Auction House Strategy

[G1X]

Re: Auction House Strategy

Ken, auctions with a 15-minute rule like yours make me a passive bidder. Even with a 3 a.m. hard close, I'd remain a passive bidder. By passive bidder, I mean I'll place a bid and go to bed (and assume that when I wake up the next day, I'll have been outbid). I'm looking forward to Heritage's auction this coming Friday because I'm bidding on six lots that close individually. Not only will I know what I've won and lost before bedtime, but I'll be an active bidder. I'll be on my computer, following each lot, bidding appropriately, and changing my strategy as bidding activity progresses. If one lot gets out of my price range, then I'll throw my resources elsewhere and increase my odds of winning other lots.

This isn't just beneficial to me as a bidder, but I believe it can help consignors. Consider this scenario: In your auction, I'd bid $1,000 on six lots and go to bed. All six could sell for $1,100. If I'm actively bidding, I might bail out on four lots when they hit a grand... but, I might spend $1,600 or more on the two lots I ultimately target. So, two bidders stand to earn $500 more each because I was an active bidder able to reallocate my spend. It's fair to ask, "Why not place $1,600 max bids on all six lots, go to bed and take your chances?" Well, if I somehow won all six, that would blow my budget out of the water. By being an active bidder, I can get aggressive on certain lots and stay within my overall budget.

All of this is a long way of agreeing with Mark. A 3 a.m. hard close, to me, is no different than keeping the entire auction open until no lot receives a bid.

Oh my, Jeff, you stated it much better than me. I wish that I had seen your post before I posted a moment ago. You hit the nail on the head, especially with regards to being a passive bidder and the examples you gave. That's my exact same sentiment, and it is something I hear directly from other collectors whenever the subject of auctions is discussed. Well said, indeed!

Mark Hayne
Gridiron Exchange

[G1X]

Re: Auction House Strategy

WHAT ABOUT A HARD AUCTION CLOSE OF 3 AM?
if 15 minute clock expires, auction is over.
however, if that does NOT HAPPEN, no matter how busy auction is, there is a 'hard close' at 3 am.
this allows anyone to log in at 255 and protect their lot if they want to, and takes away uncertainty
thoughts?

Ken,

But nothing really changes for the most part, especially for us poor souls east of the Mississippi River, and probably for many in the Western time zones as well. It's more about the time of day (er, night) that the auction closes. I would think that 2, 3, or 4 a.m. is simply not a reasonable hour for most folks, especially if they have somewhere they need to go in the morning. Please reference the third paragraph of my previous post.

No offense to Goldin Auctions - they appear to be one of the best around - or any other auction house that ends the entire auction at one time, but I find myself spending most of my limited funds with those auction houses that end on a "lot-by-lot" basis. It is a much easier format to deal with and "user friendly" with regards to my bidding habits, it is much less time consuming, and the bidding typically ends at a reasonable hour. And when it comes time to consign, I will most likely deal with those same auction houses assuming that I have built up a trust and comfort level with them.

Mark Hayne
Gridiron Exchange

[Birdbats]

Re: Auction House Strategy

Ken, auctions with a 15-minute rule like yours make me a passive bidder. Even with a 3 a.m. hard close, I'd remain a passive bidder. By passive bidder, I mean I'll place a bid and go to bed (and assume that when I wake up the next day, I'll have been outbid). I'm looking forward to Heritage's auction this coming Friday because I'm bidding on six lots that close individually. Not only will I know what I've won and lost before bedtime, but I'll be an active bidder. I'll be on my computer, following each lot, bidding appropriately, and changing my strategy as bidding activity progresses. If one lot gets out of my price range, then I'll throw my resources elsewhere and increase my odds of winning other lots.

This isn't just beneficial to me as a bidder, but I believe it can help consignors. Consider this scenario: In your auction, I'd bid $1,000 on six lots and go to bed. All six could sell for $1,100. If I'm actively bidding, I might bail out on four lots when they hit a grand... but, I might spend $1,600 or more on the two lots I ultimately target. So, two bidders stand to earn $500 more each because I was an active bidder able to reallocate my spend. It's fair to ask, "Why not place $1,600 max bids on all six lots, go to bed and take your chances?" Well, if I somehow won all six, that would blow my budget out of the water. By being an active bidder, I can get aggressive on certain lots and stay within my overall budget.

All of this is a long way of agreeing with Mark. A 3 a.m. hard close, to me, is no different than keeping the entire auction open until no lot receives a bid.

[nevrdiez34]

Re: Auction House Strategy

WHAT ABOUT A HARD AUCTION CLOSE OF 3 AM?
if 15 minute clock expires, auction is over.
however, if that does NOT HAPPEN, no matter how busy auction is, there is a 'hard close' at 3 am.
this allows anyone to log in at 255 and protect their lot if they want to, and takes away uncertainty
thoughts?

In my opinion that is ideal.

[KGoldin]

Re: Auction House Strategy

WHAT ABOUT A HARD AUCTION CLOSE OF 3 AM?
if 15 minute clock expires, auction is over.
however, if that does NOT HAPPEN, no matter how busy auction is, there is a 'hard close' at 3 am.
this allows anyone to log in at 255 and protect their lot if they want to, and takes away uncertainty
thoughts?

[G1X]

Re: Auction House Strategy

Ok
What's a reasonable hour, and whTs a better suggestion
Before someone says " lot by lot" I will tell you that in a large 1500 lot auction that is ruled OUT
2 reasons
1 majority of my Consignors do not want it
2 I have some people that bid on over 50! Lots, some over 100 lots
I have had people win 50+ lots on same auction
It is mathematically impossible for them to keep up with bids if lot by lot

However, I am looking for positive suggestions
Each of the last three auctions I have closed earlier, even if marginally so.
In the babe Ruth auction a smaller one I. Put a 1 am mandatory close on
I am open to suggestions...
Fire away

Ken,

Why not try lot-by-lot closing to see how it works? Some of the other successful auction companies (MLB Auctions, NFL Auctions, Hunt Auctions, Heritage Auctions, MEARS, etc.) don't seem to have a problem with it. While I understand your desire to please your consignors and maximize both their profits and yours, buyers are just as important (if not more so) part of the auction process. It takes all 3 parties to make an auction work.

As for a buyer juggling a number of items that have the potential of closing at the same time, I have personally found that it is much easier to keep up with items when the lots close one-by-one. There are ways that a bidder can control that issue as anyone who bids on MLB or NFL auction has probably witnessed. I am certainly not going to tip off this "trade secret", but I would guess that many collectors are probably aware of how to space out the closing times as a bidder to prevent everything they are bidding on from closing at the same time.

If you are not going to close on a lot-by-lot basis, at least change the initial closing time so that the extended bidding ends at a more reasonable hour. I would guess that the largest percentage of your bidders live in the Eastern and Central time zones, yet those are the ones suffering the most. West Coast bidders are 3 hours behind (the midnight hour is much more palatable than 3:00 a.m. or later for us East Coast bidders), your European bidders are currently seeing a wonderful closing time of early to mid-morning, Pacific Rim bidders are seeing a late afternoon closing, and our friends in Hawaii are looking at a very nice closing time during the evening hours.

It is certainly not my place to tell you how to run your business, but since you asked, I have shared my candid observations. Try a lot-by-lot closing once and see how it works. You might be pleasantly surprised!

Regards,

Mark Hayne
Gridiron Exchange

[BirdsOnBat]

Re: Auction House Strategy

I always calculate what I would be willing to spend + hammer and when I get sleepy I just punch it in and go to bed. With Goldin's good reputation I know the bid won't be auto-bid up by shills so I can rest easy and if someone wants to pay more, so be it. They deserve it. My $0.02

[ousooner_85]

Re: Auction House Strategy

Personally, I'm not staying up into the early morning hours to see if I'm still the high bidder on an item. There have been numerous items that I would have continued to bid on if outbid in a reasonable amount of time. I prefer some sort of per item time limit, my participation in bidding is increased and my interest level remains fixed.

I would have to do a little research but my percentage of auctions won, bids placed on items, etc. is considerably greater with time limit lots and auctions.

[GoCrazyFolks76]

Re: Auction House Strategy

Ken,

If 15 minutes isn't enough time for your big time bidders, then what about 30 minutes? 30 minutes should be plenty of time to go through their 50+ bids to make sure they are still top bidders using your 'my account' page.

As far as your consignors, I would think they would be more interested in people getting into bidding wars earlier in the evening rather than somebody sniping at the last minute forcing a potential bidder to miss out because it's 4:30 in the morning and that bidder is fast asleep.

Just my 2 cents.

[yanks12025]

Re: Auction House Strategy

Ok
What's a reasonable hour, and whTs a better suggestion
Before someone says " lot by lot" I will tell you that in a large 1500 lot auction that is ruled OUT
2 reasons
1 majority of my Consignors do not want it
2 I have some people that bid on over 50! Lots, some over 100 lots
I have had people win 50+ lots on same auction
It is mathematically impossible for them to keep up with bids if lot by lot

However, I am looking for positive suggestions
Each of the last three auctions I have closed earlier, even if marginally so.
In the babe Ruth auction a smaller one I. Put a 1 am mandatory close on
I am open to suggestions...
Fire away

Is it possible to have 2 different close times. You do the 15 minute rule for the whole auction but if theres zero action on a item for say 2 hours, then that item ends. But I'm not sure if that is possible with auction software.

[KGoldin]

Re: Auction House Strategy

Ok
What's a reasonable hour, and whTs a better suggestion
Before someone says " lot by lot" I will tell you that in a large 1500 lot auction that is ruled OUT
2 reasons
1 majority of my Consignors do not want it
2 I have some people that bid on over 50! Lots, some over 100 lots
I have had people win 50+ lots on same auction
It is mathematically impossible for them to keep up with bids if lot by lot

However, I am looking for positive suggestions
Each of the last three auctions I have closed earlier, even if marginally so.
In the babe Ruth auction a smaller one I. Put a 1 am mandatory close on
I am open to suggestions...
Fire away

[yanks12025]

Re: Auction House Strategy

What'd you get outbid on late? You had a contest cert to use in this auction?

Pro model bat but pretty sure it was game used and they didn't list it as game used. And no I didn't have the contest thing, I didn't participate this time.

[ivo610]

Re: Auction House Strategy

I think there was a more recent conversation about this when a Goldin Auction went ridiculously long. My opinion I do not like the whole letting each auction get an extra 15minutes because one got a bid. I too think every auction be separate. The only reason I don't like the "just put your highest bid and go to bed" idea is because sometimes you can only afford one item and are interested in two. If you have to put in your highest bid while both are still open you have to commit to just one item since you can't get both. If the item you bid on goes over your budget and the second one didn't go over what you would have paid you are stuck getting nothing.

100% agree! Its annoying you have to limit yourself to one item bc of the bidding rules are insane. I got outbid at 3 am last night, I dont get too excited about auctions that last until some ungodly hour. Its fine though, the money I would have spent at last nights auction is going to go toward an auction that ends this week in a per lot way.

[gorilla777]

Re: Auction House Strategy

What'd you get outbid on late? You had a contest cert to use in this auction?

[yanks12025]

Re: Auction House Strategy

Auction houses really have to fix the way they end their auction and the stupid 15 minute rule. I don't think its really fair when you're winning a item for over 6 hours in extended bidding and no other bids during that time but then get out bid and the auction closes 20 minutes later.