1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

[joelsabi]

i have been researching hats for awhile trying to see if there is any way to date new era hats. i really need more examples but here is my research up to this point. i try to get exemplars of player hats of players who have played for a specific team for 2 or less seasons so that the taggging can be pinpointed for a specific year. if you can help me out with other examples that would be helpful and I can update my list. also this covers regular hats and not bp or and not special hats. adding bp hats to the research really confused the situation so i discounted them in my search.

if you have any examples that seems to refute my findings please mention this also. sometime what is observed is not what is happening and my conclusions maybe be wrong. maybe a tag was introduced +/1 a year. this is a work in progress and feedback is appreciated.

thanks for your help in advance. any feedback is appreciated.

[skier14]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

Great work on this!

It will be very helpful.

Thanks,
Dustin

[vballGuy]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

Wow, Joel! Great work.

I have 4 examples that may be of interest to you:

1. Rickey Henderson Blue Jays cap from 1993. As you know, he only played half of a season with the Jays, so this example can specifically be attributed to 1993. I have a MOS certificate for this, so provenance is excellent.

2. Dave Winfiedl cap from 1992. He only played once season with the Jays in 1992, so this can also be attributed to a specific year.

3. Jesse Barfield 1989 cap. The reason why I was able to date this cap was because this is the first year that the Jays wore the navy blue caps as road caps. As you know, Barfield was traded mid-season, so the only option would be if he wore it in 1989. I had Barfied personally inspect this cap when I met him a few weeks ago -- so I am confident in its provenance.

4. Shannon Stewart 2000-2001 cap. The only reason why I was able to date it was because it came with a cert from Authentic Sports Investments, and was dated in late 2001. The Jays only started wearing this style of alternate cap in 2000, so the only possibility is 2000-2001.

Check out my photos at:

http://sports.webshots.com/album/578047229aCaulX

I have a few spring training caps, no sure whether or not they will be useful to you. Looking at what you've compiled, all tagging matches up with my examples. The only question mark is my 1992 Winfield example.

Please let me know what you think. I can provide additional photos of the inner tagging, if necessary.

[vballGuy]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

I should also mention that my 1992 Winfield example matches up with detailed photos that I have analyzed in a 1992 Blue Jays season large-size book. In all examples that I have seen, the size tag is not how you have shown it in your 1988-1993 column, and not in the 1992 example that you described. I'm sure there was some variance amongst different teams, but just thought I'd mention it. I'd be happy to scan in some of the photos from my book as well.

[vballGuy]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

I should also mention that my 1992 Winfield example matches up with detailed photos that I have analyzed in a 1992 Blue Jays season large-size book. In all examples that I have seen, the size tag is not how you have shown it in your 1988-1993 column, and not in the 1992 example that you described. I'm sure there was some variance amongst different teams, but just thought I'd mention it. I'd be happy to scan in some of the photos from my book as well.

Sorry, I meant to say that it matches up well with the example shown in your 1988-1993 column and NOT in the 1992 example shown.

[sox83cubs84]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

Nice work, Joel. I had some of the basic parameters down on this for a few years, but you've highlighted details I was not aware of. Great work!

Dave Miedema

[joelsabi]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

I should also mention that my 1992 Winfield example matches up with detailed photos that I have analyzed in a 1992 Blue Jays season large-size book. In all examples that I have seen, the size tag is not how you have shown it in your 1988-1993 column, and not in the 1992 example that you described. I'm sure there was some variance amongst different teams, but just thought I'd mention it. I'd be happy to scan in some of the photos from my book as well.

Thanks on the reply. Your hats look like great examples that would assist in the research. If you can take photos of your 4 hats at an angle that I can read the tags, that would be helpful. Some of your tags are folded backwards too and I do not want to guess what tags they are.

The samples from the 1992 Blue Jays large size book are interesting to me too. Scans would be helpful. I am not sure why the Blue Jays would be interested in photographing the inside of the hats but I might find something useful.

On the size tag being different on the 1988-1993 than what you have seen, are the size tag you have seen look like the 1985-1987 or 1993-1996 version?
Do you think you can track down some example and I will look back on my example. I will note this down tho. Thanks.

Those borderline years were hard to determine. Could there be variances at the breakpoints? I imagine yes. Tags are tags and hat are hats. I am sure the manufacturers used up all tags even if new tags were introduced and equipment managers didn’t throw away surplus hats just because it was at the end of the season.

[joelsabi]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

Nice work, Joel. I had some of the basic parameters down on this for a few years, but you've highlighted details I was not aware of. Great work!

Dave Miedema

Thanks Dave,

Coming from an expert like yourself, that's quite a compliment.

[Rob L]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

Nice. Here is another that I have referred to:

http://ballcapblog.blogspot.com/2010/08/chronology-of-new-era-cap-tags.html

[sox83cubs84]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

It would be good to remember that, just as jerseys from previous years/tag styles sometimes get used in a later given year, the same holds true for caps. When at MEARS, I wrote up some 2003-04 Colorado Rockies caps with team LOAs. Most were tagged with the 1999-2001 labels.

Dave Miedema

[joelsabi]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

Nice. Here is another that I have referred to:

http://ballcapblog.blogspot.com/2010...-cap-tags.html

Thanks for the link. I will look to see how similar our findings were. I used some of your hats in my research. I pinpointed your Figgins cap to 2005 and I have checked several hats that had good provenance and had the white background on the tape and they are came up 2005 so I feel pretty confident it is not a coincidence.

[Rob L]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

Thanks for the link. I will look to see how similar our findings were. I used some of your hats in my research. I pinpointed your Figgins cap to 2005 and I have checked several hats that had good provenance and had the white background on the tape and they are came up 2005 so I feel pretty confident it is not a coincidence.

Awesome Joel. I'll be putting your thread link on mywebsite if that is cool with you.

[joelsabi]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

Awesome Joel. I'll be putting your thread link on mywebsite if that is cool with you.

Sure. Why not if you don't mind it still being in development.

[joelsabi]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

It would be good to remember that, just as jerseys from previous years/tag styles sometimes get used in a later given year, the same holds true for caps. When at MEARS, I wrote up some 2003-04 Colorado Rockies caps with team LOAs. Most were tagged with the 1999-2001 labels.

Dave Miedema

good point. carryover of tags would be common. i would not discount your cap as it comes in the previous tag period. Of course I would have concerns if it was two prior tag periods. remember it's one factor and it's very basic. cap size, provenance, and hat logo style match are more important imho.

[Rob L]

Re: 1983 to 2009 New Era Hat Tagging Primer

Thanks for the link. I will look to see how similar our findings were. I used some of your hats in my research. I pinpointed your Figgins cap to 2005 and I have checked several hats that had good provenance and had the white background on the tape and they are came up 2005 so I feel pretty confident it is not a coincidence.

Awesome Joel. I'll be putting your thread link on mywebsite if that is cool with you.