hounds state without hesitation that they would sign for anyone who asked at anytime. Of course, if they were in agony with a kidney stone trying to hail a cab, or standing in the men's room taking a whizz, or being interrupted when conversing with a friend by a rude signature seeker, they may feel differently. (BTW, all three of those thing have happened at hotels or ballparks in Chicago, with the same guy guilty of the first and third instance).

For me, I WOULDN'T sign for anyone at anytime. I'd answer by-mail requests within reason, but I would not sign at my hotel (to me, an invasion of privacy) nor would I sign outside the park (too many dealers and hoarders). I WOULD, however, be willing to sign for as many fans as time allowed inside the stadium. IMHO, the people who buy tickets are supporting the game, and autograph signing is a way of showing appreciation for that support. The autograph dealers and hoarders and hotel invaders are usually seeking something for nothing. But, for a person who is willing to make the expenditure of buying a ticket, even if it's the cheapest in the house, to me that shows they care enough about the game to warrant attention and autographs. Sure, I know that some dealers and hoarders will buy tickets, too, but at that point they are financially supporting the game...whether or not they sold my autograph afterwards would not be important to me.

I'm curious what other GUU members would see themselves doing if they were the celebrities being asked?

Dave Miedema

[dscards]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

My personal 'graphing rule is that if I'm going to ask for multiples (more than putting two or 3 cards on a page), I'll get one signed and then go to the end of the line the player is signing for. When the player gets to me, I say "Mr. (whoever), you already signed one for me, but if you don't mind I have a few more cards I'd love if you'd sign". A few players have said "Only one" or "I already got you" and I know they would have signed for me had I not said anything, but the majority have no problem and a few have thanked me for being honest and waiting.

Kids can be incredibly rude. It's normally the kids/teenagers that make derogatory comments to players when they don't sign, and the majority of the pushing/shoving is done by younger graphers. I'm in my early 20s and have been graphing since I was 13ish. I was always the one there hours before and always had my research done. I was never pushed by an adult (though they often used their height to reach over me) but I was shoved around/budged in front of by other kids numerous times. Even caught a few kids trying to steal items out of my backpack after I had them signed. It always amazes me how many kids never got the memo on "Mr./Mrs." and "please/thank you".

Back to the original point of this thread...it does occasionally drive me crazy to see the pages of cards that get in front of players. I missed Josh Hamilton a few years back because a kid shoved his way in front of me and then put 9 cards in front of Josh. Josh left after signing the last one. But in my mind, it's the player's choice to sign 9 for 1 person instead of 1 for 9 people and I can't be unhappy about it.

[godwulf]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

Yeah, I can understand that perspective, and I think it's a valid one...as long as - and this is important - the player's time isn't so taken up by signing twelve cards for this dealer and fifteen cards for that dealer that the player's hand starts to cramp up, or it's time to go running off into the dugout or get in his car and go home, whatever, and the fan, kid or adult, with a single ball, photo or card is left standing there with nothing. I don't know whether you've seen this happen, but I certainly have - on numerous occasions. Sometimes I was one of the fans left with nothing.

As a player, I doubt that I would begrudge some guy the chance to make a few dollars on my autograph - especially not if I were a top prospect and was probably going to be earning a high six-figure salary (or more) in the Majors soon. As a fan, though, who enjoys getting the occasional autograph, I feel justified in resenting the half-dozen to ten guys with albums standing between me and the player, potentially taking up all of his time before he gets down to my spot in the line. Sure, some of those sigs are going to end up in the collections of folks who will never be able to get close enough to the player to get one in person - but what about all the fans who were close enough to get one, but weren't able to because the dealers took up all of the player's time?

[jake33]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

To play devil's advocate, this is a postive I see about dealers though.

When players get made about people selling their autograph, that is understandable, but the people who are buying it are actually fans who for whatever reason are unable to meet the player to get the autograph themselves. It isnt like it goes to someone who displikes the player.

Not the best middleman opperation, at all, but the autos will eventually get into a fan's hand.... in theory.

[godwulf]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

Okay, that's weird. Yeah, I guess that people who, themselves, don't buy and collect a thing would likely have some strange ideas about value. Like the folks who wouldn't think of listing ANY major league jersey for less than $199, and want a grand for a run-of-the-mill HR ball of some minor star.

Back on the subject of dealers, the more I think about it, the more I think that the players who have it right are the ones who, when somebody pushes an album page with twenty cards in their face, signs ONE CARD and moves on. I would certainly sign, graciously and whenever possible, when asked, but I would have to draw the line at providing some random stranger with a living, at the cost of having to ignore a lot of folks who simply wanted my autograph because they were fans.

[jake33]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

Godwolf, I have heard people over the years get some random auto on notebook paper and when the player leaves, he will ask the crowd of guys getting autographs, is he thinks it would be worth somewhere in the $10-$30 range. I have had this happen 3-4 times over the last couple years with 3-4 different people

[godwulf]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

...or casual fans that get a journeyman bullpen guy's autograph on a notecard and think it is worth $25.

I'm curious how you would know what a "casual fan" thinks his or her autos are worth. Sure, we all know people who have inflated notions of what the stuff they collect is worth to other people, but it usually doesn't become evident until they try to sell it on eBay, or at the card show.

Most of those people are autograph dealers who are dirtballs...

Speaking of dirtballs, I realized today that the guy who got the player to sign something like 80 cards at a Fall League game the other day (and it was Tony Wolters, not Meisenburger) was the son of the father-son team that I told the other story about...the dirtball auto dealers who pop up everywhere with the huge albums. So he was lying when he told the player that he was just "an obsessive collector" - like he was going to hoard all those identical signed cards.

[jake33]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

Thanks Dave, my issue is not really with the bratty kids at the cell, so much is it being a numbers game. A small crowd can be a pain to work around. Plus pitchers are often in the outfield and randomly move around, hitter are on schedule and overall just have a lo better luck at the team hotel.
Also in stadium autographs, are not as clean as what I pick up at the team hotel.

For getting Longoria, though, the cell is the best option.

[sox83cubs84]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

Jake:

I recall meeting you at US Cellular Field several years ago. It's got a small number of collectors, and virtually no one from the hotel crowd. Of course, there are the kids to deal with, but the ones I've seen are, for the most part, not bratty. If ticket prices for the Cell are a turnoff, email me privately, and I'll give you some advice to save a few bucks.

Dave Miedema

[jake33]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

The "what player is that "question, really does get old. So I, wanted to go about getting auto's in a better way and get away from someone's ugly kid or casual fans that get a journeyman bullpen guy's autograph on a notecard and think it is worth $25.

I collect an autograph card of every player who ever played in the majors for the Rays and I typically just go to the team hotel in Chicago 1 or 2 days each year and am able to get all players from the active roster, except Longoria who will onyl sign at the game. I take a vacation day at work during the weekday, as there isn't that many people out getting autographs on a Wednesday in April on a cold day.

Most of those people are autograph dealers who are dirtballs, but their is usually less than 7 total peopel getting autographs and no kids around, which is really nice. Also the signatures at team hotels are way better looking than stadium autos.

Also, anything that is not a GU jersey that I have that is GU m I try tog et signed by the player and have gotten tons of gu helmets, gu balls, gu bats, gu bases, gu locker plates, and gu batting glove signed by the team hotel, so that too is pretty nice.

[abstractheory]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

I get autographs sometimes at the stadium because quite frankly, I can't afford the 100+ dollar charge that the bigger players get. I only get signatures of HOF'ers or future HOF'ers.

I hear that. It can be very expensive. Especially if you add inscriptions, which most charge more for. That's why I'm very, VERY selective about which ones I get (e.g: HOF'ers and future HOF'ers, like you)

[sportsnbikes]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

I get autographs sometimes at the stadium because quite frankly, I can't afford the 100+ dollar charge that the bigger players get. I only get signatures of HOF'ers or future HOF'ers.

[godwulf]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

I saw something funny at a Fall League game yesterday. Some guy handed Brewers catching prospect Adam Weisenburger a big piece of cardboard with - I kid you not - about 80 cards on it. The player was stunned. He asked why the guy had that many of his cards, and the guy just said he was an obsessive collector - that he had over 900,000 signed cards. Weisenburger took this big piece of cardboard out to the third base line where his teammates were warming up, to show it to them. Then he came back, asked the guy if he was going to take him to dinner, and proceeded to sign all the cards. It was only funny, I think, because nobody else was waiting for Adam to sign. I've had a few players take a bat that I'd brought for them to sign and go show it to their teammates, but have never seen it done with cards.

[abstractheory]

Re: Probably a touchy subject...

First, let me say that I'm not a big signature seeker and only desire "big name" and/or "legends of the game" sigs. This is why I only get my sigs at shows or organized events. This avoids a couple things: First, you are paying for a guaranteed sig and, of course, a chance to meet the player. Second, a nice clean autograph, suitable for display. And, finally, an organized event where people are not shoving and cutting in line or feeling like they are "entitled", for whatever reason. That being said, these are the kind of places, I feel, are most conducive/optimal for adults to obtain autographs (not saying adults shouldn't try other routes, just saying it eliminates almost everything irritating listed above...Including uncontrolled kids)

As a collector, I would never, ever dream of waiting for players after a game or before a game (however it works) for an autograph because of the reasons outlined from previous posts. I would not only expect a huge number of children to be there in wait, but, I would also expect players to sign for them first (I know I would if I was a player). Like I said, I don't know how these things work in an unorganized fashion, but, is there even such a thing as a line in these situations, or, is it really, just who can get the attention of the player first? Either way, I'm not saying people (adults) shouldn't do this, or that it's just for kids, but know I couldn't/wouldn't want to compete for an autograph within a sea of children.

Anyway, I can see both points, being a man-child (wife's term ), myself and all, but, will only get autographs at organized/paid events. While I know this isn't always an option for a lot of players, I can't believe adults don't expect anything less at unorganized situations. Unfortunately, in today's world, I expect the worst behavior from people (kids and adults, alike); that way, I'm never surprised, nor disappointed.