Tweet
Re: Fred Lynn Red Sox Jersey - Thoughts?
So, is anyone interested in purchasing this jersey?
So, is anyone interested in purchasing this jersey?
-
Rob L
loefflerrd@cox.net
Always On the Look Out for Troy Percival & Randy Johnson Gamers
Rob L's Baseball Memorabilia website: GU Troy Percival, GU Randy Johnson, GU Angels, GU Baseball, 19th Century Baseball and Autographs. Also a huge Game Used Resource page and Game Used Collectors Page: www.loefflerrd.webs.com -
Re: Fred Lynn Red Sox Jersey - Thoughts?
I am the original poster on this topic and yes, I PURCHASED this jersey yesterday!
I met Eric in person on two occasions had some very nice conversations about his collection, the provenance on this jersey along with other Red Sox jerseys and physically examined this jersey...I am comfortable with it.
Does it show the same amout of wear .vs the '75 in GF or the '76 in Lelands? No......but it does show wear. Moreover, I have been collecting Lynn Game Used Jerseys for quite some time...other than the '77 that is a size 42 and signed; "My Gamer"...this is the only other '77 I have personally seen on the memorabilia market.
I appreciate the information that Mr. Lon Lewis has provided directly to me and it aided in my decision to buy the jersey...all the Lynn jerseys I have in my collection are a size 44 and Mr. Lewis confirmed Lynn wore/ordered a size 44 during '75-'78. Here are some of my other Lynn jerseys from later in his career.
On one last note, Eric has offered to do something for me with this Lynn jersey...hopefully it will happen...if and when it does, I will post pictures...
ChrisAttached FilesComment
-
-
Re: Fred Lynn Red Sox Jersey - Thoughts?
Mr. Lewis you might want to go and read your post's.
Let me remind you what you said. As you state you never mention retail jerseys and borderless tags. First from 3/5 at 6:36 and then from 7:30 pm yesterday.
3/5 6:36
"Beantown, The blue border tags actually made their first appearance in 1974, and were in full production in 1975. Without getting into the legitimacy of the jersey shown, it should be noted that during the '70's and 80's anyone could obtain from McAuliffe/Stahl and Dean completely tagged jerseys of any of the teams that were produced by that company and after the '70's, those jerseys would as a general rule contain the borderless mfr tag"
3/16 7:30
" The only one who has said that the borderless tags are retail only is YOU and then you have tried to put that out there as my statement.
"Next, to really show how far out there you are, you want to see Fred Lynn jerseys that I FEEL are "retail"? I KNOW THEY'RE "RETAIL" THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE "RETAIL" THAT'S THE POINT OF THE WHOLE EXERCISE! Your last comment that the theory of the post was that the borderless tag equalled retail. The Original start of this thread was on the tag itself not what YOU turned it into with your absolute nonsense."
Are you sure you want to say that you did not say borderless are retails, or excuse me could be ordered by the public to use your terms.
Lon I have not misrepresented anything you said. Now you state that the borderless tag is not the way to tell the difference between a "retail" my term and a gamer and that it would be hard but not impossible to tell the difference?
Lets agree to disagree Lon as in the end all that's going to come of this is more questions than answers and we will be no better off then where we started.Comment
-
Re: Fred Lynn Red Sox Jersey - Thoughts?
Beantown...not to add more distractions to this thread, but I don't think that Orioles home/white of Lynn is good..maybe another post would be good for that subjectComment
-
Re: Fred Lynn Red Sox Jersey - Thoughts?
That would be intriguing. To me it seems there may be tagging on the inside of the front tail?? That's a solid clue to authenticity. Seen it before.Comment
-
Re: Fred Lynn Red Sox Jersey - Thoughts?
WOW.
And this, folks......is proof positive that you can lead a horse to water, lift him in the air with a harness and boom, tie him up in a manner so he can't move, turn him upside-down, and POUR THE FREAKING WATER DOWN HIS THROAT......and once you release the water-deprivated horse......he'll still spit it out! Good luck in your continued collection Chris. Something tells me you you are going to need luck.
Look, Bosox....you don't even know what Ron....I MEAN Lon!.....is going to come up with as back-up to his position. Essentially, you have completely and thoroughly dug the whole you have consciously chosen too....just to consummate a sale on this jersey. I truthfully honestly hope it works out to your (and Chris's) favor, as no one wants to see anybody crash and burn here. We are all here to help eachother.
That said, let's just hope it isn't that 6-foot deep kind of hole that would properly accomodate your coffin....because that limb your hanging from just snapped, and you're in a free fall.
For.....I don't know.......around 30 days or so?
The only question remaining is......are you a cat that will land on your feet, or will the plunge land you in that crater you dug?
Good luck to all involved. Glad I'm not.Comment
-
Re: Fred Lynn Red Sox Jersey - Thoughts?
Bosox, As is your typical m.o. you managed to take 2 seperate issues and combine them together in an effort to try and mislead people on them. First, where did you get the idea I said I never mentioned borderless tags? how else would you describe a tag with no border? Border omitted perhaps? What you've done is to leave off the other 2 words in the sentence which were "are retail' You know the part when I said I I didn't use the words "fake", "retail"' and "borderless tags are retail" and we were then on your post threatening to publish our emails of 3/5. Which if you note I told you to go ahead and publish them to whoever you want as long as you published the exact email. I WAS RESPONDING TO THAT ISSUE/POST. Now you bring up an entirely different post/ comment with the "They're supposed to be retail" part, again I was responding in YOUR TERMS to your ridiculous comments on a totally different post and subject. I'd suggest that you stop trying to intentionally post my comments out of context to prove some untenable position on your part. The fact that you've aparently sold the jersey that started all of this, to a person who feels comfortable and in an ironic twist, appears to be crediting me with helping him to make his decision. The fact that I didn't even call your jersey into question here seems to have escaped you. In the end, that should be good enough for you.Comment
-
Re: Fred Lynn Red Sox Jersey - Thoughts?
The End . . . .Comment
-
Re: Fred Lynn Red Sox Jersey - Thoughts?
there's a world of difference between saying retail jerseys had borderless tags and saying ONLY retail jerseys had ONLY borderless tags. that difference seems to have escaped eric. lon said the former, he never said the latter.
as for lon's statement that in the 80s they public received borderless tags, the public were the only ones receiving any mcauliffe jerseys in the 80s as mcauliffe stopped supplying the majors after 1980 so every shirt after that would necessarily be considered "retail" regardless of any borders.
re: concurrence
it seems to me that BOTH bordered and borderless tags were used concurrently during the 70s.
aside from that, at this point, i'm failing to see how or why this is even an issue of border vs borderless. from lon's words, i see that he said that mcauliffe made no differentiation between retail and pro tagging, meaning that mcauliffe didn't use ONLY borderless tags to indicate retail jerseys ONLY. "the wrong size and the borderless tag is the first sign the jersey may be an aftermarket jersey."
the only salient points in this entire thing are:
1) mcauliffe tagged all levels of their baseball shirts - pro, minor league, high school, etc., the same way.
2) stall & dean sold mcauliffe shirts to the public. eric doubts this and i believe that's what lon is gearing up to show.
[i believe that in order to qualify as a "retail" shirt, a shirt doesn't necessarily need to be sold in stores in per se. if a non-MLB entity can call up a mfr and order a shirt, then that shirt ought qualify as a "retail' shirt, regardless of how close the shirt is to the pro version. you can call it a "pro cut" but pro cuts are still considered retail shirts. simply because a shirt wasn't distributed to major retail chains doesn't mean it wasn't available for retail sale]
3) these shirts, sold to the public, were tagged in the same way as the shirts delivered to major leaguers.
given those 3 issues, extra care would be needed to discern a yaz shirt ordered by joe q. public, for example, and a yaz gamer. size and use would be helpful factors. "..if you knew the correct size - presto, instant game jersey".
if stall & dean were selling these shirts in the 70s and the bordered tag was in full production by 1975 and if S&D/mcauliffe made no hard distinction between retail and pro then doesn't that mean that the public could also receive bordered shirts in the 70s?
in my mind, this entire thing doesn't appear to be about borders at all but rather the fact that the public had access to the same shirts as the pros.
rudy.Comment
-
Re: Fred Lynn Red Sox Jersey - Thoughts?
Chris AKA beantown, can you email me? I have a question completely unrelated to this thread I wanted to ask you. Thanks.Comment
-
Re: Fred Lynn Red Sox Jersey - Thoughts?
Am I the only one who read Lon's initial post in which he said that blue bordered tags were in full swing by 1975? That is what caused this whole issue Lon stating that post 1975 jerseys were blue bordered. Lon can back track make different statements every time I point out his contradictions. Everything I have posted has been taken directly from this board, Lon's own words.
Now Mr. Lewis stated yesterday without knowing the source of jerseys he considers to be retail he would have a hard time telling the difference between a retail and a gamer. Then he states you can't go about evaluating the jerseys in the normal way? What new method will be used?
Lon did question the Lynn Jersey by stating that post 75 gamers had the blue border now he has back tracked on that and said that even a retail can have the blue border.
Bottom line is because Mr. Lewis is a long time veteran of the hobby he is consider to be a good source and because the board does not know me I am questioned.
He has created more questions than answers, not once have I made a mean comment towards him, however he references Back to the Future and tells me to get off my lazzy ass. Mr. Lewis has only been asked to clarify his statements regarding the border issue which he still has yet to do.
suicide_squeeze your comments towards beantown are cruel and just down right wrong. You have no clue as to the extent of research beantown has done regarding his vast collection and what items are in it. It is a very impressive collection. He does not need luck in his collecting.
In regards to me I am not hanging on any limb waiting to fall. I have been at the forefront of trying to get an answer on the issue. If I am dangeling from a limb so is Dave M, Mears, and every auction house from Lelands, AMI, Robert Edwards, as all have evaluated and sold borderless post 75 jerseys as gamers.
Finally in regards to the sale of the shirt it does not mean a thing to me one way or the other, I brought other gamers from my large collection to show beantown and was only parting with the Lynn to ad some WS bats to my collection and because it was going to a hugh Lynn fan.
This topic has spun out of controll because Mr. Lewis has not clearified his statements regarding the tagging issue and exactly what a post 75 no blue border means to him.Comment
Comment